Ground Collection

[wildriding1]

Just thought Id ask what everyone thought about ground collecting from stallions? Has anybody trained/had their stallion trained to collect using this method? Would be interestred to hear peoples opinions on this! Thanks.

 

[ESH_Jess]

Speak to Jamie Anderson from Equine Reproduction.co.uk He is fantastic, very knowledgeable and second to none service. He trains stallion very successfully for ground collection and dummy collection. He is 'Andypandy' on here

 

[AndyPandy]

Thanks Jess

Pip - ground collection is an excellent "alternative" method of collecting semen. It is especially useful for stallions who have back or hind leg injuries.

Below is a write-up from Kathy St Martin of Equine-Reproduction.com about ground collection which you might find useful:

"Ground collecting of stallions has been used safely and effectively for more than 30 years, with articles published in the Journal of Theriogenology as early as 1988. While it is certainly extremely useful in stallions that have back, hock, stifle and hind end issues or pain, it can also be an extremely effective and safe method for collecting the healthy stallion! Indeed, with a stallion that is well trained to the method, it is our preferred method of collection as it is so much more safe than doing collections on a jump mare or breeding mount. Many stallions can be easily trained to collect without the need of a mare present and it eliminates hooves swinging around the AV handler's head when the stallion is mounting, or in the event the stallion dismount quickly or sideways over the top of the AV handler. With ground collecting, if the stallion shows dissatisfaction with the method, the AV handler simply steps back and away from the stallion.

The method is well documented and researched as extremely useful for stallions with back and lameness issues. Indeed, for stallions with pain issues on collection with traditional methods, a better quality ejaculate is often obtained using ground collection. With a stallion that experiences back, stifle or hock pain during collection, a partial ejaculate is a common sequela; as pain for those horses is reduced or eliminated with ground collection, it has been demonstrated that complete ejaculates are more likely to be obtained (McDonnell et. al.). It has been our experience that performance stallions will often benefit from ground collecting as it eliminates the usual "wear and tear" on stifles, hocks and backs that traditional methods of collection and breeding tend to produce. A top jumper performance stallion that we routinely collect (3 to 4 times a week during the height of breeding season) showed less pain issues when collected on the ground over collecting on a breeding mount.

Dr. Sue McDonnell (University of Pennsylvania, New Bolton) has done a considerable amount of research on the method, including articles that have appeared in AAEP proceedings and Journal of Theriogenology

- References and Footnotes

1. Crump J, Crump J. Stallion ejaculation induced by manual stimulation of the penis. Theriogenology 1989;31:341-346.

2. McDonnell SM, Love CC. Manual stimulation collection of semen from stallions: training time, sexual behavior and semen. Theriogenology 1990;33(6):1201-1210.

RM Kenney, WL Cooper, personal communication.


As with any kind of collection method, there are some stallions for which the method it is not appropriate. Stallions suffering from neurological disorders that make them unstable under ANY circumstances are not suitable candidates, for example. However, for most stallions, it is not only an easy and effective method of collection, it is also considerably safer than more traditional methods".

Speaking from personal experience, we have trained about 20 stallions to ground collect in the last 2 years. Some take to it like a duck to water, others can take a little longer... but those that take can become very easy, simple ground collectors!

Hope that info helps.

 

[wildriding1]

Thanks for that Andypandy.
I have a stallion that is trained to the dummy already, but he can be a bit on and off with the dummy, he either gets on with it straight off or messes about getting on and off and we often have to put him away and try again later. He did have a back injury and has recently been 'fixed' by a great physio. Haven't tried him on the dummy this year yet, so hoping for some improvement if his injury was the reason behind his messing about, or he may just be like that anyway1

I also have another stallion who has only ever covered naturally, he is 8 this year, but I want to collect from him also. Thought about training him to the dummy, but quite fancied training him to ground collect. He often sorts himself out in his stable, wether that would make him any easier to train I don't know?!!!

I have read mixed reviews on ground collection, some saying it can cause back and joint problems due to the un-natural position the stallion adopts and the strain on his back and hind legs. Would you advise using this method if the stallion has no physical reason not to mount a dummy?

Lastly (sorry to rabble on!) have you any tips or information or links where I can find out how to train my stallions myself for ground collection and dummy mare training?

Thanks alot for your help

 

[AndyPandy]

There's only really one way to find out about whether or not a stallion will take to ground collecting, and that is to have him professionally trained.

As with any type of collecting, I would recommend that they are trained by someone with a good deal of experience in that particular type of collection. I know that I have a commercial interest in this, but we have to "fix" quite a few stallions each year where people have tried to train them (dummy or ground collecting) and put them off!

Although there are people in the UK who say that ground collection can cause injury to the stallion, I have yet to experience this. I would also note that Dr McDonnell, and the guys at Equine-Reproduction.com have not seen it either, and they do a good deal more ground collecting than anyone over here!!

You will find training information on Equine-Reproduction.com in their articles section, but as above I would strongly recommend that you get a professional with ground collection experience involved if you want to go down that route... it will make the whole process easier and safer!

Cheers

 

[maestro]

We did ground collection off our stallion for 3 years as he would not jump a dummy. It worked very well at the begining of each season but became more tricky as he got bored towards the end and took a lot more persuading. We stopped for three reasons. It became very stressful and time consuming if we didnt get it right first time. My daughter who was the only one he would perform for developed a repetitive injury in her shoulder with the collecting and my stallion actually was pulling muscles over his back which probably why he became reluctant.
For not toomany collections it is Im sure a very good way to collect but it is every bit as risky as any means of collection if not done very carefully.