Herd bound behaviour at end of a hunt

[MissP]

I sometimes take my horse out with the bloodhounds (human-scent-based 'mock' hunt), and he is bold and brave, preferring to be near the front of the group. However, when we get back to the boxes, he displays very herd-bound behaviour. He will plant stubbornly the split second he is asked to take a step forward away from the group (to walk to our trailer for example). After a wash down and rest, he will also refuse to load, stubbornly gazing in the direction of other horses (which are by now pretty much all loaded) and acting as if the ramp is invisible. It can take 15 mins or so to load him, if he doesn't have a travel buddy. I appreciate this might not seem a long time, but I'd like to address it before it gets worse and because I find it really frustrating (I know getting cross won't help :/).

I can see this is basically a problem that he much prefers other horse's company to mine, and it is magnified 10x by hunting. Does anyone have advice please on how to refocus his attention after a hunt please? I appreciate working on a better bond in general will help. However, this more extreme stubborness is only seen after a hunt, so I am struggling to address it with groundwork at home.

.....Some more background below if of interest:

He's never come to the field gate for me, but will happily let me walk up and catch him - that mind set probably sums him up quite well - he doesn't need human interaction but will accept it. He is pretty well trained at home - he can be led away from his field buddies, doesn't nap at shows, and will lead a hack or hack alone with some encouragement. He's a conny and has always been stubborn and liked to test. It's taken a lot of ground and ridden work to get him polite and to improve his confidence as he used to be very quick to plant in a variety of situations (hacking, jumping) or to freak out (e.g. clippers, farrier). With some training he now loads fine and travels well alone or in company. FYI for loading I use a dually halter. I will use a treat as a reward, but not to cajool. I'm not a fan of using lunge lines and other pressure and he doesn't react well in any case - the more pressure, the bigger the tantrum. With him (as with any horse), it is better to tackle his mindset than to try to bully.

Thanks!

 

[alexomahony]

Sounds very similar to my welsh cob. His adrenaline is sky high after a hunt so it's very hard to get his attention until he's willing to refocus.

I had this issue with mine when he wasn't a very reliable loader (would go on sometimes, but not others). I retrained him to walk himself up the ramp - therefore him making the decision and #fingerscrossed I've not had the issue since learning this way - he's always gone on. Sometimes takes a little longer after hunting (5 mins rather than straight up) just as I need to refocus him and bring his adrenaline down.

I wonder if there's a routine or something you could teach pre loading which encourage her to refocus on you?

I'm sorry I'm not lots of help - but I know how you feel, it's so hard to practice at home as nothing much can replicate a post hunt horse!!

 

[MissP]

Sounds very similar to my welsh cob. His adrenaline is sky high after a hunt so it's very hard to get his attention until he's willing to refocus.

I had this issue with mine when he wasn't a very reliable loader (would go on sometimes, but not others). I retrained him to walk himself up the ramp - therefore him making the decision and #fingerscrossed I've not had the issue since learning this way - he's always gone on. Sometimes takes a little longer after hunting (5 mins rather than straight up) just as I need to refocus him and bring his adrenaline down.

I wonder if there's a routine or something you could teach pre loading which encourage her to refocus on you?

I'm sorry I'm not lots of help - but I know how you feel, it's so hard to practice at home as nothing much can replicate a post hunt horse!!

Thank you! How did you go about training him to load himself?

 

[Michen]

I have a horse who used to be impossible to travel on his own, and extremely clingy to other horses. He’s at the point now where even though still Adrenalin filled at the end of a hunt, I can put his best buddie on the lorry with him whilst we go and have tea, and we can then take said buddy off with no problems. Would have been unimaginable before.

What’s he like loading etc at shows?

Have you tried putting him on the lorry to untack etc, straight on?

Maybe a bucket of mash, I used spillers speedi mash and hang it up for Bog to nibble on.

Failing that trying to park as far from the meet as possible/other lorries etc so he can’t see other horses when loading?

 

[MissP]

Hi Michen, thanks for the response.

Loading at shows - fine with a travel friend. Used he to be sticky alone, but I did a trailer loading session recently and he was easy as pie last week, even though it had gone dark.

Untacking in trailer - nope not tried that. I like to wash down after the hunt so that might be tricky, although I guess I could rug up and do when home. He was being a pain to lead in tack after the meet too though so might well still plant.

