Herbal cures for IBD just tosh or ....... ?

[ThreeFurs]

My 19 y o WB gelding was diagnosed with eosinphilic/lymphocytic-plasmacytic colitis (a form of IBD) on Christmas Eve last year. Symptoms were fatigue, weight loss, hind gut pain, and projectile diarrhea. Since then I've tried:

Blood tests [ELISA] - [normal]
Fecal tests [for everything] [normal]
Slippery Elm powder
Equisure
Digestive EQ
Flunixin [for when he was colicking]
Rectal biopsy/exam
Bio-sponge
Sulphacrate
Codeine
Meloxicam
Metronidazole
Fecal transplant
FEC tests
Moxidectin / praziquantal -- Spring and Autumn
Dexamethasone
Liphook hospital anti diarrhea/IBD diet [high roughage/high oil]
Light exercise/no exercise

We're about to trial Azathioprin, in addition to the steroid, which doesn't seem to be working anymore.

He's been on the steroids for six months now, and being Southern hemisphere, we're going through a slight Autumn flush with the pasture, and he's as bad as ever. Lost all gains from Jan-April, going backwards, about to try Azathioprin and possibly, in my vet's words a 'complete change of environment'.

I've been with my boy every single day since late Sept when the diarrhea came on; I've given him his Dex by IM injection, cleaned his bum, manure picked his paddock every second day so there is no chance Small Stronglyes can get a foothold in his paddock.

He's a beautiful [big] sweet stoic boy who I love, and yet, and yet, I have Yard Owners and others beside who are wanting me to try him on herbs from these people. https://www.mcdowellsherbal.com/treatments/for-horses/509-loose-stools
Look, maybe I'm close minded [medical family, and my doctorate in art history] but I don't think I am. My horses for their joints are on Pentosan [Pentosan polysulfate sodium 250 mg/mL) as well as 4Cyte Epitaalis Forte Gel [derived from a plant seed oil from the biota orientalis tree] I know both of these work to relieve arthritis, but both, of course, have been double blind reviewed in the journals.

But I can't come at herbs for Maddie's bowel at this point ... please help me with something tactful to say to the tumeric/boswellia/fenugreek crowd, because I'm losing the will to live. How are these firms allowed to make the claims they do? If it were for humans there would be a class action to end all class actions.

My horse has serious disease, with a poor to grave prognosis, in fact, the 'big decision' is looming. Please help explain why some people think a teaspoon of herbal powder will solve all.
ps: I am aware we need to treat the 'whole horse' and latest research points to a complex interplay between autoimmune bowel reactions, helminths [worms] and hind gut biota. They all work together. That I'm sure is true. More research needed.

 

[SEL]

There's not a huge amount of money in testing herbal mixes which cannot be sold for a huge profit. Have you looked at the Equibiome stuff? I know you are southern hemisphere but I'm sure those tests can be performed in your part of the world too.

My mare 'self cured' by gorging on white poplar trees when we moved yards and they overhung her field. All the drugs in the world hadn't helped her dodgy guts but two weeks of eating every branch she could reach and I've barely had a loose movement since.

 

[Widgeon]

There isn't enough money in veterinary medicine to pay for the randomized controlled trials that we would all ideally like. Hence the evidence base is pretty poor (certainly compared with human medicine). And that's for actual veterinary treatments, let alone herbal supplements.

That said, do you have evidence that adding herbs *wouldn't* help? It sounds like you think you may lose him, even after everything you've done for him, so personally I would find as much research as I could (even if it's pretty poor quality) and give it a go. If a aprticular herb or supplement is not working for him after a few months then that's probably all the answer you need. And the Equibiome assessment sounds like as good a place as any to start. At least it might give you some more information to think about.

FWIW, my day job is compiling and analysing human medical trial data, but I still have my horse on boswellia for his arthritis. I wouldn't have chosen it as the only line of treatment, but alongside all the various veterinary treatments he's had, I'm fairly happy that it is helping him day to day.

