Feeling like I'm on a capitalist treadmill

[SO1]

I think the question you need to ask yourself is how would you feel about being a single parent.

5 of my uni friends had children 3 of us didn't. Out of the 5 that had kids 3 of them had partners who left them. 1 in 3 relationships fail. One left his wife when she was pregnant with her 2nd child, meet someone else at work, one left not long after birth of child, and 3rd left when children were very young. The 2 that remained with their partners gave up full time to devote to childcare and home making until the children were in secondary school. I think this meant they were less tired as not trying to balance work and childcare which meant that they could actually have quality time with their husbands and children. They gave up work as childcare was costing for 2 kids was nearly £2000 a month.

If want children you should go for it before 35 although 2 of my friends had.children when 40 there is no guarantee.

If you want it all including horse one of you will need to work on your career to up their salary so you can either pay for childcare or horse care unless you have family willing to set up and help you.

At least one parent has to really enjoy spending with the child otherwise there is no point in having them other than they might look after you in old age.

I don't have kids and am nearly 50. I know other friends without them who did not meet the right person at the right time and did not want the risk of being a single parent or having an unhappy relationship by having a child with the wrong person. Society has changed there are more women and we can have careers so are no reliant on being a mother in order to support ourselves. The day when it was very hard for a women to get and job and live independently are gone though society does look down on childless women somewhat still.

A male friend of mine who has been with his partner over 20 years says he feels that people look at him as a failure as he does not have children despite having a great relationship, a fantastic job and owning a great property.

A know a lot of women on here say they are not maternal but I do wonder why horses is such a female dominated hobby. Maybe our maternal hormones were misdirected and the caring nuturing element of horse satifises that in some respect.

My pony is not a replacement for a child but I do have feelings of love and commitment towards him and want the best for him.

I would however allow yourselves a couple of years to enjoy your property before having a child and also get married before doing so. If your relationship fails and you are married you have more rights - as someone once said to me the only reason to get married is if you think you might need to get divorced and have kids.

 

[Arzada]

Not stellar but OK

Your journey sounds impressively stellar to me.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

That's fine for everyone who wants kids but everyone who doesn't is paying a huge amount of tax so other people can. That doesn't seem very fair to me.

The last time I saw a figure it was that 25%of people are now child free by choice, this isn't a small minority.

ETA yes I know our crazy state pension system collapses unless we bring in or give birth to new workers!
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We all pay for things that we don't use through taxation.We have to decide,as a society,on our priorities. Paying for parental leave is well worth it imo, in order to encourage children to develop healthy attachments, which in turn means that fewer children experience MH problems, get involved in gang culture and other criminality.

 

[Deltofe2493]

It sounds like you’re very committed to your job, and that is admirable, but it also sounds like you feel money is driving you at the moment - hence the treadmill.

I think you need to be honest with yourself about how important working in this field is to you, and consider getting a better paid job.

I have previously worked in roles which were significantly underpaid against the market (NHS) because it mattered to me ethically. I didn’t feel limited for one second because I had consciously chosen to take a lower paid job for personal reasons.

If your chosen career isn’t delivering on meaning, and you’re frustrated by the treadmill even in a career you thought you’d love, then I’d seriously think about taking a better paid job to allow you to enjoy your hobbies more.

I may be wrong but I feel like the more you get paid, more responsibilities at work, less time/ flexibility to enjoy your hobbies.

company is global and my manager works round the clock 24/7, all executive leaders contacting her at all hours. seeing emails come in Friday through to Sunday. I don’t know how much she gets paid but I assume very well as shes able to send her daughter to private school.

I like my job, and tbf it’s not that it doesn’t pay enough, because if I didn’t have the horse I would be comfortable financially and then be able to start a family etc.

It’s very sad that the average salary in the UK is £28k. On the news I saw the other day inflation has risen so much that although we get slight pay rises every year, we’re being paid £5 less in comparison as the cost of living has risen so much.

my question was how do people afford horses and children and keep up their careers to be able to pay for this kind of lifestyle. Time and money wise!

 

[Deltofe2493]

I can’t find it but someone on this thread said how many horsey people aren’t maternal but then have so much love and care for their animals.

I think the difference is with horses or most animals they are a form of therapy and an escape. Even friends and family who aren’t horsey love coming to the yard and just being round these magnificent creatures who are so gentle and kind (most of the time). It’s good exercise and you get a lot of fresh air.

whereas children are stressful, they’re around 24/7. You can’t just leave them in a field to fend for themselves because baby humans are stupid.

 

[LadyGascoyne]

I may be wrong but I feel like the more you get paid, more responsibilities at work, less time/ flexibility to enjoy your hobbies.

company is global and my manager works round the clock 24/7, all executive leaders contacting her at all hours. seeing emails come in Friday through to Sunday. I don’t know how much she gets paid but I assume very well as shes able to send her daughter to private school.

It is true in some cases, and depending how you structure your working day. You might not need to do the extra hours at the pub.

There is a lot of space between £35k and executive responsibilities with executive level pay. You may well be able to get a job that pays more for equal or only slightly more responsibility if you looked at options in slightly different areas.

