Gassy/spasmodic colic and windsucker, advice please...

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montysmum1

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My newish lad had just colicked

Vet has been and diagnosed it as gassy/spasmodic and given him an injection of Buscopan (sp?) which will be starting to wear off shortly, so I'm just fretting and need some steadying words and constructive advice as I'm prone to panic

He is a windsucker, he lives out 24/7, very well rugged, and is a very calm chap by nature, he is on a large field which has a surprising amount of grass still, but also has ad lib hay, which of course is all he's been able to eat for the last few days due to the snow. He has hard feed 3 times a day, consisting of Alfa a, d&h build up, Micronized linseed, brewers yeast, limestone flour and sugar beet (trying to put on weight as is a recently raced Tb, so needs condition).

This is his first 'colicky' episode, but i've only had him 2 months, and in the first 2 days I noticed how 'grumbly' he is with hard feed hence adding the BY and Limestone, which made a MASSIVE difference.

I did ask the vet if we should go straight for a course of Gastroguard, but she said i am over-reacting slightly

Any suggestions of what else I can be doing for him? What are your thoughts re 'Coligone' or something similar?

Have also posted in Veterinary
 
Btw Coligone liquid is fab when they have a colic onset. Has saved mine a couple of times.

My vet recommended RiteTrac for gastric and hind gut ulcers by KER which is distributed by Saracen.
 
IN H&H this week sugar beet is listed as a prime suspect in causing colic because of the way it ferments in the gut. I would find something else to fatten your lad up with.
 
Fine to tack up, ridden usually a bit nappy to start, then once he's out and about is perfectly fine, though we did have a 'sprightly' ride on Monday, which i put down to feeling fresh because of the snow... Doesn't buck or anything like that.

I do think ulcers personally, but again, vet thinks I am over-reacting, but it's just a feeling I have from past experience.

I've not heard of RiteTrac, will look it up, thank you!
 
Do you give him a warm feed? I do mine to prevent nay episodes like this as it can help too I believe in bad weather :)

Try speedibeet instead of regular sugar beet, it mught also chill him out a bit as there is less sugar in it
 
Mine had two colic incidents and small ones after resolved when I saw the signs with Coligone Liquid. He wasscoped and had gastric ulcers. He was treated with Gastrogard and then suralflate to treat hind gut ulcers after the 'honeymoon' of Gastrogard seemed to stabilise but not resolve the issues totally. Now on Adlib hay, 3 meals a day incl Fast fibre, Alfa A Oil, Mic Linseed, YeaSacc & Feedmark UlcerCalm since he came off the meds but going to move to RiteTrac later this week when it arrives per vet recommendation.
http://www.kerx.com/products/RiteTrac/ (buy from Saracen direct)

Very interesting reading on http://drkerryridgway.com/articles/article-ulcers.php. I have other links/info, pm me if you want more :D
 
Mine had a week or so of episodes of mild 'gassy / spasmodic colic' last year before eventually being scoped and diagnosed with low grade ulcers.

The colic incidents were strange as Buscopan and painkiller injections seemed to sort it but then it would return. In hindsight, that was obviously when the painkiller wore off and the Buscopan was irrelevant.

I was actually relieved when they found ulcers as I'd been fretting about what it was. (I'm a real worrier too!) Got him onto Gastroguard immediately and he seemed better straight away. (Ulcers did reappear after Gastroguard though and he had to have second course and is now on Pronutrin as preventative).

Vet didn't think it would be ulcers and was realy surprised to find them as he certainly wasn't a 'typical' suspect. (Native, good doer, lives out 24/7, no hard feed etc). They actually initially scoped to check the stomach for any impactions there!

PM me if you want.

Hope it all goes well with your horse!
 
It sounds like you are keeping him in an ideal way for someone with his issues, and it may just take time for these things to settle down if you haven't had him for very long.

The one thing I would suggest from what you have said, is to cut out the Build Up from his diet. This (I think, if I am right) is a cereal based feed, and cereal based feeds (despite what the manufacturers may confess!) are really not suitable for horses and especially those with possible gastric issues.

Have you heard of Simple System feeds? I would well recommend you contacting them - they make a range of feeds which are all forage based , and they do have some specifically to help them gain weight. I could not recommend them more highly and have never seen my horse look so well. They also sell brix, which are made from compacted forage and can be helpful for cribbers/windsuckers to chew on.

Does your horse have company? The only other thing I don't think you mentioned was whether he has any companions. This would be something I would say is essential for his well being, and just try to make his life as stress-free as possible. You sounds like you are doing a great job and all the right things. Give him time. Good luck!
 
Thank you everyone, vet's been out again :( 2hrs after the Buscopan, he started to get agitated, and I just got the head collar on him before he went down to roll, started walking him again, each time i stopped for a few moments he tried to go down so I called the vet again. While waiting for the vet, he did a very normal poo, so that was a relief, vet did a rectal anyway and said all felt normal. he then put a stomach tube in and poured just over 1.5 gallons of saline into him. He's had more Buscopan, and was sedated for the tube, and has had IV bute as well. Now we're just waiting again and keeping a very close eye.
I really appreciate your suggestions, and yes, the build up will be switched gradually to a cereal free blend, I'm not familiar with Simple System, but am already looking at Allen and Page. He does have company, and is pretty settled and happy in himself in general, until this.
I just want him to feel better right now. I'm so worried about him. Vet said to check at 11pm and 3am :eek: I can't leave him for that long - doubt I'll be sleeping at all tonight!
 