 

[Tiddlypom]

I've recommended running the Equibiome test to you before when you have posted previously about your horse. They do offer an international service.

It's helped many horses, and you lose nothing bar the cost of the test by trying it. The test is on a faecal sample, so is not invasive.

https://www.equibiome.org/product-page/petbiome-faecal-collection-kit-international

 

[ThreeFurs]

True. However in late December my boy had the 'ultimate' pre-pro biotic treatment with the fecal transplant. He got the live poo drenched directly into his gut from a mare on the property with great manure, no worms, no medications, no health issues, a biota mix perfect for our pasture and conditons.

All the right balance of Firmicutes, Bacteroidetes and Verrucomicrobia and for two weeks, Maddie's poo looked like the mare's. Firm, formed. Perfect. But then the autoimmune side of his disease sent a shit ton of white blood cells to his hind gut, water entered, and the diarrhea came back.

So while I'm glad we tried the fecal transplant, it didnt ultimately work, although it temporarily addressed the hind gut disbiosis. Which suggests there's something more going on.

 

[ThreeFurs]

Thanks Tids. Equibiome do now service Australia, and I'm looking into it. His biome is obvs wildly disturbed. One reason is that his gut motility is so fast, when he has the runs, that the good bacteria barely get time to work! In the year or so since I've had him he's not had any antibiotics or any pain killer that would upset the biota, so its all quite hard to find a cause. ie its not Right dorsal colitis from NSAIDs, as he's had none.

The only thing I can think of besides genetics, is that before I got him, up in another state, he wasn't regularly wormed for small strongles. Hence he was harboring a large load of long term hind gut damage from encysted small stronglys. I did him with mox'praq in Spring last year [Aussie spring Sept-Oct] and with the spring flush and sweet grass it was for him a perfect storm. And that's what brought on the disease. There is no other reason, no infections, no clostridium, no salmonella, no NSAIDS, no sand, no stress, [or very little]. But yes, a major change in pasture type. From tropical all year round to more European, seasonal C4 grasses, here in Mt Lofty range, phalaris, perennial rye, and subterranean clover.

 

[I'm Dun]

Has he been scoped for ulcers? I think I asked before but cant remember what you said. If he has those as well they will definitely be contributing to the issue.

The herbal mix you linked to would be something I would happily try. I'm not sure why you are so opposed to it if you've already tried slippery elm? It is fairly simple ingredients that others have had lots of success with. Lots of modern day medicines are based on the active compounds in herbal remedies.

Mine didn't get a diagnosis for his issues, but I gave him some protein quick fix, put him on a decent supplement like the one you linked to but with pre and probiotics and started him on the oily herbs. Hes now, touch wood, completely fine and looking amazing. It might have been a coincidence but it cost very little, would do no harm, so I had nothing to lose.

 

[Birker2020]

My 19 y o WB gelding was diagnosed with eosinphilic/lymphocytic-plasmacytic colitis (a form of IBD) on Christmas Eve last year. Symptoms were fatigue, weight loss, hind gut pain, and projectile diarrhea. Since then I've tried:

Blood tests [ELISA] - [normal]
Fecal tests [for everything] [normal]
Slippery Elm powder
Equisure
Digestive EQ
Flunixin [for when he was colicking]
Rectal biopsy/exam
Bio-sponge
Sulphacrate
Codeine
Meloxicam
Metronidazole
Fecal transplant
FEC tests
Moxidectin / praziquantal -- Spring and Autumn
Dexamethasone
Liphook hospital anti diarrhea/IBD diet [high roughage/high oil]
Light exercise/no exercise

Gosh my first reaction would be to say that you have tried an awful lot in five months, but nothing for very long.
Herbs can take weeks and in most cases months to work (liquid herbal supplement are slightly quicker).
Therefore you can't have given most of the things time in order to establish if they have worked or not.

