HELP mare kicked foal over in field!!

ElleSkywalkingintheair

ElleSkywalkingintheair

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Poor little guy can't get a break!

For those who don't know Black Pony has a colt foal early Monday moring, he was over cooked (361 days) but he looks premature (very small, dome head etc) He had to be picked up for the first day or 2 but once he was has always been relatively steady on his feet & able to drink. She is a maiden.

Anyway a lots of nursing and vet care and he is doing much better. Vet keen for him to go out so in a lull in the rain tonight (still windy though) put a little yellow dog rug on the guy & turned them out. I DID put the rug on him earlier in the stable to check Black Pony not freaked out by it, she was fine & let him drink etc.

Poppy went out fine, checking little guy following her, and when we let her go she did some high jinks, bucking, kicking, rearing & cantering around head tossing. Little chap just tottered around not really knowing what to do. She did seem to be walking away when he came close though.

Anyway, during one of her bouncy sessions she turned round and double barrelled him, sending the poor boy flying, thank God he had rugs on as they took most of the impact (have checked him over, he doesn't seem sore and is walking fine, obs will be keeping a close eye on him) He got up fine if bemused.

I would like to say I don't think she ment to get him, but honestly am not sure. We happened to film it and watching it back it looks like she ment it. She did let him go for milkybar, and totter past her back legs afterwards. She wasn't all that bothered when he toddled away from her till he went quite away. She DID bounce about him again rearing, kicking etc, but not close enough to get him, however he ended up in the corner of the school not daring to move while she grazed near by.

She did none of the normal following him around or getting upset if he was out of sight, in fact she was walking away from him alot with ears back and was more bothered about eating.

They are now back in stable, he followed fine and has had a drink or two. She is now back to being a good mummy but we are watching closely on the camera.

Just to add, she has never shown any nastiness towards him the the stable, she squee's and at him, but even when he was really poorly has been a good Mum.

Does anyone have any experiance with this? I want to put them out again tomorrow but am terrified it will happen again!! Is meant to be nicer weather tomorrow so he will be going out naked, although in honestly without the rugs on I think she would have hurt him alot!!

Also, there were no other horses out at the time as I didn't want her being foal-proud over the fence.

Any help/advice/experiances??!!

Ps, he is really really tiny so normal blocking off corners of school with jump poles won't work as he is so little & the only other option I have is electric which I think you'll agree is NOT a good idea!!!
 
Awwww poor little Ayrton Senna Pod!:eek::eek:

I am no help as I have no experience at all other then the foal here this year is much bigger and has had more than one kick of his mother but it usually because he is rearing on her and generally being a monster:o

I hope he is ok and it was just a one off.....:o
 
take the doggie blanket off let her get to know his smell and bond with him, his skin is waterproof he wont get cold the weather is warm whilst it is wet but you are bringing him in to the warmth of a stable at night and if he is close to mom he will keep warm by her whilst at the moment he will get cold even with a rug on if she is not protecting him with her warmth.
 
If you are worried, I'd put the mare on a lunge line - they did it at work here last year when mare 'rejected baby in the stable' and they didn't want to risk mare going for foaly in the paddock. It worked.
I've also been told to have a big dog near by, as it tends to make the mare more protective of her foal.

It does sound like she was very pleased to be out for a leg stretch, and on a windy day too.

Don't be too nervous, but keep doing what you are doing and I'm sure she'll settle down when 'SpartSenna-Pod' is a bit bigger and stronger, and not yellow! Poor wee man. Bet he feels a bit confused! Least he is allowed to the milk bar, our mare here didn't want that to be touched - 2 years in a row! (all fine now).
 
Cant help at all unfortunately but how horrible for you :eek: And that poor little guy :( He HAS to get a break soon, surely??

*Snuggles* to the little chap!! Hopefully mum was just a bit excited about being out :D
 
Fools Motto said:
If you are worried, I'd put the mare on a lunge line - they did it at work here last year when mare 'rejected baby in the stable' and they didn't want to risk mare going for foaly in the paddock. It worked.
I've also been told to have a big dog near by, as it tends to make the mare more protective of her foal.

It does sound like she was very pleased to be out for a leg stretch, and on a windy day too.

