Help required - Bad shoeing..... sore feet

[Loopylou1989]

Hi everyone
I'm new to the forums but really need some advice
I had a new farrier that shod my horse a couple of times and then on the third occasion something went completely wrong!!!!!
When i got to the stables to get my horse out of his box one look at his hooves told me that somethnig was wrong. The front hooves did not meet with the shoes at the front and had been left all jagged so not filed and when i picked his front feet up the shoes were thick and heavy with only 4 nails in each!!!!! He is a 15'2 lligh/medium weight Welsh D
When i had trotted him up that morning after being out all night he was sound but after the shoeing he was lame.
I called the farrier immediately and he came back out and re fitted the front right which he was lame on. I asked why he had cut the front away and he said he had seedy toe which i see no signs of and also if this is the case he left the hoof exposed and in these weather conditions i have been told is not correct to do so it should have been packed. I asked why the big thick shoes (one digging into the side of his frog) he said they were fine and only needed 4 nails!!!!!! I then decided to get a second opinion as he was still lame the following day and the farrier said there was no seedy toe, shoes were too heavy and thick, managed to move the shoes with his thumb so not enough nails and he had cut the soles and hoof back too far. 6 wks on he is still lame so i called the vet. The vet thinks he's just foot sore and will take time but is this normal after 6 weeks??? I know he doesn't grow hoof very quickly and is 22 but now I'm thinknig he may need X rays in case its something else. I had pads put on his front feet to protect the soles but they have just been taken off and he still looks sore over uneven ground so trying to harden them with Keratex...... I'm unsure what to do now do i wait and see how he is or bite the bullet and get X rays done

 

[AmyMay]

Ooo six weeks is a long time for your horse to be lame and not receive some veterinary treatment.

I'm afraid I would have the vet back up to take a good look at what's going on. Did the vet think that there was any sign of laminitis??

You may even need to have the feet x-rayed.

Given what you've said, anything could be going on.

 

[ThePony]

Another vote for the vet. If the shoes are causing him probs and he hasn't grown enough hoof back to be comfortable then you could consider pulling the shoes and putting boots on to allow him to recover?

Also, the farrier should be reported to prevent him from continuing to shoe in this way http://www.farrier-reg.gov.uk/

 

[Loopylou1989]

Well the thing is the vet said during the visit it may just take at least 2 more shoeings for him to be right so unless he gets worse see how he goes.
I am going to get the vet back out now that the pads are off and do some more tests and then Xrays however they are mentioning nerve blocking too. My worry is that it could be something totally unrelated I'm just at a lose end. He never goes lame in the 15 years i have had him he has been lame once, this time being the second time! As to the farrier i am going to look into taking legal action if need be as witht he vets bills at his age you can imagine.....

 

[Aces_High]

I personally wouldn't be reporting the farrier. He may have had a valid reason or belief that he was doing it right for that situation. In reporting him he could lose his trade. I would change farrier and use the farrier who looked at him second time around. When it comes to feet ALWAYS USE THE FARRIER FIRST. This is what they are trained for. Your farrier can recommend if he thinks you should get the vet out for x-rays. 6 weeks on your horse should be due for another set. I would speak to the 2nd farrier, get him to have a look and go on his recommendation.

 

[AmyMay]

Well the thing is the vet said during the visit it may just take at least 2 more shoeings for him to be right so unless he gets worse see how he goes.
I am going to get the vet back out now that the pads are off and do some more tests and then Xrays however they are mentioning nerve blocking too. My worry is that it could be something totally unrelated I'm just at a lose end. He never goes lame in the 15 years i have had him he has been lame once, this time being the second time! As to the farrier i am going to look into taking legal action if need be as witht he vets bills at his age you can imagine.....

Mmm, I suspect that there is more going on here - and unless your horses feet were completely butchered (which it doesn't sound like) then I would be asking for investigations.

Good luck.

