HGE

[Penny Less]

My old dog has fairly regular episodes of HGE or colitis (which is a different thing I know), last one was in June and he was down the emergency vets overnight. He has mucus in his poo again today with a bit of blood, and has thrown up in five places indoors! However, he is fairly his usual self and wants to eat. I dont change his diet and he is not a dog that picks up food when we are out, he sticks right by my leg so I can monitor him well. I cant pin down anything that could keep causing him problems, His jabs are up to date. He will go to the vet if no improvement or he goes downhill, but usually unless he is really ill its antibiotics and a hefty bill. are dogs prone to this sort of thing once theyve suffered?

 

[Tinkerbee]

I had this problem with my old girl. I swapped her onto a blander/lower protein food and https://www.protexinvet.com/products/pro-kolin/28 this stuff was life changing! I think they do become more prone to it with age and having suffered with it before. I guess you could go down the route of stool samples/testing to see if it needs longer course/different antibiotics if the resiudal bug is never fully wiped out and flares up occasioanlly, depending on how frequent it has become.

 

[Bellasophia]

We went through IBD,sibo and gastro enteritis for twelve years ,with my last st. poodle.. 20 kg ...from one year she had recurrent gastric bleeds,diarrhea,poor appetite etc..she was auto immune insufficient( A N A test)..we stopped all vaccinations.
Stomach biopsy and further testing revealed helico bacter in crypts of stomach,proteus resistance and sibo..
For eleven years we went ahead with..
Flagyl..one 250 mg tablet daily..
Medrol. 8mg every two days..
Probiotic. Enterogermina every few days,
Ranitidine twice weekly, plus injectable version on hand if she had a flare..

She was never a really healthy dog but was such a fighter we kept up with her needs and she made it to 13 years.

With your dog I would stop the vaccs..give a regular probiotic ,,Zantac ( ranitidine ) for nausea,,use flagyl for diarrhea and consider medrol ,low dose long term..good luck,it's doable,but you have to be rigid with what you feed and the med protocol.

 

[Penny Less]

do you have to get a vets prescription for flagyl and medrol ? He has actually got over it again for now !

 

[Bellasophia]

Yes I would think you need a prescription for both meds.
Long term use of low dose antibiotics is only recommended when all else fails to treat chronic sibo etc.

 

[skinnydipper]

do you have to get a vets prescription for flagyl and medrol ? He has actually got over it again for now !


I hope I can help with some information.

Our dogs have a different diagnosis, mine diagnosed with lymphocytic plasmacytic IBD, so it may not be relevant to your dog.

Flagyl is a brand name for Metronidazole which you will need your vet to prescribe. It is an antibiotic and antiprotozoal medication which also changes the microbiome and has an immune modulating effect on the gut.

Medrol is a steroid which will need to be prescribed by your vet. Steroids lack the ability to heal the bowel but do down regulate inflammation.

Metronidazole can be given alone or in combination therapy with steroids (for IBD) and can be given long term. The doses of both are gradually reduced until at the lowest dose to maintain remission

My dog with IBD took Metronidazole along with Prednidale (steroid) to good effect.

Metronidazole is expensive but cost will be dependent on the size of the dog, for my lad it was £96 a month.

I can provide links to further information if you wish - please don't hesitate to ask.

I hope your dog continues to be well.

 

[Red-1]

Hekkie had pancreatitis, which had the same symptoms. The vet did say that he would be forever vulnerable to re-occurrences. He is on a very bland dry food.

Sad, as we would feed him anything to make him happy, and the only thing to keep him healthy is awfully bland, specialist dry biscuits (that are not even cheap)!

 

[Aru]

Most vets wont give out a longterm doses of antibiotics etc without a workup to figure out whats going wrong.

We are very strongly discouraged from handing out antibiotics like that and theres only a small set of conditions that warrant it.

This could be down a long list of issues.
Most gi but grumbling pancreatitis and several organ dysfunctions also cause the same signs.Many of them are lifelong conditions but most can be managed with medication.

Start with a diary to look for triggers.....food,stress change etc
Fecal test and culture in the hopes its the likes of giardia or campyolbactor esp if have hx of eating raw chicken.
Bloods and pancreatic enzymes test gen next.
Food trial around 12 weeks generally with id or z/d to see if its better on a gi food or if intolerances are involved...Can try homemade food as well but its a bit trickier to balance.
Again in the hopes that your lucky and its something simple.
Absorption tests and biopsies in the long term to test for ibd/ibs.
Then trialling drugs to see which ones are approriate and suit the individual dog.

Dogs have a similar body system to humans...takes a similar work up to pinpoint actual diagnosis.

Or what actually happens a lot of the time........
Owner declines all tests and gets annoyed when the dog continues to get on and off clinical signs for life and the vet cannot tell them why...and its a rotation of ocassionally random bad gi days with some very bad espisodes with some needing drip, drugs etc...and without testing we dont know why its happening we just treat symptoms and make then feel better until the next time.

Many do manage symptomically very well on the likes of Chappie tins which are complete and easily digestible

 

[skinnydipper]

My apologies, Aru.

I should have explained that my dog was extensively investigated before treatment was initiated and he had a specific diagnosis of lymphocytic plasmacytic IBD. I believe the Metronidazole and Prednidale saved his life. He was on very high dose steroids initially to suppress his immune system. Once his gut was stable he was gradually weaned off the Metronidazole completely and steroids slowly reduced. I have had very good support from his vet and on her advice he currently takes a very small dose of steroids (she describes it as a homeopathic dose) and it keeps him stable and in remission.

 

[Penny Less]

Red-nose. dog does have pancreatitis, so I thought this was the case on this occasion but it wasnt. I suppose his whole system is vulnerable to any upset. He is 14 so going to have to face the inevitable sooner rather than later.

 

[Bellasophia]

Re price of flagyl..in Italy we pay 3 euro for 20 tabs,250 mg dose.
Medrol.16 euro for 16mg..30 tablets.
Are uk prices so much higher or is the vet making a profit?

 

[skinnydipper]

Re price of flagyl..in Italy we pay 3 euro for 20 tabs,250 mg dose.
Medrol.16 euro for 16mg..30 tablets.
Are uk prices so much higher or is the vet making a profit?

My dog was taking Metronidazole 600 mg (1.5 400 mg tabs) twice a day. I bought it direct from the vet, initially I paid £96.78 for 30 days supply (90 tablets). The price must have increased over the time he was taking it as his last prescription for 30 400 mg tablets was £35.16.