Heartbar shoes

Kat

Kat

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I've no experience of remedial shoes so can everyone tell me of their knowledge and experience of heartbars. Pros, cons, uses, things to be aware of etc etc.

Thanks
 
Loll has them on periodically - she's got fairly rubbish heels in front having done her best to remove one of them previously :rolleyes: so has them to give some extra support and encourage the heel to grow down.
They should be removed and refit/replaced as a normal shoe and you need to ensure when you pick the feet out that there's nothing caught under the back of the shoe - which shouldn't happen if they're fitted well tbh.
As with much in the horseworld - they're a useful tool if fitted and used correctly, when people have problems it's usually because they've left them on too long.
 
Personally, i hate them and will never go down that road again. My mare was in them for about 4 years (maybe longer!), but was still on-off lame. The slightest bit of hard ground and she'd be set back months.

I had the shoes removed and went down the barefoot road. Once off, and we could see her frogs properly, i realised how bad her feet were. Her frogs had practically rotted away into nothingness.

On

f780e0cf.jpg


Just off

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2 weeks later

2011-09-27171230.jpg


September 2012 (1 year later)

2012-09-16165401.jpg


It's a struggle with her living out 24/7 and all this rain we've had! Aesthetically, there's still a way to go (they're better now than they are in that sept pic)...but she's sound & in full work so that's the most important thing!
Knowing what i know now, I dont see the point in heartbars - going barefoot does better than the heartbars are designed to try to do.

Ps - she was originally shod in them after a soft tissue diagnosis.
 
H-I-A - I remember you posted about your horse before and I showed the pics to my farrier dad, his response... he'd never had a horse have heartbars on for that long, they're a short term solution and he was surprised your farrier & vet hadn't looked at something else long before the feet got to that state.
 
They cause weakening and atrophy of the frog and caudal hoof, which are the very things they're intended to 'support'. I would never use them, personally, as they never achieve anything - the hoof can only grow weaker in them.
 
Lanky Loll said:
H-I-A - I remember you posted about your horse before and I showed the pics to my farrier dad, his response... he'd never had a horse have heartbars on for that long, they're a short term solution and he was surprised your farrier & vet hadn't looked at something else long before the feet got to that state.
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LL, I was surprised too...once i looked into it. At the time, i was clueless and just did as they said :o But now i say "No, woman! I am not putting them back on and i ain't putting wedges on her either!!" :D Now that's she's been sound for so long, she's given up trying to tell me that i'm wrong :)
 
My boy has had them on for the last 9 months (he has rotation caused by laminitis) and he is shod every four weeks - without fail. He has improved so much with them but I won't know for another few months when I have the next round of X-rays if they have done enough to enable him to be ridden again.
 
here_i_am said:
Personally, i hate them and will never go down that road again. My mare was in them for about 4 years (maybe longer!), but was still on-off lame. The slightest bit of hard ground and she'd be set back months.

I had the shoes removed and went down the barefoot road. Once off, and we could see her frogs properly, i realised how bad her feet were. Her frogs had practically rotted away into nothingness.

On

f780e0cf.jpg


Just off

DSC04431.jpg


2 weeks later

2011-09-27171230.jpg


September 2012 (1 year later)

2012-09-16165401.jpg


It's a struggle with her living out 24/7 and all this rain we've had! Aesthetically, there's still a way to go (they're better now than they are in that sept pic)...but she's sound & in full work so that's the most important thing!
Knowing what i know now, I dont see the point in heartbars - going barefoot does better than the heartbars are designed to try to do.

Ps - she was originally shod in them after a soft tissue diagnosis.
Click to expand...

This sounds like a similar story to my pony. He had raised heart bars on for approx 3 years despite me continually asking my farrier if we could go back to normal shoes. He kept telling me that this would cause my pony problems. I finally wised up when pony went lame yet again (he had a tear to his ddft) and I decided that if he wouldn't stay sound I'd retire him and if he was going to retire I'd take the shoes off. After 5 months he is sound, his feet are really beginning to look good and I'm bringing him back into work.

His frogs looked very similar to yours when the shoes were first removed and I felt sick to the stomach that I'd allowed myself to be persauded that these shoes were a good idea but when you've got vets and farriers telling you this is the only way to go it's very hard to argue.