 

[PurBee]

Thanks Tids. Equibiome do now service Australia, and I'm looking into it. His biome is obvs wildly disturbed. One reason is that his gut motility is so fast, when he has the runs, that the good bacteria barely get time to work! In the year or so since I've had him he's not had any antibiotics or any pain killer that would upset the biota, so its all quite hard to find a cause. ie its not Right dorsal colitis from NSAIDs, as he's had none.

The only thing I can think of besides genetics, is that before I got him, up in another state, he wasn't regularly wormed for small strongles. Hence he was harboring a large load of long term hind gut damage from encysted small stronglys. I did him with mox'praq in Spring last year [Aussie spring Sept-Oct] and with the spring flush and sweet grass it was for him a perfect storm. And that's what brought on the disease. There is no other reason, no infections, no clostridium, no salmonella, no NSAIDS, no sand, no stress, [or very little]. But yes, a major change in pasture type. From tropical all year round to more European, seasonal C4 grasses, here in Mt Lofty range, phalaris, perennial rye, and subterranean clover.

Im curious to ask how much clover in the pasture? It can be problematic from many angles, but one thing i specifically dont like about more than 10% clover in horse diets is the potential for a specific mould that develops in clovers in high temp/humidity environments and in some hays. This mould can cause many issues.
Without testing your pasture clover - and picking a test amount from various parts of the field….specifically more moist areas - you cant be certain if this is the issue.
The other aspect about clover is its potential for high nitrogen….high nitrogen food change caused my gelding to develop quite severe runny stools, for weeks on end. Another horse not affected. It didnt stop until food changed again - and i used probiotics/bentonite clay/aloe vera to support digestive healing.

Does your horse have any white/pink hair/skin? If clover liver damage has occurred you can see the sunburn from photosensitisation. Cant be seen on darker horses - despite liver damage.

https://forageplus.co.uk/why-is-there-too-much-clover-in-my-horse-pasture/


Rye also has some fluorescence compounds, contributing to photosensitisation in horses, but i think if i remember correctly - its moreso in tetraploid than traditional perennial rye.

legume feeds and hind gut issues are to be considered. Its not necessarily causative but in a horse with hindgut issues, legumes - due to the way theyre broken down in the gut, i would restrict to rule out any further problem potentials.

A change of pasture is a worthy experiement, after all youve tried.
Why one horse thrives and another doesnt on the same pasture can only be rationalised that the ill horse has an underlying issue unidentified - and the pasture may challenge that issue for that horse.

Fecal transplants on paper sound rational, but equibiome results (on humans and horses) show that every one to have a very individual population of bacteria - as individual as a fingerprint. So its rather a crude method - to give another mammal the bacteria from a healthy one, as its bound to cause a disturbance to the individual homeostasis, and isnt surprising to hear the immune system bolted onto the scene to sort out the ‘foreign invaders’.

The body knows how to and wants to heal - but cant if theres components in diet / or parasites ravaging/having damaged the intestines, that compromise healing. Hence i would move to a varied grass pasture with very little legumes, if possible. At this point in your journey its worth a try.

To help heal gut lining scientifically verified is glutamine amino acid. Others used are aloe vera. Bentonite clay is used to soak up gram positive bacteria and help soak up general bacterial toxins. I also used straight pre and probiotics.

Dont forget, many drugs on the market today were founded from plants, and then went onto be synthesised in a lab due to ’money’ issues. Nature cannot be patented. Yet wild herbs/roots/barks are all the foundation of our modern pharmaceuticals.
The disadvantage pharmaceuticals have over nature sourced medicines is they lack the other compounds the plant possesses to work synergistically with the main ‘active ingredient’.
So, plants/herbs/root remedies hold a value to healing not to be ruled-out. If anything they are a great alternative to try, as many do, with great success.

If science was the only source of knowledge that helps us, why are there so many issues in this world? Science answers a lot of our questions and offer a plethora of innovations to help, yet its narrow-sighted to discount everything else, just because the scientific industry (with more red-tape and beurocracy than a crime scene) cannot prove and give the answers to absolutely everything.