Don't be too nervous, but keep doing what you are doing and I'm sure she'll settle down when 'SpartSenna-Pod' is a bit bigger and stronger, and not yellow! Poor wee man. Bet he feels a bit confused! Least he is allowed to the milk bar, our mare here didn't want that to be touched - 2 years in a row! (all fine now).
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v sound advice above ^^
Have used a dog before just held on lead nearby, or strange horse (not one from yard) and often the protecting nature then kicks in.
We also have put them in a very small paddock to start with if foaled down indoors, just for initial turnout. Have put sheep hurdles across corners so they are rounded off.

Good luck ESW x
 
Thanks guys :)

Fools Motto, my big dog is bigger than the foal :D I was wondering if maybe it would have been better to have my other horses in the next paddock to make her foal proud? Ironicaly I took them out so she wouldn't be :rolleyes:

Rather than directly over fence I could also put them (my shetland & yearling, Spartsenna-pod's half sister :)) diagonaly opposite to them so only one corner of paddock with them in it?
 
Echo the lunge line.
TBH, it's not surprising she threw a frilly as she's been cooped up for so long, it was an accident waiting to happen, you're lucky he got away so lightly. I'm sorry but with foals you have to think of every single thing that could happen and take steps to prevent them even if you do think it's over the top. Things like making sure all gates/doors on the yard are shut if he's just following because they can go like greased lightening if they've a mind to, try not to have cars parked on the yard, it's all too easy for them to slip behind one then panic and run into anything. Honestly, you won't believe the trouble they can find for themselves and most of it is preventable with just a little thought. If it's dry I echo taking that rug off but don't let him get wet and keep the outside sessions down to just an hour or so at first with mare on a lungeline until she's got her ants out of her pants.
 
Maefen, she has only been in for 5 days so stupidly I thought she would be ok and just eat as she has been so sweet & donkey like in the stable :rolleyes:

Stupid question, but how will lunge line work? Won't she get legs tangled if she throws a hissy fit or is the idea that OH (who will be holding said line) standing right by her and basically follow her round keeping her walking and stopping her lunging forward (she didn't lunge at him at all BTW but just incase)
 
Maesfen said:
Echo the lunge line.
TBH, it's not surprising she threw a frilly as she's been cooped up for so long, it was an accident waiting to happen, you're lucky he got away so lightly. I'm sorry but with foals you have to think of every single thing that could happen and take steps to prevent them even if you do think it's over the top. Things like making sure all gates/doors on the yard are shut if he's just following because they can go like greased lightening if they've a mind to, try not to have cars parked on the yard, it's all too easy for them to slip behind one then panic and run into anything. Honestly, you won't believe the trouble they can find for themselves and most of it is preventable with just a little thought. If it's dry I echo taking that rug off but don't let him get wet and keep the outside sessions down to just an hour or so at first with mare on a lungeline until she's got her ants out of her pants.
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Totally agree with this, we always put our younger mares on a lunge line the first time they go out with their babies, especially if they have been in for a few days just incase they are too fresh :rolleyes: Not only for the bucks and the kicks, but also so they don't run the foal ragged trying to keep up with them!
 
We used the line to correct our mare from turning on her foal. Equally from running away from foal. If the foal went close, as in to want the milk bar, we had control to stop and hold the mare. We also just let the mare graze and mooched with her for the hour that they were out. Admitingly, she didn't ''leap about'', but if she did, the line is to 'steer' her away from the foal.
We only needed to do it twice!

Remember, whoever holds the line, wear gloves and a hat.
 
Thanks FM, we will be trying that tomorrow :)

Just another idea, please advise if its a daft one, would making the paddock they are in much smaller, (foal paddock 20 x 60) be an idea? Or dangerous as easier for her to squish him into the fence?

I could borrow some sheep hurdles for this I think.

Cruiseline & Maesfen, have either of you had mares act like this with foals? even if they were on lines so didn't acctually get the foal, just tried? If so how did it work out? Some more 'happy ending after perseverance' stories would be great!
 
One of our foals came in wet yesterday, so I towelled her dry, and decided that it would do her no harm to wear the towel over her back for a few minutes as a bit of 'rug training' - the mare started nickering
 
Sorry on phone, didn't mean to post so soon!
Mare started nickering to the foal, then snorted and kicked out at her - thankfully she missed! I promptly removed the offending towel from foalie's back and mum was happy again! The foal is over 2 months old now and this is the mare's 4th foal - maybe your mare just doesn't like the rug?
 
