head shaking :(

Horsekaren

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Well, yesterday i was working with all the tips given and we was making progress with a steady contact and an active trot buuuuut as i walked him out of his field i noticed he was tossing his head around a bit, i thought o no and when ridden the shake is now coming back, tossing and itching nose.

I know it isnt the bridle as he hasnt done any shaking since August. He hasnt suddenly gone on to grass so nothing has changed. I noticed the pollen levels were at medium for the first time so its got to be something to do with that.

Last year we tried a net which helped but seemed to annoy him.
It did get quiet severe last May so i let him take it easy.

What can i do now?

Full fly masks on all day? bridle mask? I have read a bit about Cetrizine, is this safe to try without speaking to my vet?


Any advice? or should this be straight to the vet.... again .. :(
 

ihatework

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Sounds like it’s seasonal pollen related if it’s happening at a similar time of year.

I’d try the nose net again.

Also a friend manages her head shaker sufficiently using a combination of nostril vet (a powder that gets squirted up the nose and lines the nasal passage) and smearing Vaseline around the nostril rim. The horse events at top level and wears a nose net in the warm up but then has to obviously loose it in the ring.
 

Caol Ila

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I just spoke to two of the vets leading research into headshaking in the UK for an HHO article. At some point a long article will appear here. Anyway, if it is headshaking caused by misfiring of the trigeminal nerve (and not any other reason), it isn't caused by pollen or allergies. It's what they call neuropathic pain -- the nerve is oversensitised and firing pain signals into the brain when there is no actual painful stimulus. It's speculated that stuff in the air like pollen or whatever can stimulate the nerve to cause pain, but the question is why it's misfiring in the first the place. The nerve is just screwing up. It's why bute doesn't fix it.

In many horses (60% I think is the number they gave me) it's seasonal, and that's one of the mysteries of the condition, because vets have no clue why. Four out of five headshakers only do it when ridden or lunged. But again, they don't know why it's worse with exercise in many (but not all) cases. One of the vets I talked to is running a five-year study of 168 horses and has 88 variables she is tracking, and can't find a pattern. But they know it's not typical allergies because the drugs (i.e. citrizine and various steroids) they give to treat that don't work in trigeminal-mediated headshakers.

If a nose net works, great. It works for about 25% of horses by stimulating the nerves with a steady pressure, which overrides the neuropathic pain. Same mechanism as rubbing your elbow when you hit it.

If it doesn't work, you really need a full work-up and a CT scan to diagnose it as a trigeminal-mediated headshaker. The CT scans and other diagnostics eliminate everything else, as there can be many causes of head pain. The University of Bristol is pretty much leading the work on this. If it's diagnosed, there are treatments that involve stimulating the nerve with an electric probe that works roughly half the time. Bristol is also beginning a new trial with an amino acid treatment that has stabilised nerves in humans, cats, and rats, and they are currently looking for trigeminal-mediated headshakers to participate in the study. Obviously the horse would need the full diagnostic work-up to make sure that it has this condition, and not any other, but might be worth thinking about. The PI at Bristol is really nice.
 

mavandkaz

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My boy is a seasonal headshaker, although will still have bad days in the winter depending on the weather. When I first bought him he was nearly unrideable.
From spring to autumn he is ridden in a fly veil and nose net. It took him a while to get used to it but is now no bother, although he does breath differently in the nose net.
He is turned out in a full fly mask which covers his nostrils
He is also on a supplement from hack up bespoke which makes a huge difference.
We compete in dressage with very few problems, and if it wasn't for the nose net you would never suspect him of being a headshaker.
 

splashgirl45

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i discovered my old mare had a reaction to rape and it was quite violent if she didnt wear a nose net...she even did it in the field when we had rape fields all around our yard. i moved yards (not for that reason) and went to one with no rape in the area and she never head shook again even in the middle of the pollen season. it was only rape which caused it for her....
 

milliepops

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My retired horse was a headshaker after getting a bee sting up her nose. She didn't get on with the nose nets as they were really irritating so I'm just mentioning this in case . A full face riding net really helped her so if you think a normal fly mask makes a difference when he's in the field i would try one of those for riding. She wasn't affected by pollen etc but by the strength of sunlight (photic headshaker). She was better on dull overcast days or later in the evening but bright spring/summer days were difficult without a mask on.

She was insured and I was offered to have her scanned as the insurance would cover it, but tbh I was able to manage it quite well and wouldn't have opted for invasive treatment for her.
 

ITPersonnage

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cetirizine hydrochloride would be my first try, my vet recommended 30 a day for my TB mare who is allergic to pollen. She doesn't so much head shake as gets out of breath May to November but the cetirizine hydrochloride stops it completely. I get mine from Amazon (12 months supply for human but only 12 days for ned)
 

BBP

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I use cetirizine (I just use 8-10 per day for a 400kg horse). The only ones vets were allowed to prescribe would have cost £300 for 2-3 weeks worth. I asked if I could try these and they said they weren’t tested for horses so they couldn’t recommend but that they shouldn’t hurt. With them and a nose net it really helps. I also take it easy on days when he is clearly unhappy.
 

Horsekaren

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I use cetirizine (I just use 8-10 per day for a 400kg horse). The only ones vets were allowed to prescribe would have cost £300 for 2-3 weeks worth. I asked if I could try these and they said they weren’t tested for horses so they couldn’t recommend but that they shouldn’t hurt. With them and a nose net it really helps. I also take it easy on days when he is clearly unhappy.

