Grey Mare is Still Lame - Tildren / Puzzlement

MrsMozart

MrsMozart

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Posted in CR as she was meant to be D1's showjumper :cool:! But then remembered I'd posted in here originally :rolleyes:

Eight weeks since her last visit to Oakham (life got in the way).

Still as lame as was, possibly worse on right rein on a circle :(

Vet been back over MRI scan and x-rays. Can't see anything but the sidebone; he's sending off for a second opinion. We're not 100% sure what's wrong, other than 'bony changes and inflammation. She's been lame for about four months now.

Saw the specialist farrier, new front shoes on. Had Tildren into the hoof.

Vet proposed working GM when the ground is not so soggy/frozen (delete as applicable!), but I'm wary of that as a) he wants a quiet and steady walk, which GM is not renown for(!), and b) on the right rein she is, according to D, almost falling over :(

Now reading up on Tildren. GM had the anti colic drug, so hopefully she'll be okay. Warned the YO who'll keep an eye on her tonight.

Moving the neds to a yard where we'll have a hard turnout area, so she can be out of her stable but not on mud/slippery ground.

Fingers very tightly crossed that the Tildren is effective. Not sure what life will hold otherwise.

Back to vet's in five weeks.*
 
Sorry no experience of sidebone, so can't help there but I do have experience of not knowing what's wrong, so can and do sympathise. Fingers crossed for someone to make some sense of the x-rays for you.
 
My one and only very limited experience of sidebone is that the horse stayed sound if only worked on surfaces but not if it was worked on grass (although turnout for a few hours a day was ok as long as no hooning around). It was managed so that the horse stayed sound enough to compete at a decent level. Sorry that's not particularly helpful but at least my comment bumps this up a bit for you and might encourage someone else to reply who has more experience of managing it :confused:
 
I have a mare with sidebones! She has them in both fronts, as well as DJD & high ringbone of the short pastern in the RF and slight navicular changes in the LF.
Sidebones have never really been an issue for my mare, I will ad on a photo of her xray on the LF for you to see how impressive her sidebones really are ;)

My mare had tildren on September 28th this year as the vet says even though she wants lame she was the perfect candidate as it would help her many probelms. I am not too sure about it you saying she had it in the hoof? Do you mean administered into the hoof? Tildren is generally administered through a drip into the neck over about an hour? :confused:

My vet says the sidebones wont effect her all the time they aren't touching anything else within the foot. I do know they can cause lameness whilst forming, once formed they generally dont cause a problem.

My mare is 100% sound, on half a sachet of bute per day (she doesn't need it but it puts my mind at rest :rolleyes:) as well as glucosamine supplement and corn oil. Can work her on any ground and you wouldn't know there was anything wrong with her! Many people have asked me if there is even anything wrong with her or if I am fibbing as they are sure she is fine :o

I will ad in ym xrays if I can find them!
 
Here are 2 of the xrays of my horses LF taken on September 28th this year.
These aren't as impressive as the ones on the RF but you get the idea :)

xray2LF.png


xray1LF.png
 
Thank you :D

Sorry, my confusion re the hoof :cool:. I wasn't there and misunderstood how where the Tildren was administered.

Those x-rays are fascinating! I'm waiting for the vet to send GM's over.

Glad your mare is doing so well :)

I spoke to my vet today. She's spoken to the Oakham vet and very kindly explained things to me in words of one sylable :)

I can work her (lunge as won't risk ridden) and report to Oakham vet on Monday, let him know how she goes.

Will keep you updated.
 
That's ok, they are rather fascinating :)

When my horse had Tildren my vet told me that continuing work really helps with the progress of it, I worked my mare as usual from 2 days after it was administered! So maybe mention this to your vet?

I know that some horses cope with some things better than others, I guess I am very lucky with how well my mare is doing with her various problems but I think everybody wprks out their own ways to deal with certain issues that works best with their own horse.

It would be good to get a second opinion to see if anything else is spotted! So good luck with that :)

Also to ad, my mare is now barefoot! I know that, again, this is something which works for some and not for others and some horses cope and some don't etc but it could be another avenue worth looking at!
 
So good to hear your mare doing so well :) :)

She was barefoot and will go back to it :)

Vet has said stead work, only she doesn't do steady at all! Plus until I've seen that the Tildrn is having an effect, it's not safe to put a rider on. When on the right rein she's lame to the point of almost falling over :( My vet has said we can lunge her this weekend, so we'll try and see how she goes :)
 
I really hope the Tildren works for your horse as well as it has worked for mine! I noticed very quickly with my mare, but I know some can take a few weeks/month to notice a difference.
 