Am hoping so, sarahhelen, I agonised about it TBH as it is yellow & horses don't always like yellow (My old uni lecturer did her PhD on horse colour preferences) which is why I had tried it on him in the stable and left it on till I knew she was ok with it & let him drink etc. She was not bothered by it at all but hoping that the combination of being out and a little yellow thing following her might have been why she did it.

She did know it was him though as was checking he was behind her on way out (I was with him, arm round neck and bum, he wasn't loose!) We used to have him in lead but she is happy for him to follow now (he goes in different stale at night for a bit while they are mucked out)
 
ElleSkywalker said:
Cruiseline & Maesfen, have either of you had mares act like this with foals? even if they were on lines so didn't acctually get the foal, just tried? If so how did it work out? Some more 'happy ending after perseverance' stories would be great!
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We have had mares get very excited about being out again after foaling and kicked their heels far too close to their babies for comfort :eek: It all worked out fine in the end :D
 
cruiseline said:
We have had mares get very excited about being out again after foaling and kicked their heels far too close to their babies for comfort :eek: It all worked out fine in the end :D
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Am hoping she didn't mean to get him, just kick in his general direction :) When did you feel confident to take the line off? Once the bouncing had stopped or keep it on for a few times?

Tomorrows plan, put them out for 30 mins-1hour in the morning, then same in evening :)
 
ElleSkywalker said:
Thanks FM, we will be trying that tomorrow :)

Just another idea, please advise if its a daft one, would making the paddock they are in much smaller, (foal paddock 20 x 60) be an idea? Or dangerous as easier for her to squish him into the fence?

I could borrow some sheep hurdles for this I think.

Cruiseline & Maesfen, have either of you had mares act like this with foals? even if they were on lines so didn't acctually get the foal, just tried? If so how did it work out? Some more 'happy ending after perseverance' stories would be great!
Click to expand...

Not a daft idea at all as long as it can be fenced safely because then the mare can't pick up any speed and it saves the foal being run ragged. TBH, it would help him a lot, enough space to have a play but at the same time with his problems he only needs a little while out and build it up gradually as he gets stronger. It might help too if you turn the mare out on a nearly empty stomach which will encourage her to get her head down to eat rather than run around.
Yes, many mares do the same daft things; my Bea is notorious for hiking off as fast as she can so I always make a point of her first going into a very small place for a couple of days while the foals get stronger. It doesn't stop her bucking and kicking out when she does get into the bigger field but the foal has strengthened up while in that small area, learnt to get out of her way better too but it still doesn't stop my heart being in my mouth every time I turn her out; once she can stay out at night too she's quite sedate but those first few days are nail biting for me, you're not alone!

As to lunge line I prefer to walk about with the mare grazing not to hold her in the one same spot and I always keep the line taut, not trailing on the ground. Sometimes the foal will have a run around and it's a case of keeping up with them, making sure he doesn't hang himself by running into the line so it's no good going to sleep while you graze her or not paying attention to them both, you need to keep your wits about you. It does give you the ideal opportunity to watch how the foal moves naturally and learn a bit about its character too; I also spend it trying to find all the whorls too! :)
 
glad he on the mend, hows the walking going?
v kicked p yesterday and it was deliberate as she didnt want the monkey sharing her food in the paddock, then she realised it was him and relented! luckily he was fine (wish she would chastise him a bit more often :D )

hopefully tomoro you will find that she has settled down a bit :) p had a doggy rug on as you know and it was green, i rubbed it all over v and p at first and she accepted it no prob and he was only 8 hours old. heres hoping he just got in her way xx
 
One of my maiden mares was not maternal at all, not nasty to foal in stable but tried to pretend it was not there. Did not clean it and had to be made to stand for foal feeding.
It is difficult when that happens because you have to keep them in until the foal is strong enough to keep up with the mare and really demand the mare to stand still.
A large dog did make the mare more protective in the stable but the moment she was in the field she pretended the foal was nothing to do with her, in fact she was a spooky brat.
We used to lunge her first, to take the edge of her, while someone held the foal, then let them into a small paddock, (first time she did the same as your mare and knocked the foal flying)
After about 10 days of this the lunging was not required, but she was never a good mum, could not go out with other mares and foals because she would just forgot she had a foal.
The outcome was a very tough, independent foal that would bite it's mother to stand for feeding.
The foal grew up to be a really nice horse and the mare went onto her ridden career.
I wish you luck
 
Wow Weston, that mare sounds like the horse equivalent of me ;) !!

