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Moodymareish

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Hay all
im new on here and looking for some advice
I have a 7 year old mare and she has started randomly turning and heading for home while we are out hacking, I've tried turning her and trying to get her to go forward and carry on with the hack but she point blank refuses to and will try and rear if I push her too much, and if I try to get her to halt she won't she just tenses up so bad and tries to walk forward and will refuse to stop she gets very anxious she only does this out on a hack, in the yard she is fine and will halt no problem and is calm,
so what I'm asking is how do I calm her down and relax her while she is halted
and how do I get her to stop randomly turning while out hacking?

any ideas will be great thank you in advance

Julie
 
Id get off her back and on the ground with her. Walk out with her for while, go for long walks around the routes you will eventually hack out on. Let her eat and look around. Just build with her with absolutely no agenda. It just sounds like shes insecure and could benefit from building relationship with you whilst you are out and about. It takes time but its well worth it.
 
Done this too, doesn't help whole hack has to go home because of it, no not the random turning, it's not fear it's just her being naughty (I know this as I've jumped off her and walked 20 yard and got back on and she will be fine for a while then randomly turn again) as she does it on all different hack routes, the anxiousness while halting I think May have been due to the previous owner, when ever the horse stopped she was whipped and kicked to move forward by inexperienced rider, I never use a whip and do not intend to I hate them so don't advise a whip as I won't be using one, I prefer to use legs and voice and be patient with her rather than whip her
 
It may not be fear but what you describe is not just a naughty horse taking the mickey, she sounds anxious, lacking in confidence and needing a strong leader who can get her over this.
I would go out with just one other sensible rider on a solid well mannered horse not a group where others may not want to be involved or cannot deal with their own horses, take a lead rein so that you can be led, you may feel foolish but if it works does it matter, the other rider must stay with you and give your horse confidence by being next to her at all times. If she starts to think about stopping and turning get the rope clipped on and keep her moving with the other horse, if she cannot turn she cannot head home, once she has actually turned round she is in control and then gets upset, you need to stop the turning and gain her trust and confidence.
A whip does not have to be used as punishment, my horses take confidence from a tap on the shoulder at times to back up the legs when going past something scary, I will never hack out without one as it can be a lifesaver if the horse plants itself in a dangerous place, no horse should be scared of hem and no rider should be afraid to use one when required, if used properly they do no harm.
You really need to decide whether she is naughty or nervous, your posts are rather unclear which it is, and be prepared to deal with her before you both get into a situation that needs you to take control, if this is happening on the roads you have to think about other road users who may meet you out of control.
 
My mare got into a habit of spinning and going where she wanted not long ago, had her nearly 4 years and she is 15 so it was just plain naughtiness on her part. She was in a loose ring bit and she would open her mouth so wide that the rings would go through her mouth and out the other side! I think it was a fluke she realised she could do this as never did it before, and from then on it was how she could evade me! She wasn't scared, or in pain, just wanted to go where she wanted to go. A flash made matters worse as although I could prevent her opening her mouth she spent the whole ride fighting and leaning on her bit.
After reading some advice on here, I opted for changing to a full cheek snaffle and using treats as a reward when she stood nicely and went forward when I asked (I am by no means a treater at all but this was my last option) I had to be tough with her as she was doing it on the roads which was just plain dangerous. She used to mainly spin at the end of a road where I wanted her to turn one way but she decided She wanted to go the other. So I would go out with a few treats in my pocket and as soon as she stood still she got a treat. It didn't take long for her to realise that her good behaviour was rewarded and the bad behaviour wasn't, so as soon as she stood nicely she would turn her head for the treat. For a couple of weeks She got a treat every time she stood patiently and the spinning stopped, then I gradually cut down on the treats and no she doesn't get any, other than when we get back and she gets the reward.
I hated The idea of treating while riding, but as I said it was my last option to try and it worked! If she ever gets treats she has to work for them, like carrot stretches for example. Occasionally when we are out she will turn her head for a treat when she's standing nicely but I just give her an ear scratch and that's enough for her to carry on happily!
It might be worth a try for your horse, good luck!!


edited to add, my mare would only spin and walk in the direction she wanted, no rearing/bucking etc so it could also be a confidence issue if you are worried deep down she is going to do something like that?so maybe if you are going to try the treating it wouldn't be a bad idea to try it with a confident horse along side first?
 