This is what I’m worried about, I know it’s pollen, it has to be. I don’t want to call the vet out and they charge me a fortune for something which I can try myself, I’m just nervous.
 

Mister Ted

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Well, yesterday i was working with all the tips given and we was making progress with a steady contact and an active trot buuuuut as i walked him out of his field i noticed he was tossing his head around a bit, i thought o no and when ridden the shake is now coming back, tossing and itching nose.

I know it isnt the bridle as he hasnt done any shaking since August. He hasnt suddenly gone on to grass so nothing has changed. I noticed the pollen levels were at medium for the first time so its got to be something to do with that.

Last year we tried a net which helped but seemed to annoy him.
It did get quiet severe last May so i let him take it easy.

What can i do now?

Full fly masks on all day? bridle mask? I have read a bit about Cetrizine, is this safe to try without speaking to my vet?


Any advice? or should this be straight to the vet.... again .. :(
I am sure it is the pollen and can be tricky problem to resolve.I would go on the web ..theres a fair bit of research going on about headshaking and you can glean some advice/trials etc.From what I read a couple of years ago its not just the pollen but nerves in the face that are affected which causes pain hence the head rubbing and tossing.
I read up a bit about it when a thoroughbred in the same field as mine and whom I helped look after was troubled every Spring with this.The field was surrounded by pine trees and the pollen was coming off the new growth in yellow clouds. At one stage the horse dunked his whole head straight in the water trough.! The misery for him lasted the whole summer and relief was obvious after that.He seemed to be the only one affected out the herd.A fly mask would be rubbed off it he had worn one as he always tried to rub his head on something or someone to relive the pain of the nerves irritating his face.
 

ITPersonnage

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Dose from vet was "Cetirizine dose is 0.2-0.4mg/ kg twice daily. " so for 500 kg horse between 10 and 20 tablets 10mg twice daily, hence 30 a day (split into two feeds) seems to do the trick for mine, relatively cheap to try, I found almost immediate relief for my girl.
 

ILuvCowparsely

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Well, yesterday i was working with all the tips given and we was making progress with a steady contact and an active trot buuuuut as i walked him out of his field i noticed he was tossing his head around a bit, i thought o no and when ridden the shake is now coming back, tossing and itching nose.

I know it isnt the bridle as he hasnt done any shaking since August. He hasnt suddenly gone on to grass so nothing has changed. I noticed the pollen levels were at medium for the first time so its got to be something to do with that.

Last year we tried a net which helped but seemed to annoy him.
It did get quiet severe last May so i let him take it easy.

What can i do now?

Full fly masks on all day? bridle mask? I have read a bit about Cetrizine, is this safe to try without speaking to my vet?


Any advice? or should this be straight to the vet.... again .. :(
Some things here https://h0rseservices.weebly.com/h.html
 

PonyIAmNotFood

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I have a head shaker, cetirizine hydrochloride helps her (Ebay it, I just got 360 tablets for about £12). I also give her salt and a small amount of magnesium oxide (apparently sometimes linked to quieting the nerve?). Limestone flour is another thing to try as well for the calcium/alkaline levels. There are some brilliant pages if you Google it, horrendous condition though so I hope you get a handle on it soon. It's taken me 4 years to work out a combination of supplements that works for my mare, she was quite extreme though and still gets quite bad in November and February.
 

Scarlett

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Well, yesterday i was working with all the tips given and we was making progress with a steady contact and an active trot buuuuut as i walked him out of his field i noticed he was tossing his head around a bit, i thought o no and when ridden the shake is now coming back, tossing and itching nose.

I know it isnt the bridle as he hasnt done any shaking since August. He hasnt suddenly gone on to grass so nothing has changed. I noticed the pollen levels were at medium for the first time so its got to be something to do with that.

Last year we tried a net which helped but seemed to annoy him.
It did get quiet severe last May so i let him take it easy.

What can i do now?

Full fly masks on all day? bridle mask? I have read a bit about Cetrizine, is this safe to try without speaking to my vet?


Any advice? or should this be straight to the vet.... again .. :(


Do you feed salt?

I had a headshaker who was unrideable March-June and would get himself in a right state. We tried him on Mycosorb and added salt and it has improved 90%.

We did use Cetrizine for a few years with some success but not a cure.

I read about it on the Calm Healthy Horses website. I have since sold him but his new owner has kept him on both and adds AlleviateC when the grass is coming through, he's remained fine throughout.
 

Horsekaren

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I'm not feeding any salt at present. As of Saturday evening i have put him on Cetrizine 10 tablets in the morning 5 at night and i have popped a fly mask on him.
I'm really hoping this helps him!
 

Fransurrey

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I wonder if given the link between the trigeminal nerve and headshaking, would it help to put on a snuggy hood head piece under the bridle? Or similar head, like the ones used to keep the face clean before a show? I'm thinking Snuggy Hood, as they're quite thick and heavy, so would be more effective at deadening the irritation (if it is indeed akin to rubbing the elbow after banging it, as said above!). Just an idea!
 

kc921

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I use a nose net, but i cut out the bottom as it made my boy feel closed in and then he also wears a fly mask over his bridle. works like a charm and stops the head shaking
 
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