Poppy not the most maternal, but she does love him, she itches his little bum and has never been funny about him drinking (did desenistise her to having udders handled though which might have helped)

Although not super foal proud with me and OH, she did get upset with vets messing with him so I think she does like him. Her 'Foaly rose tinted goggles' have worn off quicker than my other mares though :rolleyes:

She does 'squee' at him though, like horses do when they meet each other sometimes when he is ferreting in wrong place for milkybar or when he comes to try and chew her face.

Alfiesmum, he is walking quite well, think even with the flying lesson being out helped him quite a bit and was good to see him walking on a flatter surface.

He is very tired now, has been sleeping most of evening, he was only out 15-20 mins poor little guy! Hoping he gets stronger soon :)
 
essay warning!:-) As Maesfen & Fools Motto, I would def second the big dog,kept on a lead but perhaps not your own if you can get one the mare does not know..she'll see more as an unknown quantity-though you have to be sure of the dog & handler!I've had to use this before and with sheep too, not just horses.A calm quiet presence is best tho so no excuses for her to kick off of have a hissy fit.Similar to that famous old cake recipe...sample some sloe gin..(or favourite tipple)

re the lunge line, this too just as with reducing the enclosure..even if you can create a space double the size of their stable to begin with and increase from there..I would supervise tho 100% and keep the mare under control via the lunge rein. Taste sloe gin again just to check...

One thing I will ad to one very sensible comment above would be regarding the taking of time to be totally neurotic & try figure out how you would hurt yourself if you were a foal..as mentioned, no cars in yard, no leaving gates open etc etc. I would be VERY weary of turning out with sheep hurdles tho-as can be very useful but still massively dangerous to little whizzy/scared lightening bolt babies...they are pocket rockets and don't yet have the learnt self preservation and especially as he has had wibbly issues & such a tough start, I would say sheep hurdles are less forgiving than barbed wire if they get their legs tangled in & panic-even supervised, you'd be taking a risk. Kicking boards/osb or solid sheets of ply screwed against the corners would be far safer as nothing to stick legs thru-believe me..they find a way!
Our foal fencing is always post & rail with a band above the top rail of the thickest green electric tape which initially is not on and supervised when it first is (when older/stronger)-we use battery only and the tape is on the longest extenders we can get. (swig the sloe gin again, better safe than sorry) Initially it is set high but the angle can be lowered to keep them off the fence should they need it-barbaric?in some eyes but I would far rather a baby get a gentle shock from a battery fence than need a vet or worse-my 3yr old tried grazing thru a new post & rail fence and managed to get the rail off and the nail (with rail) stuck in his shoulder-my point being the grass is always greener and who could have forseen that??better dafe than sorry esp as little guy needs all the help he can get. (repeat the sloe gin...you never know..hic)

Oh and fence wise also, we never use stock fence on baby fields but have the chain link mesh like on tennis courts (just lower!) instead as NOTHING can get its hooves thru that and it is very forgiving tho i appreciate it is expensive to fit compared to other types and you may not imply be able to click your fingers. (more sloe gin...just to check bottles are same quality before adding)

with the other horses, diagonal option sounds best -I did similar but put a strand of elec tape across the corner of the big horses field to create a little more distance to begin with (the paranoia at work!!)only a small triangle the length enough to kep them from touching so little ones didn't get stuck in the corner in front of mum if she has a front leg moment while nose to nose..(are you turning grey yet?? not my intention!have some sloe gin)

Re the rugging, I would think she may have disliked rug/had a 'blond moment'..I prefer not to rug a foal if at all possible and same goes for the mare as the foal grows older as they can play & romp & break their legs if they land thru the mares back leg straps. (hic...wonder if damson gin would be better??)

