help with a difficult horse- also in CR

This is really interesting I hope some of the suggestions get to the route of the problem. You say he is fine on the lunge, what about if he has a rider on board while on the lunge?
I would certainly do a bute test to rule out the pain factor. It does seem a little extreme to be a pure attitude problem but that being said I know how quickly that can escalate.
What was his history before he came to you, did he exhibite these issues then?
 
OK haven't read all replies here, but if you think it's muscular, is there anyone round you that does EMP therapy? It's like a giant TENS machine and fab for working kinks out of muscles.
Last year I had a problem with my little mare, I though it was her back but the physio/vet couldn't find anything. I had a lady out with her machine and it turned out to be her hamstrings which were sore.
Just a thought :)
 
Have you looked into his bloodlines? There may be a genetic element to the unpleasantness on the ground. It might just be "him" to be uncooperative.

It does sound like there must be some discomfort going on when ridden, and if he is uncooperative by nature he's probably not the sort to soldier on through a bit of pain.

You could get the vets to try to locate it, especially if you are insured, but these things are not always solvable or fixable.
 
Have you had him checked for allergies etc.? If he's allergic slightly to dust or a food stuff, that could explain why he's grumpy in the stable.

Has he been scoped for ulcers or anything else to do with his digestive system? Again, might cause a dull, constant pain making him grumpy.

Weird one, but a pony at my yard had an abscess in his noise, causing lots of puss around his brain, which was causing pressure on his brain, but weirdly, he didn't react any differently. Have you had his head checked just in case he's had trauma to his head at some point?

Not sure if any of these would account for his behaviour, but you've checked everything else, might be worth checking these?
 
Hi,

Another vote for changing the diet. Again not sure that it will be your answer but it is easy to do, not expensive and something else to cross off your list. Go molasses and cereal free and maybe Alfalfa free too - be very careful to check the ingredients - don't take low in sugar for granted!! check! Take out the grass and soak your hay.
I have a horse who after 13 years and several vets later turns out to be sugar intollerant. All his symptoms shouted pain - agressive to handle, at time dangerous to ride. In general quite horrid but he too would go out and behave at a competition and come back being placed in dressage.
I couldn't find a pattern to it as you say sometimes even in the same session he would be fine - other times not. It appeared to be all on his terms or not at all - prompting several comments of he is just being naughty...

He is now on a very strict diet and he is a very very different horse.

It may not be your answer but please do give it a try.

Best of luck - there will be something 'wrong' you just need to find it! Easier said than done
 
If he is being a sod on the ground for no real reason that you can think of, I would suggest having a natural horseperson out. I had major loading/travelling problems, horse would sometimes bolt off in hand and just be an a*** to handle, scraping floor etc. Had a woman out, and he was a different horse! Had to use his dually for loading and leading, but he is so happy now. I no longer have him, but his new owner says he is an angel and has improved so much she now no longer needs the dually either.

Unfortuanlty, he was only ever a pain on the ground, to ride he was no problem, though he his stubborn WB side would come out sometimes. So cannot help with that bit really. I can only suggest having his re checked all over, if he is fine at shows see what is different and try to change those things at home.

I would really try the natural horseperson though, I was sceptic, but I would always have one back if I ever had any problems now. I cannot recommend them highly enough.

Good Luck! :)
 
Do you feed himhaylage at all? As in big-bale haylage, not the pre-bagged stuff?

I had a horse- bless his hooves- who could not tolerate farmers haylage- a couple of nets and he turned from a lovely lad into a bad tempered beast- bargy, aggresive - spookier/sharper than usual. Really not pleasant to be around. He couldn't tolerate any cereal either, even coolmixes.

He changed back to 'normal' within a few days of stopping the haylage.

I've also seen massive temperament changes in my new horse after stopping cereals when he came to me to a fibre only diet.

Possibly worth a try?
 
I knew a horse similar to yours but instead of rearing he would 'freeze' and refuse to move if you made him move he would loose the plot then rear, go sideways allsorts.
He would also go to events and be as good as gold and lunged perfectly.
Can't remember how they found out but it was eventing team vet Jenny Hall that became involved and it was found that the horse would sometimes get a trapped nerve in his neck.
 
We have one who sounds a bit similar to this. She is a nightmare to handle, in the field, stable and to ride. She's only fed on hay now as is retired to 'field ornament' status (has been for some years) and her behaviour is the same!
 
Just as a matter of interest, what is his diet. The more you put about this horse, the more I think that he sounds like he cannot cope with the level of sugar. If he competes well, using lots of energy his blood sugar levels will be being used up. As with energetic lunging, when he has nothing to do the blood sugar levels rise, the brain needs sugar to function and can be cooked if there is an imbalance. Epilepsy can be controlled using a diet rich in fat rather than sugar, whilst not saying he is epileptic, sugar imbalance can have dome pretty weird effects.
 
