He's afraid of the gate . . .

PolarSkye

PolarSkye

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Please bear with me while I set the scene.

Pops has to go through a particular gate to get to his field. It's a small pedestrian gate set into a corner of the field . . . hard up against a fence line that has a tree line planted alongside (with some shrubs), left of that a lane used by the farm workers, left of that a thick-ish hedge, and left of that again a busy road. He finds the fence line/gate entrance very scary and is now becoming difficult to catch/lead through said gate.

The gate is new . . . it was put in because a fellow livery threw her toys out of the pram about him being led through her field to the big gate (the irony here is that he is still led through her field but we won't go there). He HAS to go through her field whether we use the big gate or the small gate (into his field). The entry to the big gate is very poached because it's a "corner" which meets other fields with horses in it and they have all been congregating . . . and as he has come back into work after a suspensory injury I am naturally anxious to avoid deep ground - small gate is, for now, relatively dry. But it's in a corner, on a scary fence line.

I have tried advance and retreat . . . and that's working - to a point - but he is showing me every way he can that he doesn't like going through that gate . . . he hangs out by the other gate and tries to pull me to that gate when I'm leading him to the other one . . . he grows/gets snorty as we approach the scary gate . . . he rushes through it and I have to be careful to make sure the gate is wide open and that I step out of his way so he doesn't knock me over, although he does try very hard to be polite/stay out of my way (it's not a proper five-bar gate, it's just wide enough for him with about eight inches or so to spare on either side).

I would like to try and get him used to using this gate . . . I don't really want to open up the other gateway (I have fenced it off because it's so deep/slippy) . . . but I also don't want to turn an otherwise amenable horse who has always been happy to be caught/led anywhere into a bargey so-and-so.

Any ideas/thoughts on how I can make this gateway "friendly"?

I had thought about using treats, but he shares the field with a dominant four-year-old and I'm not sure introducing food into the mix would be helpful or constructive . . . I don't need a battle over food in a gateway in a corner.

P
 
What about a treat once he's gone through the gate? Should cause a problem with his field mate but still give positive reinforcement.

Any idea about which bit of the new gate he doesn't like? Could it just be because it new?
 
I had a similar problem in the summer when my horse was at livery in the summer, the gate problem not the idiot in the next field problem. It was a small gap in the electric fencing, he hated going through it, he nearly ran me over at one point. This is very unlike him, he is usually a very polite young man. I just kept walking through it, not stoping until he did it sensibly. After a few days he just settled. Your horse prob thinks you have gone mental and forgotten where the real gate is, that's prob what is worrying him more then the size of the small gate.
 
I would go with the tried and tested:

Feed him next to it.
Treat immediately before going through & treat when passed and standing quietly again.
Do it over and over till he's ok with it and then do it some more.
Stay frosty! ;)

Don't overthink it and make yourself act and think like it's no big deal and eventually it will be :) Imagine the advice you would give someone else in your situation and do that.
Good luck!
 
catroo said:
What about a treat once he's gone through the gate? Should cause a problem with his field mate but still give positive reinforcement.

Any idea about which bit of the new gate he doesn't like? Could it just be because it new?
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I had thought about this . . . (treating once he's gone through the gate), I'm just worried that other horse will see and start to follow.

Thinking about it, I don't think it's the gate he's worried about, so much as the fence line NEXT to the gate (gate is set into left hand corner so he worries about the rustly, hard-to-see-through fence line hard on his left). Yesterday I tried getting him to do advance/retreat with the fence line . . . it helped a little bit, but he was still very worried, bless him.

P
 
sandi_84 said:
I would go with the tried and tested:

Feed him next to it.
Treat immediately before going through & treat when passed and standing quietly again.
Do it over and over till he's ok with it and then do it some more.
Stay frosty! ;)

Don't overthink it and make yourself act and think like it's no big deal and eventually it will be :) Imagine the advice you would give someone else in your situation and do that.
Good luck!
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I am not going to feed him next to it - I have to walk through fellow livery's field (carrying the feed) and her mare is a greedy cow and a known kicker - I would rather she wasn't hanging around gateways while I am leading him back through . . . also, I would worry about the horse he shares a field with getting "muggy" and I don't need him crowding the "scary" gateway.

We're trying the rinse and repeat method - going backwards and forwards through the gate until he relaxes/gets bored . . . but as I said in another reply, I actually think it's the fence line that's worrying him more than the gate - he's just shooting through the gate because he's trying to get away from the scariness of the fence line.

I know exactly what you mean by me acting like it's no big deal . . . I had to remind myself to relax my shoulders and breathe yesterday - but it's a little daunting walking in front of a 16.3hh 'fraidy cat who has grown another hand, and is snorting like a dragon through a rather narrow space. I know he is trying VERY hard not to flatten me, but the thought is there . . . and this is new for me - I've never been worried about handling him before :(. He is such a lamb and always comes back to me/respects me on the ground.