I did warn you about the neurotic tendancies you will need to gain, but its all for an easy life!:-) Happy to help make you as paranoid as possible (in the nicest way) just yell if you need any scaring! (hand steady??pour a little more)

Good news is the weather is set to improve and although still rubbish, no where as bad as what we've had..(another reason to check the gin after the temperatures etc etc)

Huge hugs to LittleGuyAyrtonSennaPod!:D and hope you've managed to get some rest and some gin..oh and I forgot to add all the recipe, but you should have baked a cake at some point thru this, you deserve lots of cake by now...:pxx
 
Is there any reason why the mare and foal are not out all day.

Mine are out from early morning till late a night and soon will be out 24/7

One of min foaled outside and they have not been in a all.
 
Thanks all, love the sloe gin essay! :D

Little guy has just been out for an hour, OH dutifully donned his full body armour attached the lunge rope & off we went.

Black Pony was a different horse today, she only bounced (vertically not at anyone) once, and was much more bothered about where little guy was.

She didn't show any nastiness too Spartsenna pod, just a bit of head tossing at OH, but then she wasn't nasty nasty yesterday, just cantered about bucking & rearing & kicked him over. She did mean to kick in his direction but am not sure if she ment to get him still.

All she did that made me wonder slightly was following/herding him with her nose on his back wuffling like a stallion/mare in season. She does this in stable too but never kicks or anything, just sometimes goes squeee afterwards.

He's hopefully going out again for another hour later, with mum on lunge line again & still without any other horses out. :)
 
Maesfen...thank you:-) I don't drink, am 100% tea total!!!!and should have decided if I liked gin before I poluted the sloes with it! i think elderflower cordial this year & see what that concoction does!! tho i do bake..A LOT!! I do add alcohol to cooking/baking tho as it makes it a little different..you must have missed my recent mega epic post when champagne white choc icecream cubes dipped in more white choc were offered for those who made it to end of op!!;-)

ElleSkywalker said:
Thanks all, love the sloe gin essay! :D

Little guy has just been out for an hour, OH dutifully donned his full body armour attached the lunge rope & off we went.

Black Pony was a different horse today, she only bounced (vertically not at anyone) once, and was much more bothered about where little guy was.

She didn't show any nastiness too Spartsenna pod, just a bit of head tossing at OH, but then she wasn't nasty nasty yesterday, just cantered about bucking & rearing & kicked him over. She did mean to kick in his direction but am not sure if she ment to get him still.

All she did that made me wonder slightly was following/herding him with her nose on his back wuffling like a stallion/mare in season. She does this in stable too but never kicks or anything, just sometimes goes squeee afterwards.

He's hopefully going out again for another hour later, with mum on lunge line again & still without any other horses out. :)
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Glad to see you are trying to scare all your family members equally:-)) What you mentioned above about the squee & seasony behaviour made me think she may be in her foal heat..and not sure how soon Little Ones hormones will be telling her she's a mare & he's entire..but it may be this (unintentionally on his part-yes granted he is male, and we all know what they are like! but I mean that he will give off a scent.)As for the mare, she should know better, but a we've mentioned above, some mares take to motherhood differently to others..some are born naturals..others are more interested in how they got pregnant..and how to make it happen again-probably as her hormones will be all over the shop!
A mare will have the first ovulation after foaling in about one half the time of a normal heat cycle. The ovaries have been resting thru most of pregnancy. Once the mare foals, the ovaries are stimulated to start cycling..which they start from a stage similar to being one half way through a normal heat cycle. So it is only about ten days until the ovulation. Tho this can vary per mare & per year weather according, just as the gestation is MEANT to be 11 months...one of mine thought she's go for 12 or more if she could help it..another hung on for EVER and one was a month early, tho that was lucky as he was more than cooked & was very ready to come out - that was an AI to and on 1st attempt so we are precisely exact on the date due - I’ve seen foal heat range from five days to sixteen days. So there is a chance it could be this messing her already messed up hormones. One of my mares clearly remembers how she fell pregnant to the vet (AI) and has a penchant for wiggling up & reversing onto unsuspecting male visitors once she has made sure they are securely blocked into her stable!

Weather absolutely gorgeous here so am hoping he gets some sun on his back today- a much needed dose of vitamin D will do him the world of good xx did I mention to taste the sloe gin??
 
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