Thankfully, this forum gave me a lot of help and information and we're now well on the way to my pony having the hooves he needs and I wouldn't let those shoes near him again, ever.
 
Kat said:
This was the sort of thing I was concerned I might read. :(
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What have they been recommended for? At the end of the day there are various different methods for solving all sorts of problems - heart bars are just one of them, and someone may have an alternative solution that could help. HB's aren't always an issue, as I said I use them on Loll very occasionally.
 
We've had heart bars on for 3 months for mild/moderate pedal bone rotation in both her front feet. I have been told by my farrier they shouldn't stay on for long term. He changes them every 6 weeks and always inspects her foot when they come off. I make sure in the meantime I keep her feet clean and well cared for.
 
Can be slippery going down steep hills on the road. I had a cob in them and that was the main drawback. However he wore them for a long time and they kept him sound.
 
They crippled my horse with rotation to the point I was going to pts.. Changed farrier, alternative shoes on instead, instant comfort.. And only very slight lameness..

Never again..
 
My mare had them on for 3 shoeings (18 weeks) after her one-and-only laminitis attack (frozen grass and over rich haylage) in 2010. They were absolutely brilliant. They gave her the support she needed at the time, I was able to ride her anywhere (most of the bridleways here are old drove roads and very stony); and when the farrier and vet agreed she was ready she went back to normal shoes and has been sound as a bell ever since.

Obviously previous posts have had different experiences, but in my mare's case it was win-win.
 
Nothing good from me either Kat. I am very wary of the word "remedial"...

What exactly are you/farrier/vet trying to fix with these so-say "remedial" shoes ( should really be called "footclamps" as that's what they do... Clamps the foot to death).

I have to add, sometimes they ARE needed for example pedal bone fractures as has been pointed out before by cpt.
 
We've had egg bars, a waste of time and money. Just masked the problem and haven't helped us in the long term. We're now going back to scratch unshod :)
 
tallyho! said:
What exactly are you/farrier/vet trying to fix with these so-say "remedial" shoes ( should really be called "footclamps" as that's what they do... Clamps the foot to death).
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Given that after time out of shoes she is now trotting up sound in hand on concrete and sand and is showing no reaction to hoof testers I don't quite know what the vet wants to acheive with heartbars but she seems quite insistant. I need to talk to them again about the plan.

I'm riding happily in hoof boots and I am happy to continue to do so but the vet wants heart bars.

The slippery on tarmac comment really worries me too as we have steep tarmac hills with smooth slippery tarmac. The horses that are shod all round really struggle unless they have road nails. Then there is the worry of them being pulled off in our deep mud and taking chunks of hoof with them, nevermind concerns about whether they are the appropriate treatment etc.
 
I would talk to them again about what they are trying to achieve? What does the farrier say?

We did eggbars before taking shoes off, they didn't do the frogs much good either tbh and as your mare is doing so well I'm not sure I would want to be putting heartbars on.
 
Kat said:
Given that after time out of shoes she is now trotting up sound in hand on concrete and sand and is showing no reaction to hoof testers I don't quite know what the vet wants to acheive with heartbars but she seems quite insistant. I need to talk to them again about the plan.

I'm riding happily in hoof boots and I am happy to continue to do so but the vet wants heart bars.

The slippery on tarmac comment really worries me too as we have steep tarmac hills with smooth slippery tarmac. The horses that are shod all round really struggle unless they have road nails. Then there is the worry of them being pulled off in our deep mud and taking chunks of hoof with them, nevermind concerns about whether they are the appropriate treatment etc.
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If your horse is sound and you're happy, don't let yourself be bullied into something you're not comfortable with. Just calmly explain that they aren't a treatment plan you are happy to pursue at the moment. I know it can be tough to stand your ground when vets are adamant, but she's your horse, you're paying and you know her best :).
 
Seems a bit odd that if she's sound unshod they want to stick HBs on. What was the original problem Kat? I do know of some alternatives dad's used working with other specialists but all depends on what your vet thinks is there to be "solved" as a problem currently (especially if you're not seeing a problem!)
 
TwoStroke said:
If your horse is sound and you're happy, don't let yourself be bullied into something you're not comfortable with. Just calmly explain that they aren't a treatment plan you are happy to pursue at the moment. I know it can be tough to stand your ground when vets are adamant, but she's your horse, you're paying and you know her best :).
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x 1000 :)

Dont forget that vets only get trained in remedial shoeing - so they cant advice anything else as they simply dont have the tools in their box, unless theyve gone and done research/courses after vet school.

