Goodbye Confidence (Belle bucked me off)

HollyWoozle

HollyWoozle

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I'm sorry for the extreme length but I have never really been afraid of Belle before now. :(

As some already know, I have had my ups and downs with Belle. I got her in Oct 2009 and really just wanted something to hack and have fun on and for my Mum to share (Belle was a ridiculous choice!). Before Belle I had a TB x Connie who I just hacked on and she never did anything mad. I went to shows as a child but am not a great rider, primarily a happy hacker who has tried to improve with lessons.

Since having Belle, she has been a huge challenge. She wouldn't tie (pulled back and panicked), couldn't tack her up, sometimes couldn't catch her or brush her, she still won't hack alone and she has reared (only once and I went off the back), spooked and spun. I have really worked hard to overcome all these things and she now catches, ties, tacks up fine, stands still for me to mount and is braver on the roads. We still take someone on foot, bike or horse, but she will come home alone just fine. So we sometimes ride back from our lessons (just 5 mins up the street) on our own.

Today we went for our lesson and a friend (experienced rider) came to watch. Belle properly bucked me off, she has never bucked more than 1 or 2 excited tiny ones. This was a shoulder drop, head between knees and off I went. Totally unexpected. She panicked and bolted around the school so caught her and got back on. She bucked again and I sat to the rodeo and carried on, but smacked my chin on her neck. Then she bucked me off again with a real twist so I had no chance. This time she really went off around the school, enough that my instructor shouted for me to get to the side. Eventually we calmed her and I got back on... she tried again, maybe twice, and I sat to it. It was always in canter and either on the left rein or when we were on right rein and she napped very badly to the left and then did it. In the end we did one circle of sensible canter on right rein and ended it at that. Belle's teeth were done less than a month ago and saddle fitted end of last year (but I know it would be wise to have it checked again now). Both instructor and experienced friend think it was sheer naughtiness. Friend has offered to get on and have a go but I don't know if that will make me feel worse.

By the end my legs were like jelly and I was genuinely afraid. I don't even mind the fall but I can't bear the suspense. My hand hurts now where I was holding the reins so tight (not hauling on her mouth, just clamped down). My instructor is great and did her best to end it on a positive note but I have never really been frightened of Belle before. I have always just hopped back on and got on with it. Now I am really nervous to canter again because I feel sure she will get me off.

After a year and 8 months, I love Belle to pieces but I can't do what I wanted to do... which is hack alone and in company and have some fun (jump some little things here and there, go on fun rides). I don't care about competing and maybe having a big KWPN x ISH who is very unpredictable is just above me. I daren't sell her because she has clearly had a good beating before and I am worried about it, but I am not enjoying it.

I have another option. An experienced and kind lady in France (she is from Belgium) breeds showjumpers and runs a riding establishment and she is besotted with Belle. She would love to have her over there for the winter, with a view to breeding a foal from her, and I know that Belle would be in capable hands. The lady is kind and full of common sense, has a beautiful place there (100 acres with woodlands, lakes, rivers and good facilities), and I genuinely think it would do Belle good. I don't agree with breeding willy nilly but this lady knows what she is doing and produces some excellent horses. I'm just not sure I can bear to let her go. :(

Sorry again for this huge ramble. Cadburys coated rich tea biscuits all round.

ETA: will be getting vet out to check Belle over!
 
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Can I be blunt? You might love her but you can't have fun with her and at the end of the day, she is a working animal. This other lady sounds like she can love her just as much as you. Belle has been a challenge from the beginning and life is too short to be upset over a hobby that is meant to be fun. I'm speaking as a nervous rider myself. If you find yourself worrying about riding last thing at night before you go to sleep then you should lend her to this lady. At least with a loan you can take her back if it does not turn out to be the home you thought it would be.
 
As above, and with Belle not being with you over the winter, you will know in your mind whether you really think it's worth persuing with her.

It's horrid when things go belly-up.....

I'm sure you will make the correct choice for both you and Belle.
 