P
 
Sukistokes2 said:
I had a similar problem in the summer when my horse was at livery in the summer, the gate problem not the idiot in the next field problem. It was a small gap in the electric fencing, he hated going through it, he nearly ran me over at one point. This is very unlike him, he is usually a very polite young man. I just kept walking through it, not stoping until he did it sensibly. After a few days he just settled. Your horse prob thinks you have gone mental and forgotten where the real gate is, that's prob what is worrying him more then the size of the small gate.
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I think he does think I'm insane . . . he goes and stands by the big gate (well as close as he can get to it as I've fenced it off) and looks rather confused when I lead him to opposite corner. I will keep doing the "making it boring" endless repetition - oddly, he's fine when he is turned out through it, it's just when I bring him in that he has a problem with it.

P
 
Try leading him from the other side, if he is happy going back through it may be due to the fact you are between him and whatever is worrying him, I have a scary bit of hedge and often swap sides to walk them past one way, going the other way is never an issue.
 
Can you prop it open for some practice so you are not faffing about holding the gate and then, presumably, needing to turn him straight away one he is through. If you can I would do that and then just practice walking through, circling on the other side, turn and repeat. He should pretty soon get bored of it and it will no longer be a big deal.
 
Could you get him through the gate, with a feed on the other side waiting for him. No worry about the other one following him through as you're not taking anything to the field. But it would mean he could stand at the gate eating, spending some time there getting used to it.

Has he ever been trapped in a gate or door as it seems it may be the width of it that is getting him anxious. Fly would happily go through any large gate, but when narrow, she got quite anxious and almost jumped through.
 
_GG_ said:
Could you get him through the gate, with a feed on the other side waiting for him. No worry about the other one following him through as you're not taking anything to the field. But it would mean he could stand at the gate eating, spending some time there getting used to it.

Has he ever been trapped in a gate or door as it seems it may be the width of it that is getting him anxious. Fly would happily go through any large gate, but when narrow, she got quite anxious and almost jumped through.
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I can't get feed up to that particular gate without walking through a field with another horse in it - one that is a total gannet and has kicked a horse to death before now . . . I'm not worried about her mugging me, but I AM worried about having to go back through with Kal with her waiting at HER gate - I already carry a whip to make sure I can get her to clear orf if she crowds either gate - I am NOT prepared to risk her kicking Kali - she has feet like dinner plates and I trust her about as far as I can throw her.

I'm also not convinced that the width of the gate is the issue - before this gate was installed, he went happily through another one of a similar size . . . I really do think it's the fence line/hedge/partly visible road, etc.

P
 
be positive said:
Try leading him from the other side, if he is happy going back through it may be due to the fact you are between him and whatever is worrying him, I have a scary bit of hedge and often swap sides to walk them past one way, going the other way is never an issue.
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There isn't enough room for me to lead him next to me - he is behind me going through the gate - hence my worry about him spooking/rushing through and flattening me :(. And as I said further up, he's absolutely fine going through the gate to go INTO his field when he is turned out in the morning . . . it's just going through it coming OUT of the field that's an issue.

P
 
Sprig said:
Can you prop it open for some practice so you are not faffing about holding the gate and then, presumably, needing to turn him straight away one he is through. If you can I would do that and then just practice walking through, circling on the other side, turn and repeat. He should pretty soon get bored of it and it will no longer be a big deal.
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I've been doing this - the four-year-old isn't following/at all keen to come with us, so I can actually leave the gate open while we go backwards and forwards . . . perhaps I just need to persevere and do it more rather than just twice or three times at a time?

P
 
So I've bought some treats (I don't feed treats as a rule so didn't have any) so I can reward him with something tasty after he goes through the gate . . . but I do want to be careful about not rewarding the rushing, but rather rewarding the walking through calmly.

I also had a think this morning and decided that perhaps getting him to make friends with the fence line might help . . . so tied up two haynets filled with juicy haylage on the scary fence, one right in front of the big scary log (he hates logs - well specifically the ends of logs - odd horse) and another one far enough up that the four-year-old can't guard both (he's very dominant). I don't know if it will help . . . but it can't hurt, surely?

P

P.S. I did have to go up armed with a whip because, as predicted, big mare came over to mug me - and, while I don't necessarily mind being mugged, I don't want her coming over while I'm leading my boy . . . I would never hit her with it, but it's nice to be able to extend my reach/clearly mark out my personal space (and my preference that she not be in it).
 
