Further advice on stallions in close proximity to mares

[oldie48]

We have a stallion just across the lane from one of our paddocks. He is running with a couple of mares but did get out and into a mares field a couple of years. I've just had a quick look at the gateway onto the lane, which is literally 15 feet from my paddock. The gate and gate posts are not fit for purpose, a good push and it would all come down. There is a single strand of electric fencing tape a yard or so from the gateway, not on any power. TBH the stallion would easily be able to push his way out onto the lane. I've got decent hedges and metal five bar gates but my daughter's eventer could jump that height from standing. I know the owner of the stallion they are decent folk but a bit sloppy when it comes to managing anything, I will have a chat with them as tactfully as pos but what can I do to keep Rose (and the elderly mare who is hopefully coming at the weekend) safe in their field?

 

[Asha]

I would start ( as youre suggesting) with a quick word with the stallion owner, and just express your concerns. It is their responsibility to ensure he doesn't get out. I would do this sooner than later, as due to the relatively mild weather, mares are coming into season early this year. ( one of mine scanned in season last week )

 

[Cortez]

You can fence your mares' paddock with the idea of keeping things out rather than keeping them in.

 

[flying_high]

I think I would put a separate line of electric fencing up your side, to keep your mares over 50 feet back from the stallion, and to act as an additional deterrent.

 

[oldie48]

You can fence your mares' paddock with the idea of keeping things out rather than keeping them in.

yes we are discussing this ATM. The stallion is a 16.2 WB so very capable I should think of jumping the metal five bar gates into any of our paddocks, what would be the best way of using electric fencing, LF will just go straight through don't know about the stallion as they don't use it.

 

[oldie48]

I would start ( as youre suggesting) with a quick word with the stallion owner, and just express your concerns. It is their responsibility to ensure he doesn't get out. I would do this sooner than later, as due to the relatively mild weather, mares are coming into season early this year. ( one of mine scanned in season last week )

Mare has just come into season, took me completely by surprise!

 

[ihatework]

If it’s just the gateway that is jumpable I would extend the two fence posts and run a strip of electric a couple of foot above the gate.

 

[Pinkvboots]

I would speak to them some stallions can be very persistent, I have seen a yearling colt get over a 5 bar gate to get to mares so an adult horse could easily, although some stallions just don't mine didn't he was stabled next to mares most of the time without any problems and was turned out very close to them.

 

[Hallo2012]

cable tie some electric fence posts to your gate (saw the metal stakes off first) and then run 3 or 4 stands of electric across the top to make it 7/8 foot high.

also fence your mares several feet back inside their field so if the stallion DID get out, there could be no sniffing or nose touching through any gaps in your dinosaur fence.

my stallion is only 13hh but i still make the gateway on to the road an impenetrable maze of electric about 7 foot high! rest of his road boundary is a huge thorn hedge but if it was just post and rail i would run electric along the top to make it all a ridiculous height too.

 

[oldie48]

Seething!!!! Just attempted a polite friendly conversation with the effing idiot who owns the stallion who seems to think it is a huge joke and who told me the stallion got out two weeks ago through his inadequate fencing onto the adjacent field. He was probably in search of food as there is no grass in his field, at least they have put a big round bale of hay in at the weekend. OH and I will be putting up the barricades tomorrow and I have poured myself any early glass of wine! On the plus side, I did quite a long new hack with Rose today with a friend who was on her 4 year old PRE gelding. She behaved immaculately, didn't flirt with my friend's horse and coped well with the dreaded pigs, which were on our way home. she was also happy to give a lead on a couple of occasions when the youngster was unsure and tbh was just a complete delight. She would make the most perfect mother, it is not to be but she is the sort to breed from.

 

[oldie48]

Bringing this post up again as I'd value some advice. I've had to move Rose from the field that is furthest away from the stallion and also the easiest to make stallion proof as it's what we make our forage from. I have two more paddocks, one is just across the lane from the stallion's field and the other is further away but still backs onto the lane. I am keeping Rose and the pony gelding in the same field but separated for now by electric fencing which is on the mains. I can't make either of theses paddocks completely stallion proof but I can put Rose, when she is in season, in a place that seems OK. I'm intending to try to only use the paddock which is close to the stallion when Rose has had her season but move her as soon as she starts to come back into season. My questions are, could her proximity to the stallion bring her into season more frequently and could it make her have "stronger" seasons. She is certainly having a very strong season ATM, it's not making her difficult in any way but she is winking and urinating at the slightest provocation. Unfortunately the stallion is still not properly secure in his field and could with very little effort be out on the lane. Also, are there any legal requirements if you keep a stallion? Thanks for reading.

 

[Inda]

My filly has a stallion, and their individual herds, on either side of her field. She's in a mixed herd that is primarily mares.

Normal fencing on all fields, never been an issue. The stallions can see each other with no interest in starting a fight. They dislike strangers in their fields, but they're treated like the rest of the horses, turn out everyday and stabled at night. Only issue we had was people looking for a missing dog thought climbing the fence and walking the fields was a good idea.

