Help guys - another clipping post! Sorry :(

[EllieBeast]

ello all,
beast pony is due to be clipped on saturday. now last year we managed to clip her without sedation for the first time, but tried again this year (this time with sedation, as had not done any de-sensitization

(sp) used 10 acp, given an hour before clipping as instructed). we failed miserably, sedation kicked in, but as soon as the clippers went on, she woke up and started barging about. acp has always worked a treat in the past, but i think her heightened fitness helped her fight it this time round.
Anyways, i spent all of last week getting her used to my 'liveryman element' trimmers, and she has let me clip her legs, and freezemark without a fuss. i have now moved on to see how she reacts to much larger clippers, and we are struggling. at the mo i am trying to get her to associate the clippers (and their sound) with good things, such as food and a scratch (of the nice, not painful kind!). i have got her to take carrots out of my left hand with the clippers running in my right hand (about 18 inches away) and always run them whilst she has her tea.
Can anyone suggest other exercises for me to do with her to help her to overcome this fear? i am currently practising twice a day, so will go back there later to try anything out.
Thanks in advance
Sarah

 

[Tempi]

im of not help whatsoever, but having a mare who has to be fully sedated (by the vet) each time shes clipped i can truley sympathesis!!

Bloss was clipped yesterday, we started a bit before the vet arrived and she was ok to start with (as shes fine doing her bum of some reason) but then started stressing out (and my that i mean rearing/barging/and generaly throwing her weight around). Vet arrived and couldnt get near her to sedate her!! she eventually did and we got her to sleep - halfway through (she had a VERY large dose of sedationg) she woke up, went nuts then went straight back to sleep again - it was the wierdest thing ever...........someone told me they get flashbacks whilst under so not sure if thats anything to do with it........

 

[K9Wendy]

Stuffing ears with cotton wool (someone suggested tampons last year!!!!) radio up loud and the use of a hand held massager on her before than so she gets used to the viabration as well as the noise!

 

[AmyMay]

Do you think she's trying it on now?? If not, and you can't get anywhere with her then would you consider intravenous sedation? I had to do it for years with Amy - until I got my own clippers and just got on with it.

 

[Murphs_Mum]

Can you not just give her an irish clip with the element trimmers? I've used them for doing small clips before and if she's ok with them you could always just clip in a couple of stages extended each time?

 

[Tempi]

Bloss hates it because she hates the feel of the blades on her skin, its nothing to do with the noise with her (not saying that its no for others tho) - my clipping lady thinks its because before i got her they clipped her with hot blades

 

[EllieBeast]

thanks guys. she's a tricky b*gger!
P_G - El did exactly the same under acp, but it just didnt kick in again!

Wendy - the beast wont entertain anything in her ears!
amymay - the first year that i clipped her, you could see old scars on her belly where some idiot managed to cut her whilst clipping, so i have always given her the benefit of the doubt - as her first reaction was always to quiver in the corner of the stable - then try to barge out. However, her behaviour has changed towards it now, she doesnt quiver anymore, but just does the barging. there is every possibility that she has started to take the p!ss. i would definately consider iv, but the trouble is getting the needle to her!

- not painting a good picture of my horse am i? but she is a pain to get a needle in since a hamster vet insisted on stabbing her whilst still in the trailer (and i knew no better at the time).
she doesnt threaten to kick or bite, but she is a big girl - and knows how to use her weight.
oh the fun!

Sarah

 

[EllieBeast]

I suppose i could do, however i plan to do a lot with her this winter. and she is a hot horse who grows one hell of a coat - there must be some pit pony breeding in there somewhere!
Sarah

 

[K9Wendy]

Poor you & poor El... not going to be easy! I had a friend who once clipped her horse in a cattle crush!! Not recommended but it worked for her.. What about straight foreward twitching?

 

[K9Wendy]

Or you could try this...

