foalie leading probs

[lennysmith]

Again I'm here asking you knowledgeable ones for some pointers.

It seems Denver has worked out his evasion tactic when out on his walks. He is in his controler headcollar which is a God send, however when he sees something he's not sure on, ie scary puddles that suck foals legs in and spit them back out, he leans right on me.

If I push back, it obvioulsy gives him something more to lean on, if I jab him, he just moves infront of me, turns in, and blocks my way. If I drop away so he has nothing to lean on, he panics and ends up bunny hopping, i then have to get him moving again, so he just leans on me all over again.

What should I be doing? It's really starting to hurt my shoulder all his bardging. When there is nothing there he walks like a angel, not pulling not leaning on me, you dont even know you've got him. It's just when he gets a bit nervy

 

[Amymay]

Could you try pushing him back a step? And also what about putting him in a little bitted bridle for more control?

 

[lennysmith]

Amy I was hoping someone woujld say that about bitting him, but didn't want to be shouted down for bitting him too soon (he's 6 months). I pushing him back, which he does, but he goes back and onto me. He's perfected the art of it alright.

If he really doesn't like something he just swings his bum out and ends up right infront of me with his left shoujlder in my ribs, grr

 

[the watcher]

I can only suggest circling away and starting again, and practice leading from both sides to give you more flexibility

 

[Amymay]

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practice leading from both sides

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Actually - this is the best idea. Because they will always step 'on' to you if worried.

What we do is if we see something we feel the foal / youngster will spook at - we swap sides so we don't get squished/trodden on. We therefore put ourselves between 'monster' and foal.

How about trying this before you go down the little bridle route.

 

[Gingernags]

One of the little plastic foal bits for showing wouldn't be that bad. In fact - I'm pretty sure even the saintly Asti was led bitted from weaning, as she used to try to kill my sister... had a nasty habit of rearing, barging and trying to run off, waving her back feet in the air.

I'd get tearful phone calls begging me to come home from uni to "sort your foal out, she's horrible". I'd trek back from Birmingham and my lovely foal would be a total angel for me and look oh so innocent of all charges!

My other trick, depending on his size, is to lead with your elbow in the groove on his shoulders, so you have control with the rope but have leverage. It gives you space, but also strength to swing him round if he starts getting strong.

Ivy was shown as a yearling and had been bitted well before that and led in hand. Its better to do that early and keep control, thean to have to keep arguing with him!

 

[Maesfen]

[ QUOTE ]
Amy I was hoping someone woujld say that about bitting him, but didn't want to be shouted down for bitting him too soon (he's 6 months). I pushing him back, which he does, but he goes back and onto me. He's perfected the art of it alright.

If he really doesn't like something he just swings his bum out and ends up right infront of me with his left shoujlder in my ribs, grr

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Bitting could be the best way forward because at least you will have more control if he spooks and tries to get away from you and he should respect it more. All the foals at TB sales are bitted as a matter of course, I used to think it was harsh but until you have tried it you won't believe the difference it will make both to them and you. You will gain in confidence because you know, unless you let him go, you have control and he in turn should respect you a little more and stop the barging. I prefer to use a Happy Mouth straight bar snaffle and introduce it gently over a few days for 10 minutes at a time. I will lead them in it but still going through the headcollar, then link the bit rings to the headcollar so that the noseband still takes most of the pressure and it's only when you know they have accepted things properly that I will lead from the bit rings only. Another trick if he tries to pull you forward is to wedge your elbow in the crook of his neck so at least he isn't trampling on you and it acts as a brake too! While it is great to get them to lead from your shoulder, with youngsters it is advisable to keep your hand near the head but keep your arm flexible so it can move with him if that makes sense; if you hold the leadrein too long he has the chance if he wanted to throw a frilly and strike out at you or even cowkick at you in passing, not desirable habits!
Don't forget, he's mainly been used to a chaperone in the form of Mum, so he's bound to be wary for a time.
Go on, you're doing a great job with him!

Edited to say - this looks like I've copied C-Top but I haven't, honestly!! I started this over 3 hours ago and only just got round to finishing it!!