I looked at the digestive EQ you gave and unfortunately they dont give specific ingredients amounts. Im cynical when a company doesnt offer transparency with amounts in a product. It usually means there’s a cheap bulk filler…in this case ‘marine calcium’ - with small doses of the actual important components - MOS etc.
It would be worth a try to source a very good dosage pre-and pro biotic without fillers. Protexin is used this side of the world, im unsure of Aus alternatives - maybe protexin is global now?

If your horse was ravaged with worms before you got him, it suggests the immune system isnt doing its job killing eggs to allow such a high burden in the first place. Wild horses are not wormed at all and not all of them have huge parasite burdens. As a foundational support, you could give the basic nutrients essential for the immune system to work correctly - Vit A/C/E/D, selenium and zinc - these are usually included in many equine ‘pasture balancer’ supplement powders.

Has your vet run liver function tests to check out if there’s underlying liver issues? Just curious, as a dodgy liver can cause other body systems to go awry.

Youve tried a lot and understandably tired and questioning what next - sometimes stripping back to basics - good field, water, basic minerals/vits, is where we start from again, which it sounds like a move to a different field environment is warranted, especially if your vet is suggesting it too. Use gut supportive products like probiotics/glutamine alongside the change.
If a move is difficult/impossible - do you have any legume-free paddocks where you can turn out for exercise/freedom and feed a bought-in mixed grass only hay?

 

[lynz88]

Mine isn't having any of these issues but I have sent a fecal sample off to equibiome while waiting for a scope. For the past 2 weeks I've put him on a mix of oily herbs that some others have mentioned as well. Not sure if related but his sarcoids have really started to crust over at a very fast rate and looks like another one has started to form but is almost ready to be popped out. From what I've been reading, I wouldn't rule out herbal mixes - especially if the field isn't full of particularly nutritious grass. I can't wait for my equibiome report to come back.

 

[hobo]

Are you able to get Protexin gut balancer I swear by it for keeping a calm gut. It will not do any harm if it does not help but it keeps mine in great gut condition.

 

[Northern]

You have tried so many things over a very short period of time, I'm not surprised things aren't working so well for your poor boy.

I note you haven't had him scoped for ulcers (from your previous post early May), so I would start with scoping to rule out any additional problems causing his issues. Metronidazole as an antibiotic can disturb gut flora, and meloxicam can cause gastric ulceration.

Supplements are all well and good but most on the market here have no research behind them at all so I would be tempted to take a "less is more" approach and start anew with an elimination diet. Are you able to pull him off the grass and have him somewhere you can completely control everything he eats? You need to start with a very simple roughage based diet and slowly introduce changes from there. You may only need to do it for a month to 6 weeks so see a change, if it is truly his environment causing the problems. Consider also the origin of your hay. Australia has had a very odd season weather wise (though not sure if it has been as wet in SA?) so it could really be the environment causing these changes, I believe mycotoxins are rampant at the moment as a result of the humid and wet weather.

The addition of protexin would also not hurt (Sold as ProN8ure here) and I would also want a blood panel run to check his organ functions (if you haven't already done so). You're clearly very invested in getting him better, he's a lucky boy! As for the herbs, I personally would reach for them only after an elimination diet/environment change hasn't worked and you don't have many options left.

 

[quizzie]

Ok…2 things jump out at me….

1st : is that diagnosis a presumptive one, or do you have a gut biopsy proving it?

2nd : one treatment DID work….the faecal transplant, albeit only in the short term, but it did prove that for that period of time the gut was capable of functioning normally.

Assuming the diagnosis was presumptive/ excluding other possible causes, is there any reason that you cannot repeat the faecal transplant multiple times…..initially on a 1-2 weekly interval, and then hopefully extending the intervals. In a gut potentially as seriously disrupted as this, it will take months for the micro biome to normalise, and also months for the gut wall to recover.

I would also definitely look into the Equibiome system, in particular the oily herbs, as they can provide the right environment within the gut for the right bacteria to flourish…but again..it’s a slow process.