Thank you all. I am definitely considering sending Belle to France but first will go and visit the place to see what it is like.

I think now I will go home (to my new flat with no internet yet! :( ) and have a nice dinner, many many biscuits and a hot bath to soak away the pain!

More opinions/encouragement are really welcome. I feel a bit like a failure for not just getting on with it and persevering but the good times aren't outweighing the tough times at present!
 
:( Sorry you're having troubles :(

I'm with the posters above - I think if you send her away you will have a) peace of mind knowing that she's safe, b) will learn how you really feel about her/the situation and c) it might give you the opportunity to maybe get some lessons on a really safe, steady horse who can give you your confidence back? That way if/when Belle comes back to you, you might be in a better position to deal with her, confidence-wise. :)

Really hope it works out, whatever you decide. You obviously love her very much and only want what's best for her, which is incredibly admirable. But don't disregard your own happiness as well. Best of luck pet :)
 
I am afraid I think you did really well but at the end of the day is an animal without our human emotions etc and if you think Bon voyage is the best option and a good home etc I would be inclined to let her go. Unless you get someone with tons of confidence to take her to task and have her number completely.

She didnt just do it once but again and again, you got off lightly. And I think you were very good to keep getting on each time.. Have a big plate of biscuits and send me a few as I forgot to get some Friday night choc in!!

If only some of these horses just realised how lucky they are...but they dont do they!
 
I can empathise, as Jack was similar in terms of bucking in canter and planting to get me off. But with him, everything else was right, and I knew deep down that this could be sorted. It has mostly, in that we sorted a better saddle, and have worked with his cold-back tendencies. My confidence is still not great on him, hence I'm looking for a second horse as a confidence giver, but I do feel that in time, Jack will be everything I wanted (he has his moments now!).

What's your gut feel? From reading your op you know you need something different, as much as you love her xx
 
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Oh, but in relation to this particular incident, it doesn't sound like pure naughtiness to me. If it's so completely out of character, something is wrong.
 
Bet your sore - good bath and a bit of self indulgence is definately called for - i am with JenJ - This is out of behaviour and before you even go to visit the possible new home I would get a qualified back person out (mine - Nikki Routledge is also a saddle fitter so can look at both sides) that way you have eliminated the posssibility of pain.

dont be hard on yourself - you did more than most would - getting back on - and more than once. If back is ok then I would agree that to send away for a while would be good whilst you either get confidence back riding something else or buy something more suitable - I ride out on my own and if I couldnt would be really stuck so it is important to have something that meets your needs x
 
Whether you send her to France has to be decided based on her overall behaviour. Sudden, severe 'get off' bucks are always pain or panic related (if panic, it's usually to get you to drop the reins so they can run). On one rein only, in canter only, I would be almost certain she's pulled something in the field, and her back or another muscle somewhere is damaged. That or she's changed shape enough that her saddle is digging in somewhere, perhaps tipping forward and digging into her withers, or just too tight.

Vets often find it harder to find that sort of thing than 'back people' as they don't see it so often. Most people will call physio or give the horse time off rather than calling the vet. My pony is out on loan atm and one day she just started cow kicking and bucking in trot. She's never done that before. Vet checked her and found nothing. We went to see and there was a lot of tightness in her back so they got the back person (Physio I think) out. They found the problem. Box rest and controlled exercise and she should slowly come right again.

My mare has ski-ed down the hill in this weather and the muscles behind her shoulder blades are tight as anything. I'm sure she'd buck me off if I tried to ride her.

Before you make decisions based on this episode, find out what's wrong with your horse. Then, based on her overall suitability and behaviour, make your decision.
 
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I'm so sorry for your predicament. I think that your friend in France may be the wise option; but, like Jen J, Bells's behavious doesn't sound like naughtiness to me. I had a rather similar experience with my TB mare years ago, who reared repeatedly at the end of a ride (she'd NEVER reared before). How I stayed on I don't know. It emerged that her arthritis, which I knew she had and for which she had a daily dose of bute, as it was then, had got much worse, and she was simply rearing because she was in great pain.