Oh dear...so sorry to hear that. If you can, stay with him as much as you can. I do think sometimes that having someone they trust their with them just helps them to keep fighting the pain.

I know it may sound silly....but personally at times like this I sometimes think it is just nice to have something to do......there are lots of accupressure points in horses ears, so if you are sitting/standing with him (and as long as he isn't an ear shy horse!), it may be worth just giving his ears gentle, upwards strokes, inside and out, and basically giving little mini massages with your fingers on his ears.

I don't presume for one minute that that will cure his colic, but he may help him to remain calm and relax a little, and it may also help to keep you calm having something to do.

Really wish you the very best. No doubt you have a very sleepless night ahead, but try to stay calm and positive and don't give up too easily.
 
Crikey poor you. I hope your horsey is ok and gets better quickly.
It is likely that your horse could have had them a while before you got him. It is likely that they can have stomach and hind gut ulcers. But they can only scope the stomach which only tells a part story.
My Mums TB colicked alot we're talking like 16 years ago when she died but she was a cribber, very edgy, explosive. Looking back if we knew then what we know now she certainly had ulcers.

Fyi, Bute can aggravate existing and cause ulcers btw.

Slippery Elm is another option for binding to ulcers to allow them to heal. Aloe vera juice from Holland and Barratt may help.

Low sugar, low starch, no cereal is key. Adlib hay, oil/linseed and lots of fibre and turnout.

Fingers x'd for you tonight x
 
I shall be thinking of you stopping up with him tonight, it's an awful position to be in isn't it?
When he recovers, I suggest feeding him grassnuts and grass chaff to build him up. Our mare had recurrent colic which really pulled her down but she put weight on very well on that regime. I've also had good results with Aloe Vera with an unscoped but, I'm convinced, ulcer-y horse. Has he been eating snow? Neighbour's new TB did that and gave himself colic, Gastroguard sorted him out eventually.

Fingers crossed for a peaceful night for both of you.
 
Well we've gone 12hrs without major incident. He's obviously still not 100%, but no classic colic symptoms again yet. Fingers crossed we'll stay this way
 
Hi, glad your boy is looking brighter. May be worth vet running bloods, my young tb had spasmodic colic symptoms 4 times requiring vet and several not, turned out to be a liver virus. Colic signs would get bad, he would throw himself down, too bad to walk then be fine for an hour then bad again. Drugs helped and would pick him up for a few days.
 
I had a mare that wind sucked. She was always suffering from gassy colic. I had her scoped and she didn't have ulcers. I also fed her a high fibre diet but she still got colic on a regular occasion. Being in or out made no difference.
The only thing that put a stop to the colic was to stop the wind sucking so I bought her a miracle collar, once she stopped wind sucking she stopped getting colic.
Now I know people will say that the collar was cruel but so was having her suffering from colic at least once a week, to the point that the vet taught me what to look for as to whether I needed to call the vet or treat myself with findine.
 
Sorry to hear this. Fingers crossed for the best.

I have my cribber/windersucker on a similar diet, Alfa A Oil, D&H Build and Glow, Vit & Mins, Brewers Yeast, Limestone Flour, Slippery Elm (just started this one) and when I do feed sugar beet I use Kwikbeet as it is lowest in sugar content. Maybe a switch to Kwikbeet would be better for you? The Build and Glow is a supplement also, rather than a hard feed.

He wears a Miracle Collar, but sometimes I have to leave it off to give him a break.
 
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Firstly - don't worry. I had one of these who cribbed and windsucked 24/7. She 'colicked' about 8 times but I only called the vet on the first occasion as it self resolved, ususally with a massive fart, within an hour.

We quite often get prolonged snow and the vets up here will tell you that the change to dry forage, with horses a tad reluctant to drink cold water will lead to impaction. In the 2010 year the vets had a 150% increase in impaction colics. I switched to haylage, which certainly helped. I found also that any hard feed really made the situation much worse and she would sometimes drop like a stone once finished. I think it is a combination of factors really. Your regime sounds super though.
 
fburton said:
I am glad to see the discussion is around diet and not collars.
Click to expand...

While I appreciate everyone's advice, and that some things work for some better than others, I do have to say that I have absolutely no intention of putting a collar on him.

While I thought the way I manage him has been pretty OK, as I am conscious of the probable underlying causes of windsucking/cribbing, I can see that there are still improvements to be made. I have stopped the sugarbeet already, and as soon as my feed merchant can get a delivery, will change him to Speedibeet for the lower sugar content. I am also now topping up his water with hot water to keep the temperature up, so he isn't put off drinking it in this cold weather.

I really do appreciate all of the dietary advice, as it is a total minefield :o
 
This is not personal experience but I recently read (either on here or another form) someone with a similar issue. They cut Alfalfa out of the diet and just used a plain chop and the colics stopped,

Sorry but I can't link to the post as I can't remember where I saw it.

Good luck
 
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