Help- Old Horse with Lammi.

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heidiharvsnroo

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Not quite sure where to put this… so opted for here. Bear with me, it’s a long one…

Basically last year I took the decision to retire my then 26 year old show jumper (welsh x TB). He pulled a tendon and I struggled to get him back to fitness, so opted to let him just be a companion pony and he went back to the lady I was loaning him off.

Anyway, I was in the area last week so I went to see him and I was horrified. He looked awful.

In the 7 years I had him, he didn’t have one attack of Lami and was fed on Molly, baileys hi fibre mix and cooked cereal to keep the weight on him, he was turned out for 4-5 hours a day, and then in Winter I used speedi-beet to keep his weight up. But now, he’s got it, which I’m not surprised at as I also had my suspicions of him having a touch of cushings…but this didn’t seem to effect him up until this point last year. However, this is all speculation as they won’t pay a vet to diagnose him. I’m just heartbroken as up until this point last year we were still show jumping 75cm and he was like a 10 year old!!

But what I was most upset about was the state he was in. He has rubber matting down, with about an inch of straw (as he eats it…), he’s getting half a net of haylage a day and nothing else. His coat his dull, his eyes have lost their sparkle…top that off, he’s a shiverer too so as he’s stuck in his stable, he’s practically crippled on his hind legs.

When I went on the yard he went ballistic. So I got him out of the stable and after 3 or 4 minutes of just walking him round in the sand paddock, his back legs had eased up and to be honest he doesn’t seem that foot sore in the front either, so I’m hoping he’s recovering from the lammi.

I went home and cried my eyes out, after giving him a bloody good bath and groom and said to my other half that I wanted to buy him and give him a loving home for what time he has left. He can be a companion to my current mare. Everyone is telling me I’m mental for buying a horse I can’t do anything with but I’ve said that I can’t leave him where he is. He gave me so much in the 7 years…and taught me all sorts…he deserves a good retirement life.

So I’ve asked the lady to give him to me for 6 months and if I couldn’t get him straight then I’d have him put to sleep. I’m hoping I’ll get him to a position where he can go for a walk with me around the fields. She’s thinking it over, I’m hoping she’ll agree.

The more he is out, the easier his back legs become, so as he doesn’t appear footsore, he can go out in the starvation paddocks for turn out for now, although he doesn’t look that overweight to me. I’ll be getting a vet and farrier out and also know I’ll need him on a deep shavings bed, but I’m after advice on what to feed him and other general care advice.

I’ve done some research and come up with a list of possibilities and wondered if anyone could give me a decent review/advice.

Feeds-

Spillers Happy Hoof + Spillers High Fiber cubes and/or Speedi beet
Dengie Alfalfa Hi Fi Lite with Alfa beet/spedi beet
Supplements
Suppleaze (MSM and Glucosamene- what my mare is on for her joins- swear by it!)
Rosehips
General mineral mix (anyone recommend a good one)
Biotin

Someone also suggested Cider vinegar and formula for feet?

This old boy was my first horse, so I’ve no idea what to do/what’s best for his feeding. Any advice would be brilliant.

Thanks
 
If she is too mean to pay a vet I can't imagine why she wouldn't want to give him to you. At least you will then be able to repay him for all the fun he gave you. The Lamintis Clinic can also be very helpful with feeding advice if you give them a ring.

Poor old boy - hope you get him.
 
I don't really think its that she's too mean, I think its more of a case that she's had that many horses she knows, or thinks she does, what's wrong/happening to him. I might be over reacting, I don't know. I mean I spoke to someone the other day who said that he technically doesn't need any bedding down on rubber matting...although my mare would hate that. And also I suppose I don't know what is being done with him excercise wise...think I may have just been in shock and presumed the worst.

I'm going to offer to take him, or see if I can reach an agreement where I can keep him at her yard, free of livery, and just pay for his bedding, feed etc and give him the care and attention he needs. All depends.

Thanks for all the links above. I'm settled after reading various sites and reviews that I can really use any of the feeds above as they are approved by the laminitis trust, but before I decide if he needs any beet or not, I'll take advice from the vets as to if he needs to drop any more weight or not.

Anyway, if anyone wants a pic of the old boy let me know. I won't post them on here, incase anyone recognises him!
 
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My old horse was recently diagnosed with cushings and prescribed prascent. After just 2 weeks the 'dull' look has gone from his eyes and he is a much happier person. To be honest before he was diagnosed I was considering PTS as he didn't seem to be getting much quality of life.

So I guess from my (admittedly very limited) experience my advice would be that if it is cushings in some ways that is good as it makes the management easier and gives the horse a chance to be happy again. The feeding then becomes much easier. I have a very small field I keep him in for most of the day as the trick is to keep them moving.

And bless you for caring. In some ways it is them most incredibly satisfying thing giving back to a horse and I am sure that you will never regret it.
 