 

[Loopylou1989]

I wish i could agree but unfortunately he didnt ring me to let me know and from what the second farrier has said it shouldnt have happened. I may not report him but if need be i will take it further with him legally due to loss of use and expense

 

[Kat]

I personally wouldn't be reporting the farrier. He may have had a valid reason or belief that he was doing it right for that situation. In reporting him he could lose his trade. I would change farrier and use the farrier who looked at him second time around. When it comes to feet ALWAYS USE THE FARRIER FIRST. This is what they are trained for. Your farrier can recommend if he thinks you should get the vet out for x-rays. 6 weeks on your horse should be due for another set. I would speak to the 2nd farrier, get him to have a look and go on his recommendation.

Which is better though a man potentially losing his business or potentially continuing to lame horses through negligent/careless/incompetent shoeing?

OP report your concerns, provide the name of the second opinion farrier and the vet and let the governing body investigate. They will not strike him off without clear evidence. Further he should have professional indemnity insurance so if you wish to make a claim against him the compensation for the vets fees will not come directly out of his pocket (although if your claim is successful he may face increased premiums).

We don't know whether this farrier did do an unacceptable job but if he did we surely want to protect other horses from the same.

 

[ladyt25]

How lame is the horse? Are we talking very lame or just not quite right? Has the lameness improved or got worse?

It doesn't surprise me one bit that the horse could still be lame after 6 weeks and that it could just be due to sore feet or an abscess that has developed as a result that the vet has not picked up on. My own horse has been lame for about that same time on an occasion before (he has problems with his feet after shoeing everyso often and we have a very good farrier). The farrier at the time could not find a problem, the vet could not find a problem yet he still was not right. I recall we even had a physio out as we suspected maybe he's pulled something in his shoulder but no, after nearly 2 mths and another shoeing a hole was found where there had been an abscess!!!

The fact your horse has become lame after shoeing would say to me that that is the issue and I would have looked to another farrier to assist and rectify. It may have been an idea to also take the shoes off and put some Boa boots or similar on your horse to give some relief to the foot but allow for regrowth.

I would still try get the vet out again, see if they can find any heat or pulse in the foot - if no pulse then it isn't going to be laminitis BUT there could still be an abscess as I have known there to be them and yet the horse doesn't show any real heat or pulse in the offending foot/leg. Personally I wouldn't be going down the x-ray route as yet if you're pretty sure the lameness is down to poor farriery and if your vet agrees. I would maybe try hot-tubbing in salted water to see if you can draw anything out and maybe poultice the foot in the meantime as well.

 

[indi4]

When i was having problem with my horses foot my vet would always speak to my farrier before he carried out any treament, and even made a point of coming down to see my horse when i had arranged for the farrier to come and have a look so they could talk through the best plan of action. So it may be worth just speaking to the vet first and maybe see if he could recommend you a farrier that Specialises in remedial shoeing first to have a look, and if they think it's something more serious they'll recommend the vet investigate further.

 

[Aces_High]

Before poulticing etc the shoe needs to be removed. The farrier should be coming out as it's been on for nearly 6 weeks hence getting him to remove the shoe investigate for a digital pulse etc is what I would be doing. Why didn't the OP have the shoe removed straight away and investigate a possible abscess etc?? Due to how this case has been dealt with I would have to judge the OP as being a novice horse owner and therefore reporting the farrier is not something I would be suggesting. I am not wanting to sound patronizing at all but this is how the case has been portrayed in my eyes. As Ladyt25 has said abcesses can take a long time to build up and to surface so that they can be found. It is often pot luck.

 

[ladyt25]

Abscesses are the bane of my life Aces High! Lol. My horse seems to have this amazing knack of foiling both the farrier and the vet as somehow manages to 'hide' the abscess and it is only later on that the abscess track is discovered after we've scratched our heads for weeks. I am in fact going through this currently - farrier can't find a problem, shoes been off, horse has been hot-tubbed and poulticed, lameness improved, shoe's gone back on. I rode him but felt still not right then at the weekend he was lame again. Vet came to do vaccs, checked him and could not find anything - just said footsore!!!!

I think my horse just wants to get out of work! ha ha

 

[Aces_High]

Abscesses are the bane of my life Aces High! Lol. My horse seems to have this amazing knack of foiling both the farrier and the vet as somehow manages to 'hide' the abscess and it is only later on that the abscess track is discovered after we've scratched our heads for weeks. I am in fact going through this currently - farrier can't find a problem, shoes been off, horse has been hot-tubbed and poulticed, lameness improved, shoe's gone back on. I rode him but felt still not right then at the weekend he was lame again. Vet came to do vaccs, checked him and could not find anything - just said footsore!!!!

