hmmpf loading ideas needed please ..... pretty please

[dafthoss]

Well after what should have been the boys first pony club rally I should have been telling you all how fab he was and how in love with my darling pony I am.
BUT NO!!!! we allowed an hour extra to load just in case he was a tit and then some time to settle at the other end before masses of small ponies arrived. 4 (yes 4!!!!!!!) hours later we were still in a battle of wills about going in the trailer. I tried every thing I could think of we had bribery and a pressure halter the lot but he was just standing at the bottom and rearing if put under pressure, managed to stop the rearing with a quick flick on the stomach (I know not all will agree but he was becoming dangerous) we tried lungeing him so loading was the easiest option but he just will not budge. The most irritating thing is that he is not at all scared he is stubborn and then works him self up over it. On the ground normaly he is fab have done loads of ground work but it made no difference

So any suggestions or any one in east anglia that would be able to sort him out?? I am just completly out of ideas as he is becoming dangerous when pushed but when not pushed he just plants.

 

[zoelouisem]

Hi, we had one that was really bad to loads, tried for 4 hours she ended up rearing and falling over (that was with lunge lines round her) nothing worked. The somebody came up with the idea of water on her bum. So stodd her at the bottem of the ramp, with 2 people with water buckets, kept chucking them at her bum, she lept straight up within minutes. She now doesnt need the water and goes straight up trailer or lorry.

 

[skint1]

I also have a stubborn loader, I am willing to chuck a bucket of water at her , tried just about everything else! Good idea!

 

[dafthoss]

unfortunaltly we tried that as he was sweating, it had no effect he just ran sideways thanks for the suggestion tho

 

[zoelouisem]

It really worked, the mare we used for would rear with any pressure. So there was 2 of is behind her and we had quite alot and just kept doing it and she just stood there a few minutes and then just jumped up the ramp and stood there. She was not scared had travelled loads was just been stubborn. She now just strolls up. Would recommend putting somethng non slip scattered at the bottem of the ramp just in case the do mess around we scatterred rubber from the school just in case she skidded around.

 

[zoelouisem]

unfortunaltly we tried that as he was sweating, it had no effect he just ran sideways thanks for the suggestion tho

Oh thats a shame, we did have the lorry parked so one side was stables and the otherside a wall, the only way was forwards.

 

[dafthoss]

Ok may have a go with that later or tomorrow depending if we have recovered. That is him all over he is not at all scared of the trailer just stubborn and gets him self wound up over it as he has to do what someone else wants. He will travel perfectly and stands in the trailer with the front ramp open just looking out no problem. Will let you know if it works.

 

[eggs]

Practice as much as you can when you are not actually going anywhere as that wil take some of the pressure off you. I had a youngster who was not afraid but was quite happy to stand at the bottom of the ramp all day.

We took the approach that if he wasn't prepared to go forward we would make him back up as far as we wanted. He wasn't allowed to turn away from the ramp or go past it. So it was back up - and I mean he had to go back immediately and as far and fast as we wanted, walk forwards and as soon as he baiulked at going forwards then it was back again. He finally got the message that we had some control of his feet. We did this every day until he would walk up the ramp first time.

 

[spike123]

A very unconventional method but one that works with any horse who has respect for electric fencing is to tie a long length of it to each side of the trailer and use in the same manner as you would a lunge line. Just make sure you wear gloves but I have never known it to fail.

 

[cundlegreen]

Whereabouts are you in east anglia?

 

[jinglejoys]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UaG64_EJtzw&playnext=1&list=PL7273C12A9833286D

 

[dafthoss]

Eggs - we tried that but he get to the point where he is so far away and will not move forwards at all just walks further away.
Spike - anything behind him and he rears or pulls you off the ground and tries to leg it off in another direction
Cundlegreen - I'm in Cambridgeshire
Jinglejoys - stop rubbing it in

 

[blakesmum]

Having had loading issues with loan pony (4 hours loading was normal for him), his owner saw an ad for bad loaders on Horse magazine's twitter and we were selected to have a Monty Roberts RA visit us, she cracked that pony in a short space of time and now he is brilliant at it.
I'm not a NH person persay, (I'm the sort of person who believes no one method works for every horse) but was impressed with the RA and the dually halters, which when correctly used are amazing tools. The RA made me think about getting the pony to move one foot at a time (easier said than done, believe me) and said if you can't get him to move just one foot forward or back how do you expect to get him to move all four exactly how you want.
I'd recommend getting one of these guys out to anyone who has a bad loader and I wish we could have done it a lot sooner.

 

[Lolo]

We had a terrible loader with an even worse attitude! You couldn't tell her off or she'd tell you off even more... We attached two lunge lines to each side of the lorry and supplied the 2 willing volunteers with schooling whips. The person leading the horse had a bucket of pony nuts.

The holders of the lungelines crossed over behind her and as she walked forwards closed in more and more. When she was moving she got given pony nuts. As soon as she stopped the lunge line holders applied pressure and tapped her hind legs gently with the schooling whips. When she started moving they stopped and she was fed again... Essentially a very crude version of 'carrot and stick' which didn't give her room to spin round or leap from side to side!!