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Parelli-DVD-Horse-...1QQcmdZViewItem

 

[EllieBeast]

now she does respond well to a twitch, however i am a right softy and dont particularly like the idea of it being on her for the whole duration. also she is wise to having it put on! although i have also been getting her used to people pulling her lip about, so she should be easier to get it on this time. honestly, this horse usually takes everything in her stride! the only things that scre her in the least are clippers and needles. other than that she doesnt flinch at a thing.
worse thing is that i have an ODE on sunday, so i could well end up riding a patchwork horse if she arses about! be prepared for some hilarious event photos - its a good job im not proud

Sarah

 

[EllieBeast]

[ QUOTE ]
convince a horse that "everything that buzzes feels good"?

[/ QUOTE ]

sorry, but LMAO!! (bad dirty mind)
do i sit her in front of the tv screen?

Sarah

 

[K9Wendy]

Hate to say it but there is a fair amount of vibration from clippers, so you need something that vibrates to use on her (doesn't the mind boggle?). Possibly while holding clippers in one hand while running the vibrating object over her! I have to say Bee hangs her head, lip droped & eyes closed with the clippers, she likes the vibration LOL...

 

[TheresaW]

If she responds to the twitch, I would use that over sedation every time. I have to keep the feathers on my Mare's legs clipped for various reasons, and she used to be evil to clip. The only way to do it was to have her fully sedated by the vet every 2 months. At £50 a time it was costing me a fortune. She was genuinely terrified and has obviously been hurt in her past. It has taken me 3 years, but have now got to the point where, with the help of my sharer, we can clip her without sedation. I think a lot of it is because she trusts us. One of will stand at her head talking to her while the other clips. I bought a pair of Avalon cordless clippers. Although they aren't the shortest clip in the world, they are quiet and the cordlessness ? gives us freedom to work around her.

 

[EllieBeast]

LOL! the trimmers vibrate, but obviously not as much as the real thing. i think i have a battery powered back massager at home, will dig it out!
Thanks
Sarah

 

[Claireg9]

I have read this with interest as my horse is now a patch work quilt. She is genuinely scared of them, and after gentle persuasion she allows me to do it, accept this time i could do all but her neck, i got half way up on one side and just above the shoulder on her worse side, at first her chest was still fluffy but i managed to do that in the end, with treats and dinner persuasion!
It's blummin annoying, i tried twitching her, but she just reared, and she snorts and stomps her front feet to the ground, then starts barging! She doesnt want to hurt me but is just scared, and i have the quietest clippers ever! I think alot of it is to do with the fact she is genuinely head shy and hates you going near her ears especially her left one which has a huge scar on it like someone has twitched it wih baling twine or something!
Poor baby. Im gonna try ACP to finish it, anyone know where i can get it from? Is it the vet?

 

[not_with_it]

[ QUOTE ]
i think i have a battery powered back massager at home, will dig it out!


[/ QUOTE ]

Is that what you call it

When clipping one of ours we had to feed him pony nuts all the way through. Obviously not good to take in that amount of food but it did work.

 

[EllieBeast]

sounds like youve got it sussed! luckily, once el is clipped once, she generally wont need another until next winter - we have the rug situation covered! so i dont mind shelling out for vet costs. she is having a hunter clip, so the twitch would be on for quite some time but i suppose it is only once. i hate shoving her full of drugs just to clip, so we will see how it goes. the reason i bought the 'elements' is to get her used to it all, but now that she will let me do her legs with them they will prove useful for summer - another feathered beastie. i leave legs on in winter, as she gets mud fever if we take them off.
Thanks
Sarah

 

[EllieBeast]

lol, well............
the pony nuts could help, she is well and truly ruled by her stomach, so i could see if they softened the blow. The guy who clips for me is very good, and el knows him well so i cannot blame it on fear of one of us. i think my horse just relishes a drama.
Sarah

 

[Lill]

Not sure if this will be of some use, it is a PM that was sent to me by Sare last year.

From: Sare

Hi Lis,

I apologise in advance for the huuuge length of this reply... but here goes!