Update 08/12/12:

Spoke to my vet yesterday. She said lunge GM Saturday and Sunday and report back to Oakham vet on Monday.

We started to lunge, but on the right rein in trot she's as lame as ever, no difference; stopped as surface not great and she is so obviously not happy or comfortable, plus there's a chance she'll fall over.

My vet said it could take a good week for the Tildren to kick in. Been two and a half days, so fingers crossed the next few days shows a marked difference.

We're wondering if it's something higher up, although she came almost sound on the off-fore when nerve blocked, but was lame on the near-fore (though not as badly).

Last shoeing and this showing has made no difference. This shoeing different to last in respect
of breakover.

Am open to any and all suggestions!

Had her for two years;

Know her life history and she's never been lame or had any issues, other than being a very highly strung horse;

Lameness came on suddenly approx four months;

Been barefoot for three years. No issues apart from off-hind balance went out once;

Showjumper, but light use;

Fourteen year old IDxTB;

Stressy. Does not do calm and steady without an awful lot of work;

Highly sensitive to sugars, goes whappy on them (180 degree leaps in the air, handstand bucks, etc.);

Fed on hay, grass, Top Spec Balancer;

No difference to lameness if box / field / paddock rest;

Went to Oakham eight weeks ago;

MRI of off-fore after nerveblocks and x-rays;

Sidebone, but reasonably well developed, i.e. longer than the then two months of lameness;

MRI showed activity (I think that's the word) by the Sidebone, hence the shoeing, then back for Tildren and different shoeing;

No improvment between first and second shoeing (eight weeks apart) so now had Tildren,

Hm. Can't think what more info one might need. Tried to video movement, but light too bad today. Will try again tomorrow.

If anyone has any ideas I'd like to hear them. I know we have good vets and farriers, but there might be something the team hasn't thought of/come across before.

Thank you.
 
This will sound a bit off the wall (at best) but I'd take her off all feed except hay and grass. When we realised that my TBX mare was completely intolerant of sugar and cereals it was because sis had read an article in Your Horse (I think) about a chronically lame horse. The owner found out,can't remember how, that it was feed which was causing the lameness. When the problem feed was eliminated, the lameness was cured. I have no idea what is in Top Spec balancer but any- one can be intolerant of any feed. In fact she could even struggle to tolerate grass, I believe Shils had/has a grass intolerant horse.
 
Fingers crossed!
Does she get any treats at all? Or supplements? Or fed by passersby? It is amazing, both what they can be sensitive to and what people will feed them. I've had someone feeding mine whole loaves of bread, boiled sweets and chicken-flavoured crisps!!:eek::eek::eek::confused:
 
Yikes!

No. Nobody around to give her anything.

I wonder if having her bloods checked might be a plan, though not for sure what they'd look for. Just want the daft hoss to be okay, hate seeing her like this.
 
How is your horse getting on now? I am assuming it has been over aweek since the Tildren, have you seen any improvement?

I lost track of this thread, but have to agree thermal imaging is a very good idea with you not knowing where the problem is. I dont think sidebone would cause the lameness when as your vet has said, it is well developed already! Themral imaging wills how you where there is heat, and where you should be investigating for any problems causing the lameness.

I was considering it for my horse, but as she is sound for now I am trying my best not to fiddle :o I know somebody who had it done recently though on a foreleg and they were very impressed! Spotted a problem area which the vet didn't, he was looking elsewhere in the leg :)
 
Sorry, Life been getting in the way again, not helped by slipping on icy steps on landing on the elbow of the arm with the broken wrist and two clients wanting my undivided attention. Ho hum. Still, what doesn't kill will make one stronger as they say :D

No improvement as of two days ago, which was a week since the Tildren. Oakham vet says give it two to three weeks. He's convinced it's in the hoof. I'm not so convinced (though I'm no vet!), so I'm looking for a thermal imaging and hoping the insurance will pay for it.

We've moved yards so she can be out 24/7. It doesn't make any difference to the lameness per se, but Oakham vet still said he wanted gentle exercise on a soft surface (to reduce any concussion). Got him to understand that this horse doesn't do steady and calm and that if ridden there would most definitely be concussion to the hoof! Also, that I wasn't going to put a rider up on a so obviously lame horse who trips and stumbles :( Hence the compromise of her being out 24/7. She's happy to move round so long as she can go at her speed/pace/direction.

I have pictures of her hooves and a video of her movement. Can get the pictures on via Photobucket, but how do I get the video on here? I'm not brill with YouTube, as in I watch videos on there, but have no idea how to put them up.
 
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