The gut in the horse, and it’s associated micro biome are a major part of the immune system function…I am wondering if you have a chicken and egg situation here?
…….Did the diarrhoea cause the gut wall/immune function failure, or is an autoimmune disease causing the diarrhoea…….? I suspect there are elements of both, but trying to control the response of the immune system seems to be failing…..so try attack the problem more intensively from the other direction. It may not work, but is only mildly invasive(drenching), and carries very little risk of adverse reactions.

 

[ThreeFurs]

You have tried so many things over a very short period of time, I'm not surprised things aren't working so well for your poor boy.

I note you haven't had him scoped for ulcers (from your previous post early May), so I would start with scoping to rule out any additional problems causing his issues. Metronidazole as an antibiotic can disturb gut flora, and meloxicam can cause gastric ulceration.

Supplements are all well and good but most on the market here have no research behind them at all so I would be tempted to take a "less is more" approach and start anew with an elimination diet. Are you able to pull him off the grass and have him somewhere you can completely control everything he eats? You need to start with a very simple roughage based diet and slowly introduce changes from there. You may only need to do it for a month to 6 weeks so see a change, if it is truly his environment causing the problems. Consider also the origin of your hay. Australia has had a very odd season weather wise (though not sure if it has been as wet in SA?) so it could really be the environment causing these changes, I believe mycotoxins are rampant at the moment as a result of the humid and wet weather.

The addition of protexin would also not hurt (Sold as ProN8ure here) and I would also want a blood panel run to check his organ functions (if you haven't already done so). You're clearly very invested in getting him better, he's a lucky boy! As for the herbs, I personally would reach for them only after an elimination diet/environment change hasn't worked and you don't have many options left.

The first half of the list are actually things my vet tried Sept-Dec last year when she thought it was chronic diarrhea, with an unknown cause. The blood and fecal panels were done likewise, around the same time. I should add the Metronidazole was given rectally not orally, [many months ago now before the diagnosis] - my vet said this way it had an anti-inflammatory effect. I almost never give the Meloxicam, [about 3 times over the last 9 months and only when he's in obvious pain]. So it looks like a lot of 'treatments' over a short time, but for the last five months he's just on the steroid, (Dexamethasone), a daily 2 Tb of biosponge, and vitamin/min mix.

But thanks so much for you advice. My hay is local, no floods here, just freezing cold! I am looking at some places that do large yards with stables on a short term 'rehab' kind of basis, to see what happens when he's pulled off the grass. Here in the Hills Autumn/Winter brings on a similar burst of young green grass, not as crazy as Spring but, its definitely not helping!

 

[Birker2020]

You have tried so many things over a very short period of time, I'm not surprised things aren't working so well for your poor boy.
.

That's exactly what I said in reply 8. The OP needs to give three or four months to see if a supplement works and in order to test if it is working correctly is to then, at a later stage, do a withdrawal test which is what I did with my previous horse. It was very obvious that what she was on was very necessary.

 

[ThreeFurs]

Ok…2 things jump out at me….

1st : is that diagnosis a presumptive one, or do you have a gut biopsy proving it?

2nd : one treatment DID work….the faecal transplant, albeit only in the short term, but it did prove that for that period of time the gut was capable of functioning normally.

Assuming the diagnosis was presumptive/ excluding other possible causes, is there any reason that you cannot repeat the faecal transplant multiple times…..initially on a 1-2 weekly interval, and then hopefully extending the intervals. In a gut potentially as seriously disrupted as this, it will take months for the micro biome to normalise, and also months for the gut wall to recover.

I would also definitely look into the Equibiome system, in particular the oily herbs, as they can provide the right environment within the gut for the right bacteria to flourish…but again..it’s a slow process.

The gut in the horse, and it’s associated micro biome are a major part of the immune system function…I am wondering if you have a chicken and egg situation here?
…….Did the diarrhoea cause the gut wall/immune function failure, or is an autoimmune disease causing the diarrhoea…….? I suspect there are elements of both, but trying to control the response of the immune system seems to be failing…..so try attack the problem more intensively from the other direction. It may not work, but is only mildly invasive(drenching), and carries very little risk of adverse reactions.