Your friend in France sounds really nice, but if you do let Belle go make sure it is a loan, and that you have paperwork to prove it.

If you decide to keep her, then you definitely need someone else to ride her for a bit, as your confidence has taken a big knock. Not your fault, and it happens to us all at one point or another - you're among friends!
 
hun :( sad to hear this but you have to put you first and its getting a bit dangerous and you have to keep number one safe first. good luck and chin up x
 
mystiandsunny said:
Whether you send her to France has to be decided based on her overall behaviour. Sudden, severe 'get off' bucks are always pain or panic related (if panic, it's usually to get you to drop the reins so they can run). On one rein only, in canter only, I would be almost certain she's pulled something in the field, and her back or another muscle somewhere is damaged. That or she's changed shape enough that her saddle is digging in somewhere, perhaps tipping forward and digging into her withers, or just too tight.

Vets often find it harder to find that sort of thing than 'back people' as they don't see it so often. Most people will call physio or give the horse time off rather than calling the vet. My pony is out on loan atm and one day she just started cow kicking and bucking in trot. She's never done that before. Vet checked her and found nothing. We went to see and there was a lot of tightness in her back so they got the back person (Physio I think) out. They found the problem. Box rest and controlled exercise and she should slowly come right again.

My mare has ski-ed down the hill in this weather and the muscles behind her shoulder blades are tight as anything. I'm sure she'd buck me off if I tried to ride her.

Before you make decisions based on this episode, find out what's wrong with your horse. Then, based on her overall suitability and behaviour, make your decision.
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I really agree with this post. I had the horse of my dreams on loan and she had a bucking fit which gave me the worst fall I have ever had in my life (despite the fact I work with race horses). Her owner up and sold her underneath me declaring her 'dangerous' without asking 'why'. As I was laid up in bed I couldn't fight it and my husband asked me not to. Animals never pre-meditate like humans do, they react to stimuli, no matter how bad it looks. Having said all that if you have lost confidence in her totally the French option is at least there.
 
I think only you can come to the decision. But maybe have everything checked first before making a decision.
If all is ok then in my opinion horses cost too much for you not to enjoy them and maybe with this lady might be an option for you to have some space and maybe have some lessons on a schoolmaster type or a horse that a friend has that you are confident on to try and get some confidence back.

I myself had a horse that really knocked my confidence it got to the point where I dreaded going to ride him. I dont mind horses that buck and have strops but for some reason I did not trust him, tried having lessons with good instructors which helped a little but still I didnt enjoy the horse. After having him a fair while I decided that enough was enough. It wasnt fair to me or the horse and sold him to someone that clicked and he is doing fantastic now.

Best decision I ever made, he was solely a horse to go and jump he didnt like to hack just wanted to be worked all the time. But I think you have to make the decision yourself and maybe if you have lessons again and enjoy horses you may realise the horse is not for you given nothing is wrong medically with her.
 
Even without the bucking and whether there's a good reason for it, she isn't the horse you want her to be. You've given her time and effort to come right but it hasn't worked. I'd send her off to France obviously depending if the place is good and look for a horse that will give you the confidence you need that you can go out and have fun on. Don't get me wrong it sounds like you've done a great job with her so far but realistically do you think you will ever be able to turn her into the horse you want her to be?
 
Am I hearing right? You got bucked off so you are sending the mare abroad?? I wouldnt encourage that at all.... you are young and fit.. hop back on and work through it girl :)
 
sometimes we just got to admit that things haven't clicked into place like they should and it's time to move on, you've given it plenty of time and come along way but she's still not the horse you dream about. Nothing wrong with that, it's just life, we don't get along with every person we meet and i think this goes for horses too.
Don't feel bad if you decide it's time to part with her, theres no point on having a horse you can't enjoy:)
 
mystiandsunny said:
Whether you send her to France has to be decided based on her overall behaviour. Sudden, severe 'get off' bucks are always pain or panic related (if panic, it's usually to get you to drop the reins so they can run). On one rein only, in canter only, I would be almost certain she's pulled something in the field, and her back or another muscle somewhere is damaged. That or she's changed shape enough that her saddle is digging in somewhere, perhaps tipping forward and digging into her withers, or just too tight.