I think my horse just wants to get out of work! ha ha

One of my horses was very prone to abscesses and honestly when I first got him I thought he'd broken his leg. He couldn't walk and was standing in this stable with his front leg in the air. Bearing in mind he'd been sound on the gallops several hours before!! I know how you feel! Have you tried him in egg bars? These really helped my horse. The other thing which I do for a footy horse is to give them a couple of days on bute - the horse I've just mentioned would be in imaginary pain and a couple of days on bute he'd realise there wasn't any pain and then sound as a pound until the next little lurker reared it's ugly head!
PS I am not suggesting everyone feeds their horse bute.

 

[flitz02]

Hi,i too had a very simular problem last year with my mare,i tried a new farrier as my regular farrier (who does all the remedial work for the large equine practice my horse is with.).... was getting harder & harder to get hold of.After shoeing with the new farrier my mare was very lame/footy so i got the vet out the vet was talking about navicular etc but recommended getting my old farrier to have a look ...so after pleading with him to come back to me he did & was somewhat shocked at what he saw the feet were totally unbalanced ....we had to leave her for a while to let the hoof grow out before he could reshoe & it did take 2 shoeings to get her sound but i have not had any problems since.
I would try to get your old farrier back out (your horse was obviously happy with the way he had shod it in the past)or if not go for a second opinon from a specialist remedial farrier.I personally wouldnt bother with the vet again as a good farrier is much better informed than the average vet.I dont know what area you are in but ask about at any big event/sj yards & see who their farrier is.I wish you & your horsey luck.xx

 

[Loopylou1989]

I would like to point out that i am not a novice horse owner as previously mentioned in someones post however i have not come across this problem before. I am following the farrier that has sorted out the bad shoeing and he suggested the pads to help relieve any pain from the sole being cut back, lighter shoes and to leave them on as long as possible to allow as much growth as possible before being re shod. Yesterday he had the pad removed after 6 weeks, no visible signs of an abcess and has now said that i need to try hardening the hooves up with Keratex so if he is footsore this will help toughen them up as they are soft from wearing the pads for 6 weeks. My concern was that he's been mildly lame for this period of time and was this right? Most i have spoken to say this is too long so thought i would need to investigate further however it is pointing to the bad shoeing he had as they looked awful and he was sound beforehand

 

[AmyMay]

Pads can be a bit of a mixed blessing, and they can have the effect of softening the sole. The other thing to consider regarding the shoeing (and in particular the exessive trim) is that the foot angle can be compromised, having the effect of altering the pedal bone position, this will cause lamness. But only an x-ray can diagnose this.

Will be really interesting to see what the outcome of this is.

 

[ladyt25]

One of my horses was very prone to abscesses and honestly when I first got him I thought he'd broken his leg. He couldn't walk and was standing in this stable with his front leg in the air. Bearing in mind he'd been sound on the gallops several hours before!! I know how you feel! Have you tried him in egg bars? These really helped my horse. The other thing which I do for a footy horse is to give them a couple of days on bute - the horse I've just mentioned would be in imaginary pain and a couple of days on bute he'd realise there wasn't any pain and then sound as a pound until the next little lurker reared it's ugly head!
PS I am not suggesting everyone feeds their horse bute.

95% of the time he is fine, just slightly footy and I don't usually ride him for a couple of days after each shoeing. He has thin walls apparently so farrier has to be very careful when shoeing and he is very good (horse arses about as I guess it's a little uncomfortable). Our farrier's fab though and always checks how horse is and will remove and re-fit if horse doesn't seem happy afterwards. He'll also come out after if we feel horse is still not right. i don't think in his case remedial shoeing of any type would help as i think the issue is the clenches. I did consider stick ons but they are very expensive and for the few times we have an issue i didn't think it was worth it. It's a shame he can't be barefoot but, take his shoes off you'd think someone had removed his foot the way he walks! lol