 

[Deltofe2493]

It is true in some cases, and depending how you structure your working day. You might not need to do the extra hours at the pub.

There is a lot of space between £35k and executive responsibilities with executive level pay. You may well be able to get a job that pays more for equal or only slightly more responsibility if you looked at options in slightly different areas.

well. I tried quitting the pub job so I could spend time focusing on career but OH parents wouldn’t have it as they see him go to work, do private work & work weekends. They said they saw me do this do that see horse etc. He’s out working so I should be out too ? ironically the only time this would change is if I was producing a baby and couldn’t physically work!

 

[Arzada]

well. I tried quitting the pub job so I could spend time focusing on career but OH parents wouldn’t have it as they see him go to work, do private work & work weekends. They said they saw me do this do that see horse etc. He’s out working so I should be out too ? ironically the only time this would change is if I was producing a baby and couldn’t physically work!

Are these the parents that you are living with? If so I'd be doing everything possible to get away bring forward the house purchase. Have you seen an independent mortgage advisor? It's possible that you could purchase earlier with their product knowledge and advice.

 

[teddypops]

I can’t find it but someone on this thread said how many horsey people aren’t maternal but then have so much love and care for their animals.

I think the difference is with horses or most animals they are a form of therapy and an escape. Even friends and family who aren’t horsey love coming to the yard and just being round these magnificent creatures who are so gentle and kind (most of the time). It’s good exercise and you get a lot of fresh air.

whereas children are stressful, they’re around 24/7. You can’t just leave them in a field to fend for themselves because baby humans are stupid.

My horses have cause me a lot more stress than my son ever did!

 

[LadyGascoyne]

well. I tried quitting the pub job so I could spend time focusing on career but OH parents wouldn’t have it as they see him go to work, do private work & work weekends. They said they saw me do this do that see horse etc. He’s out working so I should be out too ? ironically the only time this would change is if I was producing a baby and couldn’t physically work!

I have to say, I’d see this as a significant issue and that alone would motivate me to get some distance from them. While you are in their house, I am sure it is difficult but other people dictating how you structure your career and income isn’t going to help you to feel in control of the situation rather than on a treadmill.

I think I replied too quickly to you because you added a bit here I missed so I’ll try to answer.

I like my job, and tbf it’s not that it doesn’t pay enough, because if I didn’t have the horse I would be comfortable financially and then be able to start a family etc.

It’s very sad that the average salary in the UK is £28k. On the news I saw the other day inflation has risen so much that although we get slight pay rises every year, we’re being paid £5 less in comparison as the cost of living has risen so much.

my question was how do people afford horses and children and keep up their careers to be able to pay for this kind of lifestyle. Time and money wise!

My honest answer to that is that the average person cannot afford a horse, so an average salary is unlikely to be able to afford you a horse, competitions, a house and children all at the same time. And especially factoring in the South East where the average salary is closer to £34k.

I would be changing the job to increase the salary or reconsidering my priorities.

 

[teddypops]

well. I tried quitting the pub job so I could spend time focusing on career but OH parents wouldn’t have it as they see him go to work, do private work & work weekends. They said they saw me do this do that see horse etc. He’s out working so I should be out too ? ironically the only time this would change is if I was producing a baby and couldn’t physically work!

It really has nothing to do with them at all. I’m horrified to think they think they can control you!

 

[conniegirl]

There is a lot of space between £35k and executive responsibilities with executive level pay. You may well be able to get a job that pays more for equal or only slightly more responsibility if you looked at options in slightly different areas.

This, i’m on a fair bit more than £35k, i an expected to turn my laptop and work phone off as i leave work. I am not expected to interrupt my family time for work.

My boss is the highest you can go before you get to European director level. She too turns her phone off as she leaves work. There is the odd day where she is in an hour longer than the rest of us, normally so she can have a meeting with someone in an awkward time zone.
myself and the rest of her team have her private number incase of a sunday emergency that means we won’t be in on monday but it is not to be used for anything else.

 

[Deltofe2493]

@teddypops @LadyGascoyne @Arzada yep!!! Get away definitely being the term used!

have spoke to a mortgage advisor and it is possible however other half has his final set of his fun car payments finishing in august so he will be a few hundred quid heavier, we will hopefully have a bigger deposit so monthly payments will be less, and also looks better to banks if there isn’t that bill going through his account.

I do understand where they’re coming from as I’m in their house cheap rent etc but they’re not career minded in the slightest. Dad is caretaker of a small school, and mum is operations supervisor for a travel company. Both been in the same job for years.

their children are their lives, they see work as work, it’s not their ‘career’ that they’ve studied for. Which is fine, as that’s their life and their choice but I have a really fun job and I know I’m not putting in the 110% I know I should be because I’ve got so many other bits going on. ETA not a complete failure btw, had my annual review the other week and boss was pleased and said I was meeting expectations things to improve on, but I know I can do better and put in more time I just don’t feel motivated on a Monday just having Sunday to recuperate. Especially if I’m at a show on a Sunday it’s a lack of sleep and no bloody lay in for me!