Vets often find it harder to find that sort of thing than 'back people' as they don't see it so often. Most people will call physio or give the horse time off rather than calling the vet. My pony is out on loan atm and one day she just started cow kicking and bucking in trot. She's never done that before. Vet checked her and found nothing. We went to see and there was a lot of tightness in her back so they got the back person (Physio I think) out. They found the problem. Box rest and controlled exercise and she should slowly come right again.

My mare has ski-ed down the hill in this weather and the muscles behind her shoulder blades are tight as anything. I'm sure she'd buck me off if I tried to ride her.

Before you make decisions based on this episode, find out what's wrong with your horse. Then, based on her overall suitability and behaviour, make your decision.
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Excellent advice.
 
Thanks for all the advice. I don't mean it to sound like I would pack her off to France simply because she bucked me off one day, it's just another thing in a list of issues which I've had to work through and which I'm not sure will ever end. It was odd because the lady in France had emailed me during my lesson (I very rarely hear from her) so it was strange to come back to that having just been tipped off!

I do intend to get back on Belle, although I will be very nervous. But first I would like to have her back checked as I really feel that this can't be sheer naughtiness, no matter what all the more experienced people say. I just don't see what after more than a year and a half of never bucking, she would suddenly try repeatedly to have me off (specifically when always on the left). The more I think about it, the more I just can't believe that she would suddenly be so intent to get me off without good cause. She is not a nasty horse, when I have fallen before it has always been because she was afraid of something or caught me off guard, not because she was intentionally trying to dump me.

I appreciate all your thoughts and will be thinking on it long and hard. It would seem a shame to give up now when she really is a lovely mare and her hacking HAS improved. I do think she could be a horse to hack alone eventually, I'm just not sure I have enough experience and ability to deal with all the issues which crop up. I think I was also a bit humiliated that experienced friend had come to watch me for the first time, just to see my horse tanking around the school and me getting tipped off. Then another more experienced rider stopped to watch too. My legs were just shaking and it just wasn't a nice experience.

*ponders*
 
You have to be a partner with your horse and some times the two of you do not gel. I really wouldn't feel guilty about this. You are entitled to enjoy the hobby you pay so much for. Finding Belle the right home where she will get fun and enjoyment out of life too might be the best thing for both of you. But do NOT beat yourself up.
 
I agree, don't beat yourself up about it. As said before, it's too an expensive a hobby to not enjoy.
I think I'd rule out the possibility of a problem & also ask one of the experienced riders you know to ride her for you.

This may have been the last straw for you & I completely understand how you feel. Once you have lost trust in a horse it's not easy to regain. If there's no physical problem I'd be tempted to let her go & find something more suitable. This could drag on for months & the outcome could be the same.
 
Trish C said:
:( Sorry you're having troubles :(

I'm with the posters above - I think if you send her away you will have a) peace of mind knowing that she's safe, b) will learn how you really feel about her/the situation and c) it might give you the opportunity to maybe get some lessons on a really safe, steady horse who can give you your confidence back? That way if/when Belle comes back to you, you might be in a better position to deal with her, confidence-wise. :)

Really hope it works out, whatever you decide. You obviously love her very much and only want what's best for her, which is incredibly admirable. But don't disregard your own happiness as well. Best of luck pet :)
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Ditto this. I've had a horse a bit like Belle and made the decision to sell him, he was too much for me and it is hard to admit it, but for the best. If a horse can't or won't do what you really want it to do (like me, you want to hack alone) then it'd be best to move on and find another, knowing Belle will have a good life elsewhere.
My ex horse is now doing great with his new, brave owners and I'm sure Belle will too, and you can find a more sensible chilled out horse who hacks alone confidently.

Good luck and hold your head up high, there is a lot of hope for a good outcome here.
 