To put heart bars on a horse that is sound seems absolutely bizzarre :confused: Id be saying thanks for your opinion but no thanks and carrying on with the boots and pads, keeping on top of any thrush and keeping diet clean..... :)
 
I'm no barefooter but it does seem ludicrous to me to shoe a horse that is sound without, especially with something as contentious as heartbars.
Perhaps you could suggest you carry on as you are for now and review the situation when the ground hardens up and see how she is doing then?
 
Lanky Loll said:
Seems a bit odd that if she's sound unshod they want to stick HBs on. What was the original problem Kat? I do know of some alternatives dad's used working with other specialists but all depends on what your vet thinks is there to be "solved" as a problem currently (especially if you're not seeing a problem!)
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The original problem was bruising. She is 5 and was shod in front but not behind, she's never had shoes on behind. We'd had lameness that was inconsistent and changing, so she'd come in from the field looking sore and then if we kept her in for a while she'd look sound again. With hindsight, the field was very wet, part of it had been muckspread and she was out 24/7 in it so her feet were bound to be soft. I'd had her a year and a half when this happened and had not had any issues with soundness and she'd coped with bags of roadwork etc whilst only shod in front.

When the vet x-rayed all four feet there was negative rotation of the pedal bone behind but the horse was totally sound in one hind and the other had some soreness by the heel. The front feet were normal, there was no laminitis just thin soles.

Clodagh said:
I'm no barefooter but it does seem ludicrous to me to shoe a horse that is sound without, especially with something as contentious as heartbars.
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I know that is how I feel too, I don't understand what the benefit would be.

Clodagh said:
Perhaps you could suggest you carry on as you are for now and review the situation when the ground hardens up and see how she is doing then?
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The vet said she doesn't mind if I want to wait a while but she won't let me turn out while she is unshod. She has also said categorically that the horse isn't a candidate for barefoot, which seems bizarre when she is sound bare on sand and concrete (though admittedly might not be on tougher srfaces) and working happily in boots and pads.
 
Kat said:
The vet said she doesn't mind if I want to wait a while but she won't let me turn out while she is unshod. She has also said categorically that the horse isn't a candidate for barefoot, which seems bizarre when she is sound bare on sand and concrete (though admittedly might not be on tougher srfaces) and working happily in boots and pads.
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I'm sorry, I'd change vets as that isn't logical.
 
That sounds crazy to me. Surely the whole point of using anything remedial is to fix something that's wrong, not to come in after the problem has improved? Have to say too, the comments that these remedial shoes need to be fitted for support do make me wonder, what on earth is more supportive than the ground for a structure that's meant to weight bear in contact with the ground!

In my own experience a lot of vets aren't comfortable with the barefoot option, however most of them are genuinely trying to do their job so surely if you explain to her that you'd rather try the wait and see option she should listen to you? I know how frustrating it can be but it's worth standing your ground politely. After all going without shoes isn't going to set you back to the point where you couldn't put them on again if there was a need for them, but putting heartbars on now will set your barefoot progress back because it will take all stimulation off the frog again.
 
With that response I think I'd be changing vet.. why on earth can't she be turned out? that alone would make me think the vet has little concept of stimulating feet to improve them (obv once the bruising had improved).

If she is sound on concrete she's doing quite nicely IMO.
 
Sorry having just read your last post I suggest asking for a second opinion. That stuff about not turning out and the horse not being a candidate for barefoot is bizarre in the extreme. Although again my vet told me I'd have to put shoes back on my boy if I wanted to hack him on roads after he came back from Rockley as being a chunky heavy cob he wouldn't manage barefoot :rolleyes: of course he does manage with no problems at all. :D I've seen TBs, Arabs, Quarter Horses, huge warmbloods, cobs, Welsh horses and ponies and lots more going barefoot successfully, what kind is yours that your vet is so sure you can't?

Oh and just to add turning your horse out on a variety of surfaces should improve ground coverage too because they need as much stimulation as possible to get the frog to toughen up to cope with the different surfaces. I don't use boots at all and we cover roads, stony tracks, gravel, rocks etc no problem at all.
 
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