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Does she do this with experienced riders riding her? It would be worth your while employing a rider for a couple of days a week to get her out there and help her regain her trust in riders. Sounds like she does not believe in you, I'm afraid.
 
Spring Feather said:
Does she do this with experienced riders riding her? It would be worth your while employing a rider for a couple of days a week to get her out there and help her regain her trust in riders. Sounds like she does not believe in you, I'm afraid.
Click to expand...

This ^^^. Well worth the money. I hope you get it sorted :)
 
I think if you read my post back you will see that I am being very clear on what I'm saying with the random turning I've said I think she is being naughty and with the halting she is anxious, couldn't be any clearer!
Read things clearly before you jump in to criticise people!
And I do think of other road users hence why I will not put up a fight with her IF I am on a road and I've never been in a situation where I've been out of control either so don't just assume this!
If you have nothing positive and constructive to say keep your post to yourself!

be positive said:
It may not be fear but what you describe is not just a naughty horse taking the mickey, she sounds anxious, lacking in confidence and needing a strong leader who can get her over this.
I would go out with just one other sensible rider on a solid well mannered horse not a group where others may not want to be involved or cannot deal with their own horses, take a lead rein so that you can be led, you may feel foolish but if it works does it matter, the other rider must stay with you and give your horse confidence by being next to her at all times. If she starts to think about stopping and turning get the rope clipped on and keep her moving with the other horse, if she cannot turn she cannot head home, once she has actually turned round she is in control and then gets upset, you need to stop the turning and gain her trust and confidence.
A whip does not have to be used as punishment, my horses take confidence from a tap on the shoulder at times to back up the legs when going past something scary, I will never hack out without one as it can be a lifesaver if the horse plants itself in a dangerous place, no horse should be scared of hem and no rider should be afraid to use one when required, if used properly they do no harm.
You really need to decide whether she is naughty or nervous, your posts are rather unclear which it is, and be prepared to deal with her before you both get into a situation that needs you to take control, if this is happening on the roads you have to think about other road users who may meet you out of control.
Click to expand...
 
I am an experienced rider! And yes she does it with different riders!


Spring Feather said:
Does she do this with experienced riders riding her? It would be worth your while employing a rider for a couple of days a week to get her out there and help her regain her trust in riders. Sounds like she does not believe in you, I'm afraid.
Click to expand...
 
Thank you for your positive reply!

I will give this a go and see if this helps I do reward my horse vocally and praise her all the time while out riding and when we return to the yard she gets a small treat, the only roads I ride on are very quite back roads so not a lot of traffic on the
Roads, her bit is fine this has all been checked as well as all her other tack, I would never dream of putting my horse or myself in any kind of danger, hence why I avoid battling with her when she starts this naughtiness when we are out riding
Again thank you for your positive and non judgemental reply.

baker190 said:
My mare got into a habit of spinning and going

where she wanted not long ago, had her nearly 4 years and she is 15 so it was just plain naughtiness on her part. She was in a loose ring bit and she would open her mouth so wide that the rings would go through her mouth and out the other side! I think it was a fluke she realised she could do this as never did it before, and from then on it was how she could evade me! She wasn't scared, or in pain, just wanted to go where she wanted to go. A flash made matters worse as although I could prevent her opening her mouth she spent the whole ride fighting and leaning on her bit.
After reading some advice on here, I opted for changing to a full cheek snaffle and using treats as a reward when she stood nicely and went forward when I asked (I am by no means a treater at all but this was my last option) I had to be tough with her as she was doing it on the roads which was just plain dangerous. She used to mainly spin at the end of a road where I wanted her to turn one way but she decided She wanted to go the other. So I would go out with a few treats in my pocket and as soon as she stood still she got a treat. It didn't take long for her to realise that her good behaviour was rewarded and the bad behaviour wasn't, so as soon as she stood nicely she would turn her head for the treat. For a couple of weeks She got a treat every time she stood patiently and the spinning stopped, then I gradually cut down on the treats and no she doesn't get any, other than when we get back and she gets the reward.
I hated The idea of treating while riding, but as I said it was my last option to try and it worked! If she ever gets treats she has to work for them, like carrot stretches for example. Occasionally when we are out she will turn her head for a treat when she's standing nicely but I just give her an ear scratch and that's enough for her to carry on happily!
It might be worth a try for your horse, good luck!!


edited to add, my mare would only spin and walk in the direction she wanted, no rearing/bucking etc so it could also be a confidence issue if you are worried deep down she is going to do something like that?so maybe if you are going to try the treating it wouldn't be a bad idea to try it with a confident horse along side first?
Click to expand...
 