Thanks Quizzie. We do have a rectal biopsy that revealed 'moderate eosinophilic-lymphoplasmacytic colitis' -- my vet messaged me with it, I don't know the degree of hind gut wall thickening.

I mean I think you've hit the nail on the head. It is a moot point which problem came first. I know there's a problem, a dysbiosis, I can smell the lactic acid in his [watery] manure.

Doing repeat fecal transplants is a good idea, I'd just like to get things a bit more stable re the gut so the 'good' bacteria have chance! And I want to get an Equibiome test done.

 

[quizzie]

Definitely get the test done before trying to change the microbiome, but the results will take several weeks to come back, so if I were you, I would be inclined to start treatments as soon as I had taken the sample.

Ideally I would do the faecal transplant and give Equibiomes' prebiotic (it's on their website), plus buy a selection of the oily herbs locally......Horses tend not to want to eat the fresh versions, so most people seem to use dried thyme, rosemary and oregano, mixed in equal quantities, and feed between 25 and 50ml scoop 2 x daily( I don't think the precise amount is too crucial!).

 

[Northern]

The first half of the list are actually things my vet tried Sept-Dec last year when she thought it was chronic diarrhea, with an unknown cause. The blood and fecal panels were done likewise, around the same time. I should add the Metronidazole was given rectally not orally, [many months ago now before the diagnosis] - my vet said this way it had an anti-inflammatory effect. I almost never give the Meloxicam, [about 3 times over the last 9 months and only when he's in obvious pain]. So it looks like a lot of 'treatments' over a short time, but for the last five months he's just on the steroid, (Dexamethasone), a daily 2 Tb of biosponge, and vitamin/min mix.

But thanks so much for you advice. My hay is local, no floods here, just freezing cold! I am looking at some places that do large yards with stables on a short term 'rehab' kind of basis, to see what happens when he's pulled off the grass. Here in the Hills Autumn/Winter brings on a similar burst of young green grass, not as crazy as Spring but, its definitely not helping!

It was not clear in your post about the timeline of when all these things have been tried and to what extent. It's still an extensive list of medications and supplement changes that can definitely affect an already GI sensitive horse. I asked about the hay because I wonder if you could source hay from out of area (Victoria?) if you were to stable him and found no change from a local hay only diet. Tricky to organise, it depends how far you would like to go to try things.

Has your vet chatted about a referral to a uni clinic? It may be worth contacting Wagga or Camden to have a look at his case, rather than continuing to throw random treatments at him in the hope something works.

 

[ThreeFurs]

From 'tosh' to an open mind! My boy starts on oily herbs today, and I'm sorry in original post if I dissed them. Have been turned around in my thinking by reading and re-reading your replies. And yep, Northern, uni hospital referral might be the final way to go. We have 'Roseworthy' here, part of Uni of Adelaide Vet School.

Treatments were pretty much as suggested in Prof Andy Durham's paper in vet times see attached. A diarrhea treatment that works for one horse won't work for another, which is it seems random, but we've tried to work from least to most 'invasive' in terms of possible side effects.

Re vet's suggestion of 'complete change of environment' The GOOD news is I've found a short term board place, for three - four weeks for him locally, where we can take him off the wet new autumn pasture onto a meadow hay diet. He will have the same hay he's had for last six months, with a slice of lucerne, vit/min supplement, the linseed oil and herbs.

I'm anxious as this will markedly up the amount of dry roughage he gets. He's a good drinker though. I chose this place as its essentially a racehorse/polo pony rehab centre, with huge stables, sand day yards run by experienced people who are around all day putting horses on walkers/treatments and doing other treatments so he will be under observation. I will be up every day to check / do DIY stuff.

Still I'm apprehensive as he's used to living 'out' 24/7. All the advice out there is mainly on transitioning horses from hay to spring pasture. Not much on transitioning from pasture to hay. Any advice?