I'm sorry you have lost your confidence, as another person who has lost their confidence I know how hard it is.

I personally would not send her away to breed from her though. If she has issues (ridden and non ridden) and you said she is likely to have more problems then I don't think breeding from her is a good idea. Too many unwanted foals as it is. I'm sorry if this is not what you wanted to hear.

Is there a local RS? you could perhaps have a couple of lessons their just to get your confidence up then ask someone to put you on the lunge with Belle?

Whatever you deicde, good luck.
 
Ahhh that's a horrible situation to be in, I hope you weren't too sore after your fall!

Having had a couple of naughty horses, my best advice is that you now know what Belle CAN do, not necessarily what she will do. If you get on her and she's not going forward, or it's windy and she's a bit fresh, you know the worst that can happen. If you think it's going to affect your riding to the extent that when she pulls your leg, instead of being firm and riding her through it, you back down because you're worried she'll rodeo again, I would say France sounds like the best option :(

But if the worst case scenario is one you're prepared to deal with - as in, if you pushed her and it happened again, but you learned to sit it out and it didn't ruin your confidence - then work with your instructor to figure out exactly how to get to the bottom of what went wrong, and what the triggers are. Usually if you look hard enough, you'll find the triggers, and then it's a case of deciding if you're prepared to work round them e.g. just don't ride if it's blowing a gale!!

That said, if it was completely out of the blue I will bet the rapidly shrinking contents of my bank account that her back's out. let us know what the vet says! And bear in mind even after the physical problem's gone (if there is one) it might take a while for Belle to forget that last time you rode it hurt, so it might be worth sticking her on the lunge and then just walking exercise while she realises she feels good again :)
 
I really feel for you because I can tell how much you love this mare. I've seen my daughter go through the same thing with hers too.

People say it costs just as much money to keep the wrong (for you) horse as it does to keep the right (for you) one but in my own experience I'd say sometimes it costs even more to keep the wrong horse because you're always searching for that magic key to make it work. To give you an idea of what I mean, here's a list of all the things we tried, some made a huge difference and it was great to see progress:

Bowen Therapy
McTimony
Osteopath
Remedial Farriery
Regumate
Gastroguard
Animal Communicator
Scan of reproductive system
An endless supply of Supplements and Calmers
Lessons with 3 different instructors
A bajillion bits
Single breast bar for trailer
2 changes of yard
Countless saddle fit checks

On the positive side of owning a horse that challenges you- my daughter would never have learned so much, had so many great experiences, met such great people and mastered so many of her fears and when things went well it was awesome.

With the wisdom of hindsight all I can say is that some horses/riders do get through all kinds of challenges successfully, if you can sit through it and send her forward til she gets the idea. If you keep Belle I hope you'll be one of those, but equally, like that old song says "you got to know when to fold 'em" sometimes too.
 
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Thanks for all this great advice, you're all super!

Vet came today, jabs were due anyway so seemed sensible to get her to take a look. Belle showed no signs of being sore anywhere across her back but was very stiff flexing around to the side, particularly on the left (her neck often clicks that way too). She trotted up sound at first but was lame in both hocks after flexion tests, particularly on the lunge where it was very noticeable on both reins.

She is definitely in season today and vet suggested that ovulation may have meant she had a sore back, in addition to the hock stiffness, which could have resulted in the bucking. I have to say that Belle was an absolute angel for the vet and although we never lunge, she went straight out on it and started trotting round. She motors along and, especially on the left, sticks her head to the outside and falls in (and she is like this when ridden).

Vet has suggested 3 weeks off ridden work with me doing lots of suppling exercises in hand. She also thought that Cortaflex would help the hocks and a magnesium based supplement for the hormonal madness. If after 3 weeks there is no improvement then a physiotherapist is advised.

I really get the impression after having told people this today that they thought I made it up and that I'm just afraid to get back on her. I will be nervous to get back on her but I'm not avoiding it, even if I do decide she's not the horse for me then I want to try and work through this problem if possible.
 
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