Moodymareish said:
I think if you read my post back you will see that I am being very clear on what I'm saying with the random turning I've said I think she is being naughty and with the halting she is anxious, couldn't be any clearer!
Read things clearly before you jump in to criticise people!
And I do think of other road users hence why I will not put up a fight with her IF I am on a road and I've never been in a situation where I've been out of control either so don't just assume this!
If you have nothing positive and constructive to say keep your post to yourself!
Click to expand...

If she is randomly turning you are not in control in my opinion, that she gets anxious when stopping shows she is worried about something and the two things are more than likely related.
I did suggest what I would do in this situation and have used a lead rope from another horse very successfully with a strong willed cob who would at times reverse into ditches rather than go forward, he was both naughty and stressy it was hard to get inside his head it was only hacking that he had issues with.
 
Moodymareish said:
Thank you for your positive reply!

I will give this a go and see if this helps I do reward my horse vocally and praise her all the time while out riding and when we return to the yard she gets a small treat, the only roads I ride on are very quite back roads so not a lot of traffic on the
Roads, her bit is fine this has all been checked as well as all her other tack, I would never dream of putting my horse or myself in any kind of danger, hence why I avoid battling with her when she starts this naughtiness when we are out riding
Again thank you for your positive and non judgemental reply.
Click to expand...

Its not something I had thought of at all when battling with my mare as I always just related treating to rewarding and thought I would be rewarding her bad behaviour instead of realising I was infact rewarding the good behaviour. It was a thread I read on here which suggested trying this and it worked very quickly and very effectively. She is now a saint on the road, no more arguments!
Some people may not agree, but as I say it was my last resort. The reason for my bit change is that I couldn't get tough with her and pull her round when the bit was going straight through her mouth, I may as well have had no reins I had that little control!! Never seen a horse do it how she did, she is clever like that though! Which the full cheek she can't get the bit through her mouth so I still have control with the reins.
I am happy to say she doesn't do it at all now :-) Good luck!
 
Moodymareish said:
I think if you read my post back you will see that I am being very clear on what I'm saying with the random turning I've said I think she is being naughty and with the halting she is anxious, couldn't be any clearer!
Read things clearly before you jump in to criticise people!
Click to expand...

Nope, not clear at all. I think you have read this horse all wrong. She's not taking the piss AND anxious. I agree with a previous poster that you should let someone more experienced have a sit on her.
 
vieshot said:
Nope, not clear at all. I think you have read this horse all wrong. She's not taking the piss AND anxious. I agree with a previous poster that you should let someone more experienced have a sit on her.
Click to expand...

How do you know this person isnt an experienced rider?? I am an experienced rider with quailifications but doesnt mean that i dont sometimes come across a problem which stumps me and i generally then will ask for advice or help!

Op i know its difficult but can you read when your horse is about to spin and maybe catch her before it happens by driving her forward strongly with voice and leg even to the point of sending her into a brisk trot to distract her mind? My horse used to nap and this worked well for me, if he did spin, again i would turn him straight back and send him on! I did use a whip to enforce my leg but thats my choice everyone is different :)

Also is a good idea to take a treat and reward good behavior x
 
Having sat on a horse that did this it was a painful experience for all involved, people let her get away it so she did it more and more. It was a horse handed in for re-schooling, basically we would get a good 30 mins out and she would refuse to move, plant her feet and rear if any pressure to move forwards was put on. So if she didn't want to go forwards I would make her move backwards maybe one step, she was so backwards thinking that this snapped her out of it and we would then walk on again. This could take up to 40 mins ? possibly longer but sitting through it and not letting her go home taught her it isn't fun at all. I used a whip during the process however its easily done without, try asking her to move sideways, turn her in a circle just do something to snap her brain out of 'im standing, im not moving'.


Hope this helps
 
No read the post back again and take it in and stop just putting your own words in!