Had something similar, not as bad as yours. Bought a mare last year. She was very, very nervous to handle, impossible to catch. She'd get aggressive/scowl/lift a leg if I pushed her shoulders over in the stable/on the yard. Would scowl/flinch/tense when you tacked her up. Set off like a racehorse when you got on and was stupidly tense to ride. Felt like she was about to explode all the time. Yet she had been out jumping etc in her previous home. Had vet and very well recommended physio out to her. Who found absolutely nothing. Physio actually said 'she wouldn't move like that if she was sore' after watching her on the lunge. So I persevered and assumed it was just psychological.

Fast forward a few months later, she hadn't been in ridden work for more than 2 weeks before I let her have time off, mare started going up on her back legs in hand, just walking out to the field, any pressure on her headcollar straight up. Got a physio/trainer from quite far away to come out and see her. He checked her over and within 30 seconds found she was really sore in both shoulders, poll, other muscles around her head/neck (sorry I'm not sure of the names) and she had been for some time. I cannot recommend him enough, PM if you want a name. The other physio had missed all of it. She was visibly more relaxed straight away, she's still really sharp and nervous but I'm just in the process of rebreaking her, she needs to start from scratch and learn to relax as its screwed her up in the head.

Its upsetting to me that the first physio is used by a lot of people in our area and is thought of highly, everyone on my yard still uses him, I'm not going to bad mouth him, its none of my business what other people do with their horses, I just hate the fact I trusted a qualified professional and continued to push and work my horse when she was in a lot of pain and he claimed she was completely fine. I knew in my gut in some sense.

Point of the post, get a second opinion.

My friend had a mare on the verge of being PTS as it was becoming so dangerous rearing and coming over backwards. This horse had seen numerous qualified physios. She got a lady out as a last ditch effort and straight away she said she'd never seen a horse so tight in the neck. I honestly do not understand how people can train in this and not recognize a horse in a lot of pain? Not saying this is the case with yours but its worth a try.
 
LouS said:
Had something similar, not as bad as yours. Bought a mare last year. She was very, very nervous to handle, impossible to catch. She'd get aggressive/scowl/lift a leg if I pushed her shoulders over in the stable/on the yard. Would scowl/flinch/tense when you tacked her up. Set off like a racehorse when you got on and was stupidly tense to ride. Felt like she was about to explode all the time. Yet she had been out jumping etc in her previous home. Had vet and very well recommended physio out to her. Who found absolutely nothing. Physio actually said 'she wouldn't move like that if she was sore' after watching her on the lunge. So I persevered and assumed it was just psychological.

Fast forward a few months later, she hadn't been in ridden work for more than 2 weeks before I let her have time off, mare started going up on her back legs in hand, just walking out to the field, any pressure on her headcollar straight up. Got a physio/trainer from quite far away to come out and see her. He checked her over and within 30 seconds found she was really sore in both shoulders, poll, other muscles around her head/neck (sorry I'm not sure of the names) and she had been for some time. I cannot recommend him enough, PM if you want a name. The other physio had missed all of it. She was visibly more relaxed straight away, she's still really sharp and nervous but I'm just in the process of rebreaking her, she needs to start from scratch and learn to relax as its screwed her up in the head.

Its upsetting to me that the first physio is used by a lot of people in our area and is thought of highly, everyone on my yard still uses him, I'm not going to bad mouth him, its none of my business what other people do with their horses, I just hate the fact I trusted a qualified professional and continued to push and work my horse when she was in a lot of pain and he claimed she was completely fine. I knew in my gut in some sense.

Point of the post, get a second opinion.

My friend had a mare on the verge of being PTS as it was becoming so dangerous rearing and coming over backwards. This horse had seen numerous qualified physios. She got a lady out as a last ditch effort and straight away she said she'd never seen a horse so tight in the neck. I honestly do not understand how people can train in this and not recognize a horse in a lot of pain? Not saying this is the case with yours but its worth a try.
Click to expand...

I completely agree with this- unfortunately it is a common story everywhere u go!!!!

Hence my comment about either an old horseman/ woman or somebody who's had a crashed horse
 
My list of thoughts would be:
Bute trial. For a couple of weeks. See what difference it makes. If no difference, assume no pain. If difference-get second opinions.
24hr turnout. Eliminate the oppurtunity for him to scrape the door etc. and get frustrated.
When lunged-is this with the saddle on? Have you tried lunging him and then lungeing him with rider on? See if the weight is making the big difference?
did you break him/know how he was broken? Was he like this when you went to see him?
Does he ever misbehave at competitions?
Sounds to me like he has been socked at some point as a youngster, is probably the sensitive type and just throws a wobbler in anticipation of being socked again. Not that it helps you much!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top