 

[filly190]

I give full sympthay. I have an arab yearling and although I am not barged, she unexpectedly spins, leaps about and plays scary monsters.

I would not put a chifney or bit in her, as it could result in more problems. Although thats just my personal opinion.

I have had success with giving reassurance and distracting her. If possible I get my older horse to give her a lead.

Generally I am on my own and so I have let her discover the power of polo's. She knows I have a handful and she tends to be more interested in them, than finding monsters.

Over time I have weaned down the amount of polo's so now she is caught with one, comes in and is rewarded with one.

I am currently leading her all over getting her used to sights and sounds within my yard and we have good days and bad. The monsters are her game, I know she is'nt frightened because of the times we go past the wheelie bin and she's fine.

I think foals like to play and watching her with my other horses she is trying to play with me. I havent had her many weeks and so its just a case of time and patience.

I am though giving the odd sharp quick tug and saying listen to me when her head is in the clouds.

Over winter I am going to do lots of work with plastic bags, walking through things and setting up obstacle courses (old fashioned handi pony type things).

On a good note, all this time you are doing is well spent in educating your horse and I am sure you will crack it. If anybody out there has any further advice, I am reading this thread with great interest

 

[Gingernags]

[ QUOTE ]


Edited to say - this looks like I've copied C-Top but I haven't, honestly!! I started this over 3 hours ago and only just got round to finishing it!!

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I was relieved you put the same stuff, glad to know someone else thinks the same to be honest!

Two great minds and all that!

Reassuring to know I haven't posted bad advice!

 

[Theresa_F]

You cannot beat a pointy elbow.

One other possibility if you don't wish to bit now is to use a light chain threaded under his chin so it makes a "V" shape - I found this worked far more with Fleur than having a bit in - every horse is different.

That said if he has no respect for his pressure halter, than a bit would be the best way to go. If you wish I have a 5" in hand bit you can borrow - but it may be a bit big for him.

Some of the barging into you may be a dominance thing. Chancer started doing this at 18 months but your chap seems to be well advanced

To fix this we dominanted him with body language - what I call the fish finger stance. You stand firmly in front looking as aggressive and square with your arms held out at your sides folder down at the elbow and your posture as stiff as possible and glare at them then walk/stamp towards them. If he does not go back, a light flick with a soft rope on the chest and a growl. The idea is to have them submit walking back from you.

Start this in the school. Then when leading, if he leans on you, you go stiff and walk him away by walking at him. The idea is that he learns to respect your personal space and if he invades it uninvited he is stamped out.

It does work - if Chancer is being a git, ie barging he is fish fingered back until his head drops and he looks submissive. He is then invited back into my space and given a head rub. If he barges or leans, the procedure is repeated.

On the odd occasion he is worried, he will stand by me closely but does not make contact - I will then let him come into my space and give him reassurance with a stroke and then step back and go to lead him on.

 

[lennysmith]

Thanks for all the advice. I will try the elbow, and the fish finger can never be a bad thing. I may bit him but as he's only been leading alone for 8 days I think it's a little early to saying for deffinate. It is not out of the question tho, saftey first and all that!!

 

[Vey]

I think if you use a bit, now, for this, you risk spoiling his mouth. What I would do is to first of all work on leading exercises in your yard or a school. Make sure he will walk forward, in a straight line, and back ward too. Practise both with him led beside you, and with you standing befroe him, and moving him to you and away form you. Believe me, it will pay for the time you put in now again and again as he gets older. OPnce he can do this, then introduce walking up to and then over scary objects. Take a feed bag, a tarpaulin - anything at all scary that you fancy. don't think of it as 'controlling him' think of it as 'teaching him' - aim to give him a really good, progressive education. Keep lessons short - he will not have a long concentration span at all.

Yes, I know light weight bits are kind, but you should aim to produce a horse with a mouth so light he can be ridden inone, as I can my six year old.

 

[Gingernags]

Well I know its different for different horses, but a bit never spoiled Asti at that age, she had a straight bar rubber bit, and was fine with it.

She has the best brakes of any horse I've ever sat on and is still snaffle mouthed, and has hunted / done XC in a snaffle and no gadgets.

Fair enough try the other stuff first but don't be afraid to bit if you really need to.