However we have 2 Welsh stallions 2 miles away that do try and break the fence when you go past. Owner got them as yearlings as they would be pretty in the field. I would hate to be closer to them.

I think the point of this ramble is it depends on the husbandry, if the stallion is bored and without a job to do.

 

[Equi]

Depends on the mare. My mare was never very showy never showed to my geldings and was not overly interested in the stallion i used for her twice (didn't take) or the stallion i used to tease her. but then i got my own stallion and she was like a raving lunatic for him and would be in season 24/7 for months until he left (she had a lovely foal the following year) her colt is now 2 and he does chuff etc at her but shes no interest at all and as such i have not seen her season in 2 years. Point being if the mare likes the stallion they will do whatever it takes to get them !

 

[indie1282]

I too would work on keeping out rather than keeping in. Is it just the gateway where the issue is? If so I would put a big board on the back of the gate so it's all blocked and then make a frame on the top of the gate, also boarded in. That way you have a solid barrier about 10 feet high.

I know it wouldn't look pretty but it would serve a purpose!

 

[Orangehorse]

I know this is a big step, but I would contact the BHS helpline to find out the legal position. Then get a solicitor to write a letter to the owner of the stallion setting out this legal position. I know that you will not end up as friends! You might find you have some legal insurance cover on your house insurance.

But when there are plenty of good responsible owners who take care of their stallions, these don't seem to be aware or interested.

I do hear of plenty of stallions who live very peacefully in mixed herds, with mares and geldings and everyone gets on fine. Then I hear of geldings savaged by stallions, stallions who will break through any fence to reach mares, who will chase mares to exhaustion, etc. etc.

 

[oldie48]

I know this is a big step, but I would contact the BHS helpline to find out the legal position. Then get a solicitor to write a letter to the owner of the stallion setting out this legal position. I know that you will not end up as friends! You might find you have some legal insurance cover on your house insurance.

But when there are plenty of good responsible owners who take care of their stallions, these don't seem to be aware or interested.

I do hear of plenty of stallions who live very peacefully in mixed herds, with mares and geldings and everyone gets on fine. Then I hear of geldings savaged by stallions, stallions who will break through any fence to reach mares, who will chase mares to exhaustion, etc. etc.

thanks this stallion has got on a number of occasions and on one of these manage to serve mare, so I think I do have real cause for concern. TBH I think if he did get to Rose when she was in season she would be a most willing party. she is obviously aware that he is in the vicinity, I've just got back home and she'd urinated in the lorry, and did it again on unloading. I think I have remebered why I didn't want a mare, good job she is a complete delight even when in season!

 

[oldie48]

Well, I walked past the stallion's field and low and behold there is now a proper gate, decent height with a bit of string in front of it. I think that's the best it's going to get but it is a huge improvement and the way it is placed would deter him from trying to jump it. The hedge onto the road, although not high is wide and has pig wire on the stallion's side. I feel a little more settled a bit it now. I will put Rose into the further away field when she is in season and move her back for week or so with the intention of moving her again before she comes into season again. Best laid plans, I know, but fingers crossed all will be well.

 

[JanetGeorge]

I would speak to them some stallions can be very persistent, I have seen a yearling colt get over a 5 bar gate to get to mares so an adult horse could easily, although some stallions just don't mine didn't he was stabled next to mares most of the time without any problems and was turned out very close to them.

lol, a yearling colt of mine jumped 2 x 5' electric fences (well powered - and he didn't pull them down.) Then he came onto the yard and jumped a 4' door INTO a stable (didn't mark door or himself.) Why? Because there was a mare in there who had been AI'd that day - and kept in for fluid treatment. Cheeky monkey! Talk to the owners and let them know you are worried. If your mares come into season, any half-bright stallion will KNOW from 1/4 of a mile away!

 

[Kaylum]

It's not just the mare you need to be aware of. If he gets into the geldings field and panics him a vets bill of thousands could be coming your way.

 

[oldie48]

It's not just the mare you need to be aware of. If he gets into the geldings field and panics him a vets bill of thousands could be coming your way.

Thanks for pointing it out, I was aware of that and have politely reminded the stallion's owner that I would be claiming for damages against them if their stallion gets out of his field and interferes with any of the horses or property (not that they have two pennies to rub togher, I suspect).

 

[JanetGeorge]

Thanks for pointing it out, I was aware of that and have politely reminded the stallion's owner that I would be claiming for damages against them if their stallion gets out of his field and interferes with any of the horses or property (not that they have two pennies to rub togher, I suspect).

If the stallion is running with mares, his basic temperament should be ok - a 'bad' stallion cannot be trusted not to beat up a mare that won't stand. So he would probably not be too interested in geldings. (One of my stallions is 'in love' with his gelding companion (close - but not in the same enclosure) and my other stallion often indulges in mutual grooming with the two geldings over an electric fence with him. So I would hope your biggest risk is a mare being covered successfully. However, I would be asking your stallion owner if he has Public Liability insurance - anyone who uses a stallion on anyone else's mares would be crazy if he didn't - and it MIGHT concentrate his mind on avoiding liability!

