Go on then feed experts... what can I do without here?

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LankyDoodle

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Lanky, 17.3hh warmblood, quite a good doer in summer, but drops off easily in winter.
George, 15hh native type, extremely good doer all year round
Both have a tendency for rubbish feet. G has been on F4F since June and has amazing foot growth now. Thanks to the BOSS and F4F his coat is healthy and shiny, even though it is winterand he is clipped. Lanky has been on F4F for 7 weeks (have owned him 7 weeks) and am yet to see too much different in the feet, but it is early days, and he needs it more than G as his feet do crack badly and he can lose shoes. This has not happened yet with me, but my farrier does work differently to his old one.

Lanky
2 feeds a day of:
2 400g scoops Alpha A
Up to a scoop speedibeet
1/2 small scoop BOSS
1/2 small cup veg oil (to help keep his weight)
3/4 cup F4F (this is what I was thinking of changing to just Biotin which has copper in with it, but if I do that then he misses out on other vits and mins. If I add a vit and min supplement like Equvite, he will be getting a second dose of copper which is not good).

George
2 small feeds a day:
Small handful hifi
1/2 cup F4F
1/4 scoop BOSS
30ml Naf Respirator

This, as you can imagine, is costing a lot. Is there anything I can do without? I don't want to cut out a balancer like F4F if they need it, but would be happy to feed just the biotin (Equimins) for their feet if they really don't need the balancer. I like their diet to be fibre-based and like to use the BOSS for overall condition. George has a dust allergy, hence the respirator (I am going to use powder but the shop didn't have it this time).

They get ad lib meadow hay, which is good quality. George gets his slightly wet due to his allergy. They are on OKish grazing, starting to run out of grass and their turnout can be restricted sometimes. Ridden as much as possible. George 18, Lanky 7.
 
Crikey you reckon you can cut something out? Apart from the F4F you are pretty much down to the basic feed really.

Id be looking for a standard vit and mineral supp to replace the F4F which IMO is a bit of a marketing triumph if you get my drift.
 
Yep, that is my feeling, too. I feed it for the foot supplement though and if I feed Equimins Biotin (which would be my preference as it's cheaper!) then I can't feed a vit and min supplement as they invariably contain copper like Biotin. You can't feed copper twice. I might look into a herbal supplement like winter glow and do the Biotin.

I do feed the bare basics, but I don't like mixes. I know they are necessary for some horses but I wouldn't want to feed one just because it's colder, for eg. If I fed a mix like Leisure Mix, I wouldn't need the vit and min supp, and that was one option I considered, but again, don't like feeding cereals etc.

I like them to have a fibre based diet and would not cut out the beet or chaff. In summer they will get less chaff and possibly no beet and no oil, but apart from that it should be the same. They look very healthy and well on what I give them (G looks better than ever), but my bank account doesn't
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Balancers are not that far removedin price from F4F as they don't last as long.

So I either do the biotin and no other supplement or biotin and winter glow or leisure mix or F4F. Do you know of a vit supp that has no copper in it?
 
For native George I was feeding my Haffie virtually the same as you and I threw all of it over in favour of Dengie Healthy Hooves and she is blooming on it and her feet have actually improved. She was on Hi Fi and Lo cal balancer and Farriers Formula and now she just has Healthy Hooves (NOT happy hoof thats horrid sawdust) - H.Hooves is moist and has chaff and nuts and lots of biotin and mint and is lami approved. Its so appetising I even tried nibbling it, never done that with a horse feed before!

I am saving a packet and its so appetising my big hunter (similar drop off in winter to Lanky) was kicking the door to get at it. He was on H+P nuts, Blue Chip original, pink powder, Visorbin, oil, you name it. Now he just has H+P nuts with Healthy Hooves and pink powder (which is cheap).

They are both looking fantastic going into winter, and big chaps ME like recurring virus hasnt hit us so far this year so he must be feeling well, so much so he's being clipped on Sunday, go faster stripes!

Hope this helps!
 
Awww, thanks. That does help. I did wonder about healthy hooves and my farrier also mentioned it. I was also looking at pink powder today in the shop.

Lanky would still need a scoop of alpha a and a scoop of speedibeet I think, but he was being fed part hifi, part alpha a by his ex owner, so I could replace one scoop of alpha a with healthy hooves. I will keep giving him the BOSS and oil as he looks great on it and his condition is much better now.

I am just going to go and have a look at the Dengie website at the product make-up.

Thank you.
 
If they were mine, I'd go with healthy hooves (you won't need extra biotin if you feed it at the recommended rate), a general vit / min supplement and some nuts. If you need anything else then pink powder would do the job. The oil won't do a lot at the rate your feeding it unfortunately
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Thanks scotsmare. This is what I thought when I started to feed it but his ex owner told me to only give a maximum of a cup a day as she had in previous winters because more would blow his mind. She is a friend of ours so I had phoned her to get her advice about him dropping off.
 
Wow, I came on here to post a very similar post but you have done it for me
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My cob has got absolutely rubbish feet. For the past year I have been feeding him Top Spec Anti-Lam and the year before he was on F4F. I am absolutely disheartened because his feet are actually worse than ever now and I spend so much money/time/effort on trying to improve them. He is also on Alfa A and speedibeet with ad lib meadow hay and a small scoop of hifi cubes in his decahedron. To be honest he does not look great and has lost weight recently
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I have just (as in, last week) replaced the Top Spec with Benevit Advance and Farriers Favorite to see if I can make improvments that way.

my old arab mare also has hoof issues - they look OK but are very prone to abcesses. Shes also on FF, Benevit Advance, Hi Fi Cubes, Speedibeet and Alfa A.

I would be really interested in replacing all that with Healthy Hooves, do you think that it would work out cheaper in the long run or just less hassle?

Cassandra
 
Hi Cassandra,
I worked out a rough costing last night and by changing to HH and feeding at the recommended rate, it's going to be more expensive than my feed as it stands now, simply because I'd have to get through about 40 bags a year and it won't be enough to keep weight on my WB. I am only happy to feed a non-heating cube if I do add one, but he does so well on Alfa A and beet with a bit of oil (now upped it) plus BOSS (you could try this for general condition as lots of people, including myself, have had great results). I am going to add Naf Biotin and then use Pink Powder in winter only. I have only ever used balancers in winter, so this will be the benefit of not feeding an all in one foot supplement and balancer.

My husband nearly passed out tonight when I told him how much my F4F was costing and that, due to the cost of this gold plated feed, and the fact I have had to experiment due to horse2 being new to me, I will have spent 400 on food for them in 10-12 weeks
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I just started feeding respirator to G because he gets a cough (gets worse at times) and a white discharge from his nose - a dust allergy. Despite soaking the hay (he CANNOT have haylage and I will NOT feed haylage to him) and making his feeds like soup, he does struggle. However, I have found a product called Secreta Pro which is much cheaper (will cost about a third of what respirator does) and is supposed to be better, so I will be feeding that instead. I am going to try finding a supplier of unbranded unmollassed beet, but I am using Alfabeet at the moment for Lanky. Will stick to the dengie chaffs I think, and the oil and BOSS is pretty cheap really. Shopping around on the net I have been able to find cheaper suppliers of Biotin and Pink Powder in large quantities
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