Mash - could try that yep. haha - I call mine Bog too

Parking away - space usually so limited I don't think I could. I did wonder about parking so I am facing the others though. He is easier to load if it means walking in the 'right' direction for him. Unfortunately I was blocked in facing away yesterday! Oh..and next to a shed of 50 cattle. And his girlfrield was also calling to him!

 

[tatty_v]

Sounds quite similar to my Connie! For him, we load and re-load multiple times at home, on arrival, when we’ve finished whatever we’re doing, and when we get home. People probably think we’re bonkers, but it somehow makes loading less of an “event” and just a boring thing he’s already done multiple times that day! We also have a bucket of feed on the trailer - not to tempt him on but as a reward. I also use a Richard maxwell halter and if I think he’s not listening, we do some groundwork first, at the venue if needs be!

 

[Michen]

Hi Michen, thanks for the response.

Loading at shows - fine with a travel friend. Used he to be sticky alone, but I did a trailer loading session recently and he was easy as pie last week, even though it had gone dark.

Untacking in trailer - nope not tried that. I like to wash down after the hunt so that might be tricky, although I guess I could rug up and do when home. He was being a pain to lead in tack after the meet too though so might well still plant.

Mash - could try that yep. haha - I call mine Bog too

Parking away - space usually so limited I don't think I could. I did wonder about parking so I am facing the others though. He is easier to load if it means walking in the 'right' direction for him. Unfortunately I was blocked in facing away yesterday! Oh..and next to a shed of 50 cattle. And his girlfrield was also calling to him!

Aha! Is that a nick name? Mine came over as Jack but I changed it to Boggle because his eyes were popping out so much when we unloaded him at the service station 🙈

Good luck with it, a pain to fix but I, sure he will get there, I would try the loading straight away before he’s had time to unwind a little and think about life, my last Connie could be like that and it worked for him but agree I like to wash down at the hunt too.

 

[MissP]

Thanks! Mine's nicknamed Bog a.k.a. Bog Pony because he's so good at getting himself in a muddy mess and I was forever saying "did you grow up in a bog?!" I'll try the quicker loading.

 

[only_me]

I wouldn't think it is because of your bond that he prefers the company of horses rather than humans, it's because he is a horse!

When leaving the group Try and entice him with a polo or if he won't move forwards turn him sideways so his feet do move if you are on the ground. His adrenaline and excitement will still be high after a hunt. If you are on him and he refuses to move because of the others I would be getting quite strict with him tbh as it is not a habit you want to create. You can be as gentle as you like but it hasn't worked so far. A well timed use of the whip can be enough to show them that you are still in control; it's not like he is in pain and refusing to go forwards. A friend once likened it to a slap to gain someone in hysterics/shock's attention lol. doesn't need to be hard but enough to "wake".

As for loading I would maybe have a haynet ready and tied up and maybe a bucket with a small handful of feed in it that you can rattle. And I would potentially walk him around and around the lorry/trailer for a few more minutes and then load. If it is a trailer can you put front ramp down so appears to be walking through rather than into a shut in?

 

[Fiona]

If he is food oriented, then I'd definitely try a handful of nuts or something rattly in a bucket...

Is he any better if you walk him for a bit longer before trying to load, so the adrenalin has died down a bit, and some of his friends have already left?

Fiona

 

[Shay]

Our Connie did the same too when we first got him. I was warned that after hunting you would need to "chase him with a broom" to get him on the lorry. (I have NEVER done that!) We did loads of loading practice at home - for weeks in the first summer we loaded and unloaded him several times a day, fed on the trailer, drove round the block etc. The first season he would plant a bit at the end of a hunt - but a bit of ground work to get his attention would suffice. This season he's not had an issue at all - walks straight on. He does like the front bar down to load (put up before travel!) and we do treat once on.

I think for us it was just understanding what works for him, not rushing him and not pressuring him at all. Loads of ground work not connected to loading. Oh - and we clicker trained him to perform tricks. We can always get his attention back by asking him to perform something.

 

[alexomahony]

Thank you! How did you go about training him to load himself?

Hiya - sorry I haven't responded yet, I only get to see these now on my work computer at lunch time

There are lots of videos about it on YouTube but basically it takes A LONG time but if he is smart and sensitive he'll get it relatively quickly. I use the end of his leadrope to annoy him, like tapping it on his bum or sides then as soon as he takes a step in the right direction, I stop and he gets a pat. NO food unless they walk fully in.

After so long he'll realise that going in means food, standing on the ramp thinking about it means being annoyed. Mine now rushes up any ramp possible and stands and waits for me to feed him haha