Gastroguard without scoping - questions & insurance?

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Hedwards

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So I've been managing Mickey as a 'acidy' horse for a few months, very successfully, however the onset of the snow, and now an abscess in one of his hind hooves resulting in some box rest, I feel that he does have ulcers.

I was chatting to the Vet the other day who said i have 2 options, Scope (would require referral to another vets as the one I uses is purely ambulatory and dont have a 3m scope), and then once confirmed gastroguard to treat, the other option is to do a trial of GG without scope and see if there is improvement. Now me and the vet are both 99.9% sure its EGUS

Ordinarily i think I'd send him for a scope and take that route, however, my other horse has been lame and on box rest for a month, and we are still non the wiser as to what is wrong with her (SI injury has been a possibility) - the senior vet is on his way to see her today. I'm so bloody stressed out with it all the idea of GG straight away just sounds so much easier, I'm not sure we'd be able to load my boy if we have to starve him anyway.... has anyone done this? have they had any issues with insurers paying out without a scope? I've spoken to PetPlan who said they cant confirm anything over the phone, but if the Vet recommended this option then they would base their assessment on that - or i can do a 'proforma' which is normally related to an exclusion on a policy that may prevent payment - so you can submit a claim form with costs assessment and they get back to you with a yay or nay - but as Mickey hasnt had them before, so no exclusions I'm not sure there's any point?

I just want to jack horse ownership in completely at the moment, I'm bored of sick horses, tired of the rubbish weather and stressed by the amount of money its costing at the moment - but really I'm so depressed seeing both my horses in pain/discomfort (ok, Mickey is fine now his abscess has burst and is draining, but you know what i mean!)
 
All I would say is that my horse had very low grade ulcers but was ultra sensitive to be girthed and rugged I had expected them to be really bad - he was scoped and treated with GG.

A friend's horse was just a bit lack lustre in competition - she had him scoped - he had high grade bleeding ulcers and had to be pts.
Don't be fooled into thinking you can judge the severity from the outside. If you truly believe your horse has ulcers spend the £180 on scoping. You can the always source opramazole online if you are not insured, but at least you will be clearer as to what you are dealing with. Good luck.
 
The cost isnt really the issue... he's insured, and it would all go on the insurance,

Thanks for the advice, I'm really not trying to cut corners, but trying to keep the stress for us both as low as posisble (I'm currently being treated for Shingles, so not in the best form myself)
 
I too would scope - I think that although you get 12 hours of worrying about them not being able to eat, it's actually all over pretty quickly and you have an actual answer about the stomach (before anyone starts the hind gut debate - we know they don't show them there!) I think that the idea of giving a few days of GG and things being crystal clear is a nice one, but absolutely would NOT have given us an answer in my girl's case. Her behaviour didn't change clearly or quickly enough at all, but we were confident to continue knowing there were grade 3 glandular and grade 2 splash ulcers because we'd scoped. From a 'stress' point of view and a financial one, I think scoping, getting a diagnosis, knowing there won't be any hassle with the insurance and having a clear plan to treat is much less stressful, all things considered, when you have a lot of other things on your plate. You'll hear from people who found the gastrogard trial very clear and obvious, but you can't guarantee that and you may end up costing yourself more in the end. If you're worried about loading them hungry (i thought mine would be going nuts, she was actually perfectly well behaved) you can always take them to the vet the night before and stable them there.
 
Ok, looks like the scoping is the right option, will speak to the Vet coming out to my mare today.

philamena said:
If you're worried about loading them hungry (i thought mine would be going nuts, she was actually perfectly well behaved) you can always take them to the vet the night before and stable them there.
Click to expand...

I would be 99% certain he wouldnt load hungry, however hadnt considered taking him the day before! thanks for that!
 
My girl was scoped a few weeks ago - we took her to the vets the day before, she coped very well with the whole thing.

I do think scoping is worth it so you know exactly what you're dealing with - my girl was worse (grade 3-4) then I was expecting.
 
Right, so just need to arrange the transport and get him booked in with the Vets... so thats 2 lots of insurance excess to pay then! (well to be fair only £30 on one of them as I've already paid £100 on her treatment!)

God - i really thought having 2 horses would be fine! typical they both break at the same time!

Thanks everyone!
 
Good luck, let us know how you get on! (Feel your pain on the insurance excesses... mine's £500, which seemed a good idea at the time I took it out ha ha!)
 
Having just done a scope it only shows half the story. If u think the horse has ulcers it probably does. Low sugar, Lo starch diet. Split feeds as often as u can and ad-lib hay. There is lots of great information on the internet. Specifically Dr Ridgeway about ulcers.
Gastrogard was sooo expensive plus the Sucralflate to treat hind gut ulcers as we didn't see the complete resolution with just GG. My horse has made amazing progress since being on RiteTrac by KERx.
 
I had my horse scoped against the opinion of primary vet who was convinced that there was no ulcer problem. In fact, he has 15 + grade 3 ulcers, mostly glandular. It seems that his ulcers are as a consequence of SI pain, but nonetheless the scoping I feel was of great importance. Good luck with it all - I know how stressful it all is, and how it makes you wonder whether it's all worth it. Just have to look forward to the good times again.
 
Right, well Vet was here for my mare today... Sadly her prognosis is guarded, and he believes although cant be sure that its something like a hairline fracture to her pelvis, as she isn't displaying SI injury type behaviour, its all complicated by the fact she has previously had laminitis in one for leg, and isn't seeming to be coping very well on that... Guarded prognosis, more time & box rest... Fingers crossed please?

Mickey had his abscess checked, all good, bit more foot paired away, and a day or so more in the stable without a poultice. And we discussed the ulcers. Now this vet is well respected in this area, solely deals with horses and is a specialist in racehorses, in his opinion he said the stress to scope isn't worth it and has said to try on the GG, and ill know within a couple of days. Since Connie is going to continue to stress me out I've decided to take this option, I know a lot have said to scope, but potentially having to make the ultimate decision about Connie in the near future, I just want to get Mickey comfortable with minimum stress.

Thank you to those that have PM'd, I can't reply as I'm on my phone, but I'm so grateful you've taken the effort to provide all that information.

If you could keep your fingers crossed for them both I'd be really grateful...

As im feeling a bit emotional...Here they both are a couple of months ago one of my favourite photos ever! (Connie the skewbald, Mickey the bay)

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Feel so sorry for you, so very sorry for you. I know it's an impossibly difficult time, and really do wish you and your neds the very best. Good luck.
 
Pet plan paid up no problem for my horse to have 6 weeks of gastro guard last year without her being scoped as like you my vet didnt have a long enough scope. So long as the vet puts ulcers as their diagnosis based on the symptoms you should be fine. I must admit I was very nervous while waiting on payment though as it is very expensive.
 
My vet has just put one on gastrogard, no time to wait for scope as he has been going downhill since his op, he will advise the insurance that it was the only route to take and expects them to be happy with that, hope they are.

Thinking of you.
 
Just thought I'd update on this thread... Mickey is 4 days out of 7 for his GG trial...

What a different horse he is! No more is his grumpy & jumpy when being groomed/tacked up around his girth, no longer is he sluggish and behind the leg, threatening to buck when leg is applied, tense and what i originally thought was naughty...

He's active, forward and so relaxed when ridden. to groom & tack up is a pleasure and he has totally reverted to the relaxed happy boy i bought back in September. He still has some small reactions, but its a swish of the tail and a 'look', but as its only 4 days in I'm happy!

So pleased! Just waiting on a call from the Vet to find out how much longer we keep him on it.

Just wanted to say thanks to everyone who posted on this thread and also to those that PM'd - very grateful!
 
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