I was warned off using a glucosamine supplement as it can bring on/prolong laminitis. Not 100% sure if true. I keep both of my laminitics on safe and sound with ultimate balancer with speedi-beet in the winter. A cushings charity is offering vouchers for blood tests for diagnosis so that might be useful. But be aware that cushings treatment with the prascend is expensive!
 
shortstuff99 said:
I was warned off using a glucosamine supplement as it can bring on/prolong laminitis. Not 100% sure if true. I keep both of my laminitics on safe and sound with ultimate balancer with speedi-beet in the winter. A cushings charity is offering vouchers for blood tests for diagnosis so that might be useful. But be aware that cushings treatment with the prascend is expensive!
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He's 27 now so I'd already made the decision in my head that he won't be on any drugs that will just prolong his life by a few years, not to mention bankrupt me, if that makes sense. Had he been diagnosed at the age of 15 or so, I would have thought differently, but at 27, realistically he's got what, another 5/8 years in him if you go on averages?

I'll simply attempt to keep him pain free and give him the best retirement possible. And should he need any major surgery or what not, then I would have him euthanased. Some people may think that cruel, but the chances are he wouldn't pull through either way.

I've not head the glucosmend can prolonge lami...but I would, now you mention it, take some vet advice given that it will/can break down into sugars. There must be something else out there I could use for his joints.

Although, to be fair, he's not in work...so begs the question does he really need it. :confused:
 
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But once a horse has Cushing's, they will always be prone to laminitis, increasingly so as time goes on, so your absolute priority to his well being has to be managing the laminitis attacks or preventing them for as long as you can.

So surely a Cushings test to establish his levels of ACTH, glucose and insulin has to be top of your list so that the vet can advise the appropriate dose of pergolide for him currently, and you can then have further tests as time goes on to help inform any changes in pergolide dosage.

Isn't pergolide just less than £1 a tablet now, with horses sometimes only needing one tablet a day, whilst others may need 3 or so a day.

Worth thinking through very carefully whether you are willing to take on this responsibility. It's very different from a horse who just got into a grain store once and got laminitis from that. It's a very real and ever increasing risk of laminitis in the future, plus of course the other things that Cushings does, including the depression and muscle wasting.

Sarah
 
flintfootfilly said:
Worth thinking through very carefully whether you are willing to take on this responsibility. It's very different from a horse who just got into a grain store once and got laminitis from that. It's a very real and ever increasing risk of laminitis in the future, plus of course the other things that Cushings does, including the depression and muscle wasting.

Sarah
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I know. There's a lot to consider, but either way I can't leave him where he is, he's miserable.

I've always been realistic about it, and personally as time goes on I don't see the point of prolonging his life and pumping him full of stuff to put off what is inevitably going to happen a few years down the line.

If he does need 3 tablets a day...that's pretty much £90 a month if they are £1 a go, and whilst if he was younger I'd have paid it in a shot...perhaps the best thing for him would be to give him a few months of being loved and happy and then parting with him?

:(
 
If he has Cushings he will get laminitis, most probably in winter as the days shorten, without the prascend it will be impossible to control it. If he does get cushings induced lami you must act swiftly to have him pts.

Our cushings mare coped on 1 tablet a day for three years, she was lami-free and bright as a button (and rideable) we only had to increase the dosage when the current level became ineffective.
 
well done you for caring enough to do something, my horse has cushings and is on prascend which is a bit pricey. ive done lots of reading on the internet and there is a herbal remedy which is called vitus agnus-castus(chaste berry) so it may be worth looking into that for your boy if he has cushings. i believe it is alot cheaper to use and there have been some good results according to the reports ive seen. i agree with previous posters, if he has cushings laminitis will arrive sooner or later and this is the reason i have decided to go with the tried and tested remedy from the vets even though its is costing me about £8.50 extra weekly(this doesnt sound much but when money is tight its almost the straw that broke the camels back) good luck with your boy....
 
Costs me £22 a month for pergolide, my mare has her sparkle back, lovely shiny coat and has returned to hacking happily about. Not a lot to pay a month .. not even the price of a daily paper. If he has served you so well then get the voucher, get him tested and get him the pills. Maybe he will be ok to hack about, who knows he may have had mild cushiness while you had him. The tablets should bring a great improvement.
 
Hi,

Not been around a while but just wanted to update those of you who were kind enough to offer advice.

I went to have a chat with his owner about him, and I was unaware exactly of how much was wrong with him. He did have cushings, did have lami and was also on a lot of bute. She had decided to let him have one last summer before letting him go.

It got to the stage where he wouldn't come out of his stable, then one friday he decided to take it upon himself to do so. Then we kind of knew it was time. He had a last day of eating in the field, every veg/fruit he wanted and then, sadly, he was put to sleep.

I have wonderful memories of him and am glad he is no longer in any pain.
 
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