Have you tried asking him to go backwards through the gate? Sometimes reversing uses a different part of their brain and they forget to be scared :)
 
I would suggest it is not a visual thing but the smell of something that is making your horse hesitant to go through the gateway. Horses have very much more sensitive senses of smell than we do and in fact map a route by the memory of smell rather than just visual things.
 
OWLIE185 said:
I would suggest it is not a visual thing but the smell of something that is making your horse hesitant to go through the gateway. Horses have very much more sensitive senses of smell than we do and in fact map a route by the memory of smell rather than just visual things.
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This had occurred to me . . . but as I can't see (or smell) what it is that may be frightening him, I can't remove it . . . so I need to find a way to get him not to be afraid of it . . . if that makes sense?

P
 
stencilface said:
Its not scientific, its just the method I've used for getting mine past anything when he's being a big plank about it all.
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And a big plank is precisely what Kali is being! Actually, that's not entirely fair - he's genuinely frightened of something . . . I just need to find a way to get the Big Plank to realize that all is good and hunky dory ;).

P
 
There was a thread this week with a link to a great piece about Temple Grandin and her thoughts about horses (she's an American autistic lady who due to her disability can think like animals and thus advise on safe handling and despooking techniques). The article it links to would be worth a look, she talks about horses saving 'photos' of something that was in their vision when a scary thing happened, e.g. saw fence while firework was going off. Def worth a read.
 
Wiz201 said:
is it possible to trim the hedge down a few inches so he can see what's coming?
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"Hedge" is really a misnomer . . . it's more intermittent scrub - so in some places dense/thick rhododendrons and holly, in other places nothing, with trees behind in some places, there's a fallen tree with the cut end facing towards the fence . . . beyond that lot there's a lawn and a drive that runs perpendicular to the fence line, more lawn and then a HUGE laurel hedge that (mostly) screens a busy road. Distance from the fence line to the laurel hedge is probably 500 feet. He can hear the traffic and partially see it. There are squirrels and other small furries in the scrub and trees hard up against the fence line. It's just unfortunate that the densest part of the scrubby bit is near the gate . . . or perhaps that's a total red herring and it's something else (like a funny smell or a memory) . . .

P

P.S. And, no, I can't trim anything - not my property . . . :(
 
sidewaysonacob said:
There was a thread this week with a link to a great piece about Temple Grandin and her thoughts about horses (she's an American autistic lady who due to her disability can think like animals and thus advise on safe handling and despooking techniques). The article it links to would be worth a look, she talks about horses saving 'photos' of something that was in their vision when a scary thing happened, e.g. saw fence while firework was going off. Def worth a read.
Click to expand...

Wow - thank you! Off to read up about that . . .

P
 
PolarSkye said:
I can't get feed up to that particular gate without walking through a field with another horse in it - one that is a total gannet and has kicked a horse to death before now . . . I'm not worried about her mugging me, but I AM worried about having to go back through with Kal with her waiting at HER gate - I already carry a whip to make sure I can get her to clear orf if she crowds either gate - I am NOT prepared to risk her kicking Kali - she has feet like dinner plates and I trust her about as far as I can throw her.

I'm also not convinced that the width of the gate is the issue - before this gate was installed, he went happily through another one of a similar size . . . I really do think it's the fence line/hedge/partly visible road, etc.

P
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:(

I really feel for you...it sounds like a really challenging situation and I wish I could think of something else to help.

I wonder if something has spooked him there and he's just lost his confidence with that fence line/hedge/road? :( xxx
 
_GG_ said:
:(

I really feel for you...it sounds like a really challenging situation and I wish I could think of something else to help.

I wonder if something has spooked him there and he's just lost his confidence with that fence line/hedge/road? :( xxx
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It's a bit of a mystery/pain in the bum really. I'm with you on him having lost confidence . . . but the irony is that he hacks down that drive with no problems at all . . . so he's fine on the other side of that fence line! Horses, eh?

P
 
PolarSkye said:
It's a bit of a mystery/pain in the bum really. I'm with you on him having lost confidence . . . but the irony is that he hacks down that drive with no problems at all . . . so he's fine on the other side of that fence line! Horses, eh?

P
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Hey, we had a deer caught in a hedge at my old livery yard and all the horses were out 24/7 as it was the summer. I got up there about 6:50am and the horses were all over the place, but all in the front paddocks, not their own. The hedge was less than 3ft wide and this little doe was literally screaming. YO was not far behind me and we freed the doe...but for love nor money, we could not get the horses anywhere near that part of the hedge for months!

That post about "photo's" in the mind really makes sense when you think of a situation like that.

It could be anything. A kestrel or fox could have killed a rabbit there or foxes/badgers could have had a fight there, all of which can mean horrifying noises.
 
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