First attempt at Clicker Training

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Footlights

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So after a recommendation from someone on here, I popped down my local pet store and bought a clicker to try and start training my horse with.

Thought I would give it a shot this morning, so instead of giving him his breakfast, I gave it to him in handfuls once he had 'targetted' the chosen object (accompanied by a click of course).

Well, he picked it up in just a few minutes and I could actually see him thinking and working out how he was going to get his next handful of food.

Not once did he try to snatch it out my hand or attempt to mug me (which he usually does when I give him a treat) and he was obviously really enjoying himself!

I can honestly say that I bonded more with him in the 15 minutes this morning than I have done since I got him home 2 weeks ago, and I would urge anyone to try it.

I know quite a few people already clicker train on here, so any useful info would be greatly appreciated :-)
 
Excellent start, good for you :D

What I would suggest you do next is work out what you'd like to achieve - because it's always good to be at least one (and preferably several :p) steps ahead of your horse. So, when he's got really good at touching the target, do you want him to target different things? Or would you like him to have to move to get to the target by taking a step? Or reach up/down? These can be useful first steps to other things... reaching down is something you can teach and then gradually, for example, choose to ask your horse to target a bit, so putting on a bridle becomes a breeze (you hold out bridle, horse drops head and takes bit in his mouth...). Taking a step to touch a target is good too... this way, you can teach your horse to follow you without a headcollar (always good for emergencies - all of mine have been taught to target and follow my fist, so can be moved around easily). You might also like to think about teaching your horse to retrieve objects - targetting is the first step for this too (you need to teach "hand object over" as well ;) - this one is invaluable if you drop a glove while hacking :D).

There's some ideas - you choose what you want to do next, and work out what steps you need to train to get there, then you're always a step ahead of the horse and you get to train a load of useful behaviours too ;)
 
Wow, thanks for taking the time to give some great advice!

My first aim is to get him to follow the target away from his friends and eventually out of the field by himself. My second is for him to 'target' the headcollar so he approaches me in the field when I want to bring him in.

How did you make the transition from targetting an object to your fist? This morning he was very interested in my chosen target (a coke bottle!) but I can't imagine him wanting to touch my fist!
 
Targetting the headcollar works a treat (so to speak ;)). My friend taught her hard to catch Section B to do this, and he used to gallop across the field whenever he saw it :)

How did you make the transition from targetting an object to your fist?
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Exactly the same as targetting a bottle - I just made a loose fist, held my arm out not far from the horse's nose and waited for curiosity to take hold... it probably helped that my fist smelled of fibre nuts, though I tended to offer the rewards with the other hand. It's interesting how horses see this game... one decided that the targetting was that he had to place his chin on top of my fist to get the treats, very cute! Once they understand this, you can place your hand just behind their nose, and they pretty quickly understand they have to take a step back to touch it... so you've taught backing up (in a nice outline) without ever having to touch the horse. So many cool things to teach, so little time :D

If you get into it, there are a few forums with good ideas for clicker training horses, plus a few good books, etc. that can help to work out new things to train/troubleshooting.
 
This is fab id like to try it with you youngster, what else can you teach them?
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Well, put it this way, I'm still waiting to find something I can't teach ;) But with youngsters, all the above (walking politely to heel in their own space without crowding or barging, trotting in hand), backing up, lowering head for headcollar, picking up and holding up feet for hoof care, allowing all routine care such as standing (loose in field) for fly spray, standing nicely to allow feet/legs to be hosed, preparing for backing (train horse to approach mounting block and stand steady lined up correctly) - you just choose what you need to train, work out the steps (a good book or support network is useful in avoiding pitfalls here) and off you go.

....But timing is everything!
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This is very true (and with all horse training), but it's a skill you can learn and the more you do, the better you get :-)
 
Ooh I'm intrigued by the "train horse to approach mounting block" one - how would you do that!?

Can you recommend any good books or a good forum for detailed step-by-step guides?
 
Ooh I'm intrigued by the "train horse to approach mounting block" one - how would you do that!?
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Well, one way would be using targetting, so you're one step towards that already ;) (just work out the other steps... horse has learned to touch target with nose - but you also need to have a cue to get horse to move sideways towards you... you could teach horse to touch the target with his hip too, that would be one way. Then next step, follow you towards block, and while you stand on top, you can move horse a step forward, a step back, a step in towards you until positioned correctly. Over time, you find horse will just walk right up and stand under you waiting nicely. I pretty much always reward once I'm on and have fiddled with reins, stirrups, girth because I want my horse to stand reliably beside logs, banks, gates, fences etc. to let me scramble on (he's 17hh) and it's worth making standing still to be scrambled on the best possible thing he can think of to do :D