 

[oldie48]

Thanks JG. I think the stallion has a good temperament. He's lived across the lane for several years, arriving when he was very young. Initially they had him in a mixed herd but it was absolute mayhem. Now he lives with four mares and it's a fairly settled herd. The trouble is, apart from inadequate arrangements to keep them all in, they don't always have enough grass and are very slow to feed hay so I think now that the gateway is more secure, he is more likely to go through the fences which border onto fields.
May I ask for your opinion with regard to Rose? She's having a very strong season, with much winking, urinating etc. Her behaviour remains immaculate but she seems quite confused and a bit "needy" eg I went into the stables this morning and her tail went up immediately, with all the usual signs (this is day 5) she stood with her back legs splayed whilst I put her fly rug on etc and she was ready to go out to the field. She has always been happy to be touched all over and enjoys being groomed but ATM she really loves it and is particularly affectionate towards me. I am very unused to mares but thought that mares in season were more likely to become a bit touchy and bolshy. I also think the presence of a stallion may have given her a stronger season than usual, certainly when she was well away from the stallion and with another mare, I honestly couldn't tell if she was in season or not, not even when she had been given a prostaglandin injection.

 

[JanetGeorge]

Rose sounds like a first season. Some mares come in regularly lal through the winter - others go out and stay out for a couple of months - then come in with a bang. If she's still needy in 3 days, then it's probably an anovulatory follicle and she'll need a jab - but hopefully you won't need to bother. The stallion being within smelling distance could certainly have an effec on her, but mine just ignore the proximity of the stallions, lol.

 

[tristar]

i would have two electric fences on mains between mare and stallion, one on the boundary quite high, and one in the paddock to keep the mare back, in fact i would put the mare as far away as possible, conversations between stallion and mare start the action, body posture says come on, scents on the wind say i am ready, i would have no confidence at all if they were in proximity

proximity to the stallion will encourage your mare to season, she may not be due a season, but if the stallion calls to her she can come in season in hours,and it is`nt always the stallion that visits the mare, mares get into stallions.

some seasons go on and on, make no mistake that stallion is clocking your mare

 

[Clodagh]

i
proximity to the stallion will encourage your mare to season, she may not be due a season, but if the stallion calls to her she can come in season in hours,and it is`nt always the stallion that visits the mare, mares get into stallions.

Is tihs actually a proven fact? I have heard it as an old wives tale. I can understand the season showing more if they can smell a stallion, but not how he can change a complete cycle?

 

[oldie48]

i would have two electric fences on mains between mare and stallion, one on the boundary quite high, and one in the paddock to keep the mare back, in fact i would put the mare as far away as possible, conversations between stallion and mare start the action, body posture says come on, scents on the wind say i am ready, i would have no confidence at all if they were in proximity

proximity to the stallion will encourage your mare to season, she may not be due a season, but if the stallion calls to her she can come in season in hours,and it is`nt always the stallion that visits the mare, mares get into stallions.

some seasons go on and on, make no mistake that stallion is clocking your mare

Thanks but what you suggest is not possible. My property sits between two lanes, basically in the triangle with the land around us. One paddock has a lane on two sides and my drive on the third side, the other has all sides accessible via a lane or a drive. I have three gates into one paddock and two gates into the other. The stallion is across one of the lanes with one side of his field adjacent to the lane. Rose shows no signs of wanting to leave her paddock.

 

[JanetGeorge]

Is tihs actually a proven fact? I have heard it as an old wives tale. I can understand the season showing more if they can smell a stallion, but not how he can change a complete cycle?

You are right - they can't bring a mare in if they are not due. Some mares ARE discreet - thankfully. A lot of mare owners don't notice when a mare comes in if there's no stallion around. Even experienced people can miss them. When I rode racehorses - on a vry busy track - there was a strict rule: no colts/stallions on the track after 9 am; fillies and mares in season wait until AFTER 9 am. So - instructed to do a fast 600m on a 4 year old stallion, I did NOT expect the horse that was galloping about 20 yards in front to suddenly start squirting as she threw the brakes on so fast I had NO hope of stopping him mounting and covering her the lad jumped off just in time. The filly wasn't from our yard, thankfully - the trainer and staff responsible were considered morons by everyone after that, lol. But some mares are much slower to show - have seen a couple where the diary said they were due - even when a scan showed they were close to ovulation, it would take an expeienced stallion 20 minutes of chatting up before they 'broke down' and showed.

 

[tristar]

i`ve taken mares to stud and within hours they were starting to season, out of their cycle

 

[Clodagh]

i`ve taken mares to stud and within hours they were starting to season, out of their cycle

I think they can start appearing to be in season as a sort of defense mechanism.

 

[Cortez]

i`ve taken mares to stud and within hours they were starting to season, out of their cycle

Both of my old biddys showed in season upon setting eyes on my new stallion, but it was perhaps not a "real" cycle, and as Clodagh says may be a defense behaviour when encountering a new stallion (or, they're just shameless sluts....).