Highland foals: What colours are they?

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Dry Rot

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Can any colour experts tell me what colours these Highland foals are and what colours they are likely to be?

The colt on the left was born at the end of June to grey dun parents. The mother of the filly on the right is a dappled grey, slowly greying out at the age of seven, and the father is a grey dun.

foals_zps81dac607.jpg
 
I would guess that in correct colour genetics terms, the one on the left is a bay dun, and the one on the right is black dun (grulla). The one on the left is likely to grey out, the one on the right already is. Highland pony terms aren't the same as correct colour genetics terms, so the one on the left is likely to be called a cream dun, the one on the right either a grey dun or a grey mouse dun, etc - in other words pick a word that describes the ponies appearance & tag the word dun on the end. In Highlands, a grey dun can refer to either a black dun, or a dun with grey gene. It isn't an exact science within the breed - one reason why I like using correct genetic terminology - at least you know exactly what you have genetically.
 
Photos as promised. Thanks for all your comments so far.

The first picture is of the darker filly about 20 minutes after birth. Her mother is dappled slate grey as you can see but is greying out fast at seven.

gracefoal_zps39ba2f51.jpg


This is her foal from last year, so a yearling colt. He was born black but looks as if he might go dappled slate grey like his mother. The previous foal was born black too.

scruff3_zpse5ab098e.jpg


This is the light coloured colt foal with his mother and, as has been suggested, I think a cream dun, so it is nice to have confirmation. Again, photographed within a couple of hours of birth. His mother was bought in and has always been grey here with a patch of dark hair at the base of her mane, a trait she sometimes passes on. I notice that she has very small brown or reddish spots scattered all over her coat, so "flea bitten"?

bell_zpse95ccc72.jpg


And this is dad, described on his passport as a "cream dun". He did have dapples when younger but not nearly as dark as the mare above.

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It would be nice to have a site showing all the various Highland pony colours as I don't think there is one and this does allow for confusion (especially with me!). I'm afraid I chicken out when doing passports and just put the foals' colours down as "dun" which seems to be acceptable. They could be a different colour in a few months anyway.
 
Well it's highly possible that they will both grey out and if they do then plain old 'grey' would be the correct term for both.

However I like the fact that my grey's passport has her base colour on - it says chestnut/grey. So you could say bay dun/grey and black dun/grey (if they both grey out).

one reason why I like using correct genetic terminology - at least you know exactly what you have genetically
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I completely agree with Varkie. :)

It's not very clear using 'grey dun' for both black dun/grulla and dun + grey, so hopefully that will fall out of use.
 
Thanks to everyone for that. I think I'll continue to describe foals as "dun" in passports until I get told it's not acceptable. So far, so good!
 
One on the right - grey dun - one on the left looks cream dun but MAY yellow dun - look round the eyes - if you find one white hair register it as cream dun - the will both end up moreorless which in old age.
 
What? Cream dun = bay dun + grey.

Oh how I long for the days when after the word 'colour' in the passport it has the DNA results for example e/e, G/g in my grey's case. So much better and no interpretation - just the truth.
 
It's all very confusing and the colour name has little correlation to the genetic base colour.

A grey dun is a pony who's a grey ish colour with dun characterisics and is going grey. Usually a black dun who's greying out, in genetic term but can be bay as cream genes are involved.

A yellow dun is a golden coloured dun who ISN'T going grey. But the color ranges from pale almost palomino colour to so dark you can hardly see the dorsal stripe. Usually bay dun but also chestnut dun

Fox or red dun is very desirable and rare. They'be got the paler mane with a 'yellow dun' type body. Usually but not always a genetic chestnut dun

A cream dun is a usually a yellow dun who's greyed out : any yellow tinged with dun characteristics are called cream.

A mouse dun is a true black dun dark mushroom coloured body and black mane and tail. They don't grey out.

Dry Rot, your pale foal is cream dun. It would have been yellow dun but looks like it's inherited a grey gene. The dark foal is grey dun. It's mouse (black) dun but will grey out. Although you may be lucky and it'll stay a mouse. If so, can I have her pretty pretty please? !
 
Wait KB - what's this about the cream gene? Highlands are true duns with the dun gene, not buckskins with the cream gene as the breed doesn't have cream - or so I thought.
 
Maybe they don't have cream but you do get all sorts of shades normally associated with having cream. But they don't come in palamino so prob don't? I suppose dun would give you everything from palomino colour to burnished copper colour.
 
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