The first time I decided to clip him I tried just doing a little bit with trimmers to see how he was before starting with the mains clippers. I held him and a friend tried to clip. He tried to kick me with front legs, double barrell her, spin around and knock us off our feet, bite anyone in the vicinity etc!! I went through ages of trying to get him used to the noise and had trimmers with me when I fed etc- then had friends try to hold him whilst I clipped. Unfortunately he was still just as bad and I felt I was risking my friends and just putting him even more on the defensive by having them there.

To cut a long story short it turned out that he associated the noise with clippers but it was really the feeling of them on his skin that terrified him. He has very sensitive skin and I suspect someone has cut or burned him with clippers in the past.

I also realised the fact that having helpers made him more defensive meant I had to do it alone as he has trust in me.

You need to establish whether its the noise alone or the sensation that upsets your lad. I did this by using hand operated clippers ( like these -http://www.valleyvet.com/ct_detail.html?PGGUID=2e87c4a5-7b6a-11d5-a192-00b0d0204ae5). He freaked out just as badly when I used them. Your horse may not- and if not then you just need to work on the noise, if he does then you'll have to go the way I did- if its both you might have to use both methods.

If its the noise he hates- record the noise of the big clippers- and some little trimmers- onto a tape and play it to him as much as possible- in his stable and when hes eating tea etc. The idea being to desensitise him to it because he will be so used to it. Then progress on to trimmers, then when hes totally happy with those try the mains clippers. (you can use electric toothbrushes even before trimmers just for the noise). This process is likely to take several weeks. Personally I wouldn't worry if it runs into summer, you can always take some off just his belly/legs.

With Troys panic over the feel of them I started from absolute basics. I tied him up near a haynet, held onto his head (very important- stand to side of front legs so they can't strike forwards and hold head- to avert biting and, mainly, if you have their head the bum end can't get you!!). Then I snipped and snipped with scissors about an inch from his hair- I kept snipping and stayed near him even whilst he tried to swing away (this took a while of hanging on) eventually he realised it didnt hurt.

Then I snipped his hair with scissors- went through swinging around process again- kept snipping til he settled. Then let go of head and snipped as he stood relaxed.

Then I repeated process (and so did he!) with hand clippers til finally I was clipping with him loose. (This is all over several days and sessions- always end when they have been calm whilst you do whatever you were trying). I ended up, over several days, doing a chaser clip like this (wear plasters on your fingers!! ).

Finally I brought out the trimmers (for the noise worries do this once horse is calm with the noise near him and electric toothbrush near him if you use one). Again we went through same rigmarol, he was tied loosely with me holding head and I held them against him whilst he swung around til he realised it didnt hurt and stood- then I ran them all over his body and when he was calm with that (2days later) I started to clip and he was pretty good- one stamp and some shaking- but lots of pats and soothing words and he stood calmly.

Its a long process and needs commitment to keep at it every day but is SO rewarding!

Let me know if you have anymore questions and I'll try to help. If you know whats upsetting him most don't let anyone talk you out of it- I had SO many people telling me it was the noise when I KNEW it was the sensation. Hes your horse, you know him best. Good luck with him!

 

[K9Wendy]

Oh I forgot... Bee doesn't like having her mane pulled (just started not liking it!) so now Katie stands with a nice lick and she licks away while I work. It's one of those messy brown ones that smell of throat sweets..

So now you need a twitch, vibrator thingy, clippers, lick, pony nuts, sedation, cottonwool, radio, helper and huge amounts of stamina LOL...

 

[EllieBeast]

Wow, thanyou for that - makes good reading. with Ellie it is the noise, as she will let me take hair off with scissors and hand clippers with no trouble. she will also now let me use the trimers directly on her. i will persevere, luckily i have the time to work with her this week. she jumps as soon as the clippers are turned on and off, so im pretty sure that its the noise thats the prob.
Sarah

 

[EllieBeast]

[ QUOTE ]
So now you need a twitch, vibrator thingy, clippers, lick, pony nuts, sedation, cottonwool, radio, helper and huge amounts of stamina LOL...

[/ QUOTE ]

lol, yup, better start writing a checklist! holy poop, who would think that shaving a horse would be so difficult? maybe a full body wax would be better

Can you buy hairless horses?

Sarah