There are a few on-line courses setting up in the UK - you could google Hannah Dawson (Clixcollege, I think), for example, or Amanda Martin. Good "how to" books are by Shawna Karrash, Sharon Foley, Alex Kurland. Good trainers in the UK - Jo Hughes, Helen Spence, Jenni Nellist, Hannah Dawson, Amanda Martin... the list is long and growing all the time :)

BTW be sure and watch Hannah Dawson's video clips - she is fantastic ;)
 
Great news! Hopefully you will be able to lead him in from the field in no time. They do really bond with you through clicker training. The reason for this is because they realise they are actually communicating in a language you both understand. It makes them feel secure because they can start to control and understand their environment. I taught my horse to do all kinds of things when I was unable to ride her for 6 months due to her injury. Once she was fit again I taught her to go off and jump jumps that I pointed at and get down and roll on command (actually just wanted her to lie down, but she always rolled :rolleyes:). I even taught her to rear on command (very impressive but frowned upon by some). She will back up, run to heal, wait and come to command. I haven't done half as much with my boy (the one I had trouble leading from the field), only necessary things like getting him in and saddling. Unbeknown to me he had kissing spines and therefore a saddle phobia. Through clicker training I got him to accept the saddle. It just shows how powerful a tool it is because despite being in agony with the saddle, he still accepted it. Only later did I find out about his condition.
 
Hi Guys,

I love hearing about people who are just getting started with the clicker training. There is such an exciting journey that lies ahead of you. Brightbay, great advice! Clearly you are an experienced clicker trainer. :0)

Footlight, There is a lot of free content (video and text) that may help give you some guidance. Here is a link to some mounting videos and posts. http://shawnakarrasch.com/blog/?s=mounting
At the very bottom of that page there is an exclusive video that gives you a more detailed steps for the mounting process. Anyway, I hope this helps. Keep up the good work and if I can be of any help please just let me know but I think you will find a whole lot of info on the various posts and videos. Besides, I think Brightbay is doing a great job!

Warm wishes...and happy training.
 
Thank you for all the info and advice - rearing on request is impressive, I hope you have a very distinctive cue so she doesn't get confused and start rearing up at shows! Sorry to hear about your boys kissing spine.

I have ordered the Alexandra Kurland book off Amazon and hope to use this for reference. I understand the idea and concept of clicker training, but it is difficult to know the steps you need to take in order to achieve your goals.

He was following the target around the field last night (still in comfort zone of herd though), but when I went to put his headcollar on he ran away. We did a little work this morning on him 'targetting' the headcollar and I managed to get him to voluntarily put his nose into it (for a a split second!) but not yet up and over poll.
 
Footlights said:
Thank you for all the info and advice - rearing on request is impressive, I hope you have a very distinctive cue so she doesn't get confused and start rearing up at shows!
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No, she only rears on command and never under saddle. In fact, now that she's retired she will sometimes refuse to do it. She very clearly shakes her head! Other days, if she's feeling spritely, she does it no problem. I never push her as it's supposed to be fun.
 
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asommerville said:
Am going clicker shopping at lunchtime :-)
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Yay! Let us know how to get on when you give it a go!

One question I had for you 'experienced clickers'.....! How do you get the horse to prolong what you are asking from him?

i.e. how do you ask him to keep his nose on the target for longer or keep his nose through the headcollar for longer? Do you withold the click for a bit longer or does that just confuse them as to what you are asking?
 
midi said:
interesting.
how do you target things though? bit confused.
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Start by just taking something into the field that is easy for you to hold and is easy for the horse to see, preferably something he/she isn't familiar with - this will be the target.

Horses are generally pretty inquisitive so the horse is likely to come up and sniff the object, as soon as the nose touches the target, click and then reward.

Horse will probably jump at the clicky noise (mine did) but then wonder why he got a treat and if there are any more.

Don't give anymore treats until he touches the target again, as soon as he does, click and reward.

It took about 3 minutes for my horse to get the hang of it!
 
Am going clicker shopping at lunchtime :-)
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I would really recommend going along to one of Amanda Martin's intro sessions (as I see you're in Glasgow - she's based in Lanarkshire. I know her and I would expect a very professional session). Getting started is great fun, but as things get a little more complex and you start asking excellent questions like the one above ("how do you get the horse to prolong what you're asking"), it is really helpful to have a guide/someone to ask/someone to demonstrate. It's like deciding to teach piaffe at home... sure, you can work out the steps, but if it doesn't quite go the way you're expecting, it helps to have a resource to explain what to do next. And clicker training is so motivating for horses, they get really keen and you need to be able to channel the keenness in the right way, and not get a horse who's passed you out and is second guessing what you want :D