 

[lynz88]

Definitely get the test done before trying to change the microbiome, but the results will take several weeks to come back, so if I were you, I would be inclined to start treatments as soon as I had taken the sample.

This is what I did. I have to say his dinner and breakfast smell wonderful since adding the oily herbs lol!!! I also benefit because I run out of these herbs quickly as I cook with them (especially oregano) all the time

 

[Clodagh]

From 'tosh' to an open mind! My boy starts on oily herbs today, and I'm sorry in original post if I dissed them. Have been turned around in my thinking by reading and re-reading your replies. And yep, Northern, uni hospital referral might be the final way to go. We have 'Roseworthy' here, part of Uni of Adelaide Vet School.

Treatments were pretty much as suggested in Prof Andy Durham's paper in vet times see attached. A diarrhea treatment that works for one horse won't work for another, which is it seems random, but we've tried to work from least to most 'invasive' in terms of possible side effects.

Re vet's suggestion of 'complete change of environment' The GOOD news is I've found a short term board place, for three - four weeks for him locally, where we can take him off the wet new autumn pasture onto a meadow hay diet. He will have the same hay he's had for last six months, with a slice of lucerne, vit/min supplement, the linseed oil and herbs.

I'm anxious as this will markedly up the amount of dry roughage he gets. He's a good drinker though. I chose this place as its essentially a racehorse/polo pony rehab centre, with huge stables, sand day yards run by experienced people who are around all day putting horses on walkers/treatments and doing other treatments so he will be under observation. I will be up every day to check / do DIY stuff.

Still I'm apprehensive as he's used to living 'out' 24/7. All the advice out there is mainly on transitioning horses from hay to spring pasture. Not much on transitioning from pasture to hay. Any advice?

No advice but best of luck and I hope he turns around for you.

 

[SEL]

I had to put a pony from 24:7 turnout to box rest so she went onto a hay diet from grass. She isn't a great drinker in her stable either. I dunked her nets in water for 30 mins or so which helped with the dust as well as hydration. Sloppy feeds to also get some water into her

She was fine but I did see quite a marked change in her poo for the better (she was on box rest for a leg injury but she's never had great guts)

Good luck!

 

[Shilasdair]

Your horse sounds very much like one of mine; she came within 5 days of being PTS after Idiopathic Focal Eosinophilic Enteritis colic surgery.
She turned out to have an allergy to rye grass- as long as she was grazing, she was ill.
My solution has been to limit her access to grass, initially entirely, and feeding her only those forages that don't contain rye grass (alfalfa aka lucerne, timothy, etc).
Perhaps you could try the same for your horse - if you are considering PTS you have nothing to lose.
I wasn't initially aware which grass in particular mine was allergic to - so fed her entirely on alfalfa then did a process of experimentation to find out.
Mine has survived ten years on Prednisolone, without any symptoms, living a happy life at my expense.

 

[ThreeFurs]

Your horse sounds very much like one of mine; she came within 5 days of being PTS after Idiopathic Focal Eosinophilic Enteritis colic surgery.
She turned out to have an allergy to rye grass- as long as she was grazing, she was ill.
My solution has been to limit her access to grass, initially entirely, and feeding her only those forages that don't contain rye grass (alfalfa aka lucerne, timothy, etc).
Perhaps you could try the same for your horse - if you are considering PTS you have nothing to lose.
I wasn't initially aware which grass in particular mine was allergic to - so fed her entirely on alfalfa then did a process of experimentation to find out.

Mine has survived ten years on Prednisolone, without any symptoms, living a happy life at my expense.

Gosh that's a close call. Glad she had a good life with you after that. We have a lot of perennial rye in pasture seed mixes around here, probably in his meadow/grass hay too. Am feeding 2/3 to 1/3 grass hay to lucerne atm and he's losing condition. Better when it was 50/50. His is disease is a protein-losing one so may increase the lucerne again.

ps: his breathe, after the oil herbs yesterday, smells wonderful.