Trying to explain to parents the scale of events I do and the level of input and energy it requires. Writing this as I am on a flight to Portugal to help run a huge scale conference for a week. Yes I worked last night. Yes I worked yesterday. And yes I was up at the yard 7am yesterday to school horsey. When I write it down it actually sounds insane lol.

My old boss has offered me some gentle pa work as she also hates me working in the pub. (She’s married to a multi millionaire so she doesn’t really need me, just doing it to help me out and look good when she needs emails being sent). So I’m considering doing that as she has said it will be as and when.

 

[ycbm]

A know a lot of women on here say they are not maternal but I do wonder why horses is such a female dominated hobby. Maybe our maternal hormones were misdirected and the caring nuturing element of horse satifises that in some respect.

In the past, I've felt that it was the opposite. That little girls were attracted to ponies because it's one activity where its perfectly OK for them to be dirty, competitive, and boss somebody around. When I was growing up those things were frowned on in female children everywhere except a stable yard.
.

 

[Marigold4]

In the past, I've felt that it was the opposite. That little girls were attracted to ponies because it's one activity where its perfectly OK for them to be dirty, competitive, and boss somebody around. When I was growing up those things were frowned on in female children everywhere except a stable yard.
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Agreed - and dangerous!

 

[wills_91]

It always astounds me when people think life will return to normal/be immensely easier when baby is born.

On an average salary (dependant on where you live) I think it is almost impossible to have it all unless you have a very supportive family around you. In 2 years we paid over 12k in child care costs to allow me to work part time. We don't have family support around us and every minute I wasn't at work my youngest was with me. We've recently taken a pony on share 2/3 days a week and I'm finding it hard to fit it all in - the housework is lacking ?

 

[throwawayaccount]

sometimes I have moments where I think about starting a family, but I'm not prepared to

a. give up my horsey lifestyle,
b. bring a child into the world being how it is at present.

I simply couldn't afford to have a child and horses. even if I could, there'd be no time for horses anymore.. your whole life changes drastically, the child becomes your no.1 and even with plenty of support around you, its still difficult to maintain horses as a hobby; I commend anyone who is able to as I certainly would struggle,

I feel its impossible to have everything and something has to give; I suppose if I was dead-set on starting a family I'd be making all the changes in my life to do so. I'd want the child/ren to have a comfortable lifestyle and for there to be no financial worries; I'd want them to learn the things I was never taught, rather than throw what I never had at them

(I've not read the whole thread, so just throwing my thoughts into a reply!) x

 

[Winters100]

I think the question you need to ask yourself is how would you feel about being a single parent.

.

This is a really good point, for both parents. I don't think you have to believe that you would love if, but at least be confident that you could cope. My OH has told me that he never even considered the possibility, but after the death of his wife he was left with 3 children to raise alone. Most single parent families are the result of the father leaving, so he really never thought that he would be a single parent. I do not think that we should be too caught up in thinking about every bleak possibility, but it is worth a thought - 'would i manage if.....'

 

[Annagain]

I'm not normally one to say this (especially as I don't have and have never wanted kids) but the more I read from you OP, the more I think something (other than moving out of your in-laws asap) has to give and sadly the only thing that can give at the moment is the horse. I don't mean straight away and certainly not forever but if you really want a baby that's the only thing that can change to make it less of a financial struggle.

I really feel for you. I don't know how young people manage in the South East these days. About 20 years ago, for a while, OH lived and worked in Reading and was going to buy a house there, while I had my house back home. He could just afford to buy a tiny two bed house (with a small amount of deposit help from his parents) on his own. In the end he decide he'd rather focus on getting transferred to live with me permanently so it didn't happen but it was doable. These days it would be really difficult to afford the same house on two salaries.

The fact you and your partner are both doing so much to get the funds you need worries me as it's not sustainable long term, kids or no kids. If your rent is £200 and you're saving £400 a month for the deposit, you're effectively paying £600 a month on housing costs. That's not a huge amount but you still need the two jobs (as does OH) to afford it. How will you afford a mortgage and child care with one? The £600 a month you're spending on livery is the gap, unfortunately.

Oh and your in laws need to do one - as long as you and your partner are paying your rent and the agreed amount into savings every month, how those contributions are split, how you earn the money and what you do with the rest of it is non of their business. It sounds like your partner has outgoings that aren't strictly necessary in the shape of his fancy car too so they can't complain about the horse. That's the one thing that would make me say do everything you can to keep her so they don't 'win' but I'm that petty

I've never wanted kids but just very occasionally, when MiL starts on about names she hates (in a clear attempt to make sure we never give future children those names. She still hasn't twigged it's not happening - I'm nearly 44 - and does it frequently) I think I'd like one just to name it something she hates. She's still convinced OH's cousin didn't call her baby Poppy because she told her she didn't like it when I know she always intended to give her the name she gave her. She's also convinced another very distant cousin gave his baby William as a second name as she said she liked it despite it being his wife's grandfather's name. He died while she was pregnant. I digress slightly but it's just a warning about how MiLs get funny ideas if you let them think they have any say in what you do.