I didn't say she got anxious when stopping when randomly turning, I said she got anxious when I halted her completely different scenario all together.

and I am in control of her! She is a very strong horse and very strong willed and if I had to pull on her reins too hard she would just rear up booting me off and probably her booting off along the road, so this is why I don't fight with her to that point and make it a dangerous situation.

i carry a lead rope with me at all times and have jumped off her and lead her for a short time then when back on her.

and yeah I am a very experience rider and horse owner, and I have had people with less and more experience then me ride her and she still does the same thing so nothing to do with experience !!

im not on here to argue with people, I only joined for advice as I though it might help the situation looking at it for another persons point of view, not to be belittled or criticised , so in future just don't answer posts if your going to be so off with new people it puts us off even contemplating posting again.

be said:
If she is randomly turning you are not in control in my opinion, that she gets anxious when stopping shows she is worried about something and the two things are more than likely related.
I did suggest what I would do in this situation and have used a lead rope from another horse very successfully with a strong willed cob who would at times reverse into ditches rather than go forward, he was both naughty and stressy it was hard to get inside his head it was only hacking that he had issues with.
Click to expand...
 
No she gives you no notice that she is going to do it, she's so quick in doing it too, I've been riding with my leg on in the hope that I can catch her quickly and keep her going the way i want her to go, other riders have tried with a whip to but this seams to make her rear quicker, where as if I ride her and she does it she won't rear just as quick, but if I jump off and lead her she is fine.

splashnutti1 said:
How do you know this person isnt an experienced rider?? I am an experienced rider with quailifications but doesnt mean that i dont sometimes come across a problem which stumps me and i generally then will ask for advice or help!

Op i know its difficult but can you read when your horse is about to spin and maybe catch her before it happens by driving her forward strongly with voice and leg even to the point of sending her into a brisk trot to distract her mind? My horse used to nap and this worked well for me, if he did spin, again i would turn him straight back and send him on! I did use a whip to enforce my leg but thats my choice everyone is different :)

Also is a good idea to take a treat and reward good behavior x
Click to expand...
 
You are lucky you get 30 minutes, sometimes she is great and goes really well other times I can't even get her out the school or yard. And sometime we can go out and she doesn't do it at all, but it is becoming more regular.

Yes it is a very painful experience, a battle of wills, I will not push her to the extent of her rearing as I don't want any of us to get hurt.

Thank you for your kind reply


ticker said:
Having sat on a horse that did this it was a painful experience for all involved, people let her get away it so she did it more and more. It was a horse handed in for re-schooling, basically we would get a good 30 mins out and she would refuse to move, plant her feet and rear if any pressure to move forwards was put on. So if she didn't want to go forwards I would make her move backwards maybe one step, she was so backwards thinking that this snapped her out of it and we would then walk on again. This could take up to 40 mins ? possibly longer but sitting through it and not letting her go home taught her it isn't fun at all. I used a whip during the process however its easily done without, try asking her to move sideways, turn her in a circle just do something to snap her brain out of 'im standing, im not moving'.


Hope this helps
Click to expand...
 
Richard Maxwell gives some good tips in his starting book, I'm the same I have been put off carrying whips but how about a whip whop, just tap from one shoulder to another as an annoyance rather than a reprimand to encourage movement, Richard also explains to make sure they are not allowed to just stand still so keep them working, ie open the rein and side step etc, leg yields whilst staying calm, I guess it's just trial and error, good luck.
 
Moodymareish said:
I think if you read my post back you will see that I am being very clear on what I'm saying with the random turning I've said I think she is being naughty and with the halting she is anxious, couldn't be any clearer!
Read things clearly before you jump in to criticise people!
And I do think of other road users hence why I will not put up a fight with her IF I am on a road and I've never been in a situation where I've been out of control either so don't just assume this!
If you have nothing positive and constructive to say keep your post to yourself!
Click to expand...

I thought that was actually a really constructive post with some good sound advice :confused3:
 
It was their attitude toward me that I didn't like very patronising, got some good advice form more positive people on here and I'm grateful for the positive posts thank you
 
Moodymareish said:
The bit and noseband has nothing to do with it, she's wore the same one for over a year and this is just a new thing .
Click to expand...

It might be worth looking at the bit and noseband, as I said my mare learnt this habit out of the blue but with a loose ring I couldn't prevent her from turning. I switched to a full cheek (still a snaffle but also added a copper peanut) and it helped me a lot as I had more control due to her being a mouth opener. Have had my mare almost 4 years and she has a bit change roughly every year as she is one of those clever mares that all of a sudden takes a dislike to a bit she has been in for a while. I have found the copper peanut is also really helpful as she loves playing with it so keeps her mind more on the job. I also changed to a comfort bridle which has helped loads!
Its all trial and error after all. Try the techniques suggested and if you still struggle with it then a bit change is a simple thing to try just in case it is that.
Good luck :)
 
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