There's no short answer to getting more/longer for each click, because there are different ways to achieve it. Shawna (thank you for coming along and commenting, Shawna's - horse clicker training masterclass! - way is the best I've seen and I wish someone had shown me this back when I was learning. Other trainers have different approaches. The one I tend to use is to work out steps towards what I want. Each time the horse does what you ask (e.g. touching a target), they'll do it slightly differently. The key is in the timing of the click... if you want, for example, nose held on target for longer and longer, you get it so that the horse touches the target every time you click - so say 10 times in a row, they do it without hesitating. Then you wait for the horse actually starting to e.g. leave nose on for a second, click that, get 10, then wait for a 2 seconds touch... The horse picks up quite fast that he or she needs to do something slightly different. If you get to the stage where they don't do what you expect, you've gone past what they understand and you need to go back a step (and possibly take a break - to start with, very short sessions are best :)).

There are loads of expert clicker trainers on here (I know Tazzle is one :D), so maybe we might get some other ideas? Shawna, I know, having learned her skills originally teaching large marine mammals (many with very big teeth :D) has a slightly different approach to getting "duration".
 
Footlights said:
i.e. how do you ask him to keep his nose on the target for longer or keep his nose through the headcollar for longer? Do you withold the click for a bit longer or does that just confuse them as to what you are asking?
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There are lots of 'schedules' you can use with clicker training or any reinforcement programe...

When I was getting my youngster used to having his feet picked up he was initially getting the clicker and a reward for picking up...next step was holding them up for a period of time... So once picking up was mastered we changed to an intermittent schedule of reinforcement so he got the clicker but not a treat each time - every other then every three and so on so the clicker almost 'takes over' from the treat reinforcer... The first time he was able to hold it up in the hand for a full minute he got clicker plus treat and every time he made it to the required time then I gradually reduced the availability of the food reinforcer as before... Upped it again when we moved on to times longer than the mastered 1 minute...

Keep changes small (within the same behaviour) and be bang on time with the clicker... The additional reinforcer works best when used continuously to establish a new behaviour and can then be reduced in frequency of use once established... Don't make the changes too hard or too different from the initial one - or you can get a ratio strain where the reinforcer isn't coming fast enough to keep him/her on task... I don't mean where you're teaching something new but say moving from picking feet up in hand to expecting them to be held up for five minutes...

Hope that makes sense... :)
 
Interesting that you expect the horse to do it 10 times without hesitation before moving onto the next step - that gives us something to work towards and reminds me the importance of taking things slowly.
 
Brightbay said:
Yes, it does. CLICK :D
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I normally work with kids and have gone on a total roll with the animals since working out the ABC of behaviour change applies in nearly every scenario so long as you get the correct antecedant (cue) and reinforcer...

Not so sure too many parents would be impressed seeing their 'wild child' offspring being clicker trained though... :eek: :D
 
Footlights said:
Interesting that you expect the horse to do it 10 times without hesitation before moving onto the next step - that gives us something to work towards and reminds me the importance of taking things slowly.
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Your comment makes me realise I might not have explained well? I just use blocks of 10 or 20 to stop me doing too much... What I mean is that I take 10rewards (whatever you're using), and each time I hold out the target, the horse touches it straight away, without looking confused, gazing into the distance first... and each time they touch it, I click and reward them. If I get 10 with no hesitations from the horse, I start to expect a little more. This is called "duration" - you want the horse to do what they're doing, but for longer. You could choose "frequency" instead of duration - wait for two touches for each click, then three... Decide which you want, and train that one first. If you want the other, expect to go back a step or two (i.e. make the task easier) to start training it.

I hope that makes sense - it's hard to describe in words ;)

OK, here's a wee clip - you can see he's learned to follow me when asked - now I make it slightly harder (I've increased the duration - length of time - he has to follow me for, and he has to follow me under something scary (we do a bit of Le Trec and this helped hugely with "low branches").
 
Footlights said:
Interesting that you expect the horse to do it 10 times without hesitation before moving onto the next step - that gives us something to work towards and reminds me the importance of taking things slowly.
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I don't know if this will help but...

An example that most of us can relate to is to think of the process of teaching a small child to clean their teeth... They need to learn to pick up the toothbrush each time...then you can add in picking up the toothpaste, flicking the top of the tube and so on... All little additions that would (normally) get a praise reinforcement at each step and once each bit is mastered they can move onto learning the next stage... Eventually, this chain of small behaviours has created a fairly accomplished and complex behaviour... Breaking it down, cleaning teeth has a huge number of components to be learned... You can't really miss a step out and each step has to be properly mastered before moving to the next or even go back a step or two if you've moved through the stages too quickly...

:)
 
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