 

[MissSBird]

We have a very stubborn loader, who is a bit free with her hind legs so using whips on the back legs wasn't a good idea. Lunge lines worked to some extent, but she'd just pull backwards and nearly flatten the people/get the ropes round her legs.

Recently I acquired a richard maxwell rope halter for my other youngster, and we decided to try it. It worked brilliantly.

We just kept everything very low key. Only one person involved, everyone else well out the way. Just keep the pressure on and release the instant they step forward. At first the pony reared and fought back, and we just kept going very quietly and calmly. After a few minutes she just gave in and walked on.

Might be worth trying the pressure halter again when you've lots of time and just be eternally patient!

 

[Jane_Lou]

Two ideas - The first I have personally used a number of time, open the trailer up front and back and find another horse that you know will load quietly and not get silly. Walk said horse through the trailer, stop on the trailer and walk off, do this 2-3 time again, not stopping, then "tailgate" the problem horse through behind the horse, do this 2-3 times, making the gap between the 1st and 2nd horse wider each time. Try stopping briefly with each horse for another 2-3 times. Once the 2nd horse is happily walking through the trailer and stopping for a minute, close the breat bar behind the 1st horse as soon as it comes through the front and the 2nd horse should then go on but is obviously stopped from going forawrd. I have used this on various difficult loaders and as long as you keep it very quiet and calm it has always worked.

Failing that....... A friend used a local guy for a loading issue and he sorted it on the first visit, I will text her for the number.

 

[MagicMelon]

Put the trailer in the yard or in a small fences off bit of field and take the partition out and take all the ramps down, then every SINGLE day put his feed in the trailer. He'll wonder around and eventually get the idea and load himself. Once he's doing it happily on his own (with no human interaction), put a headcollar on him and give him a really long rein and he should after a while go in on his own as usual. I've done this with success, although they usually have a slight hick up half way through. Basically its just practice, practice, practice literally every single day. I've seen people who only ever try and load a difficult horse to go somewhere which never works as you'll be stressed out due to the time limit etc.

IMO dont use lunge lines - I have never seen this successfully done, it just aggitates the horse more. You dont want the horse to feel forced in, you want him to be bribed in with food! The key is to make it as pleasant as possible and you'll find he'll be a long-term good loader.

 

[irish_only]

If pony is sensible and won't throw himself on the floor, get a long rope or lunge line and wrap it round the breast bar and hold it. Every time he relaxes a bit, take up the slack. He will probably have a paddy (hence need to know he won't throw himself on the floor). Just keep doing this until he gets to the point of no return.

We had a horse in to teach to load into a lorry who wasn't scared. We tried him when he arrived and it was a no go. So he was put in a stable overnight with no food. Next morning, armed with a bucket of feed, we trotted round to the lorry and UP the ramp without hesitation. So, we knew he wasn't scared, just piggy. We then took the bucket away, someone on the ramp with lunge rein attached, and gently flicked his heels with a lunge whip. After a while, he got really cross and double barrelled, so we ignored this and continued irritating him with the lunge whip. 20-30 seconds later he walked up the ramp. He was then walked on and off the lorry several times, and has never been a problem since. Sometimes we can be too nice with all the tempting, pushing, ropes and gadgets.

 

[templewood]

Put the trailer in the yard or in a small fences off bit of field and take the partition out and take all the ramps down, then every SINGLE day put his feed in the trailer. He'll wonder around and eventually get the idea and load himself. Once he's doing it happily on his own (with no human interaction), put a headcollar on him and give him a really long rein and he should after a while go in on his own as usual. I've done this with success, although they usually have a slight hick up half way through. Basically its just practice, practice, practice literally every single day. I've seen people who only ever try and load a difficult horse to go somewhere which never works as you'll be stressed out due to the time limit etc.

.

This method always works for me! Have even used it on a mare and foal in the open field.

 

[dafthoss]

ok thanks for all the suggestions had a bit of a sos call to my instructor who has been down and helped us so we are now in a much better place. He has been through the trailer several times then we went to my instructors yard and had a practice away from home. We are going to practice as much as we can before I go back to college as YO has said we can borrow her trailer to practice with so we will be going in it before he gets his dinner every night. I just need to go and get a chifney as that is what we practiced in and its the only thing he respects, well sort of he did drag my instructor across the yard a few times, bad pony!

blakesmum - had a look at that website but no one covers where I am
lolo - we tried that but he started running through them pulling people over
misssbird - he was in a rope halter made no difference unfortunatly
jane lou - we tried that too he was adament he was not going in thankfully a few words with my instructor later and he walked through several times
magic melon - he is unfortunatly not that motivated by food he would walk to the bottom of the ramp for the food but not go any further
irish only - we did have a lunge rope round the breast bar but it made not a lot of difference he just pulled me and dad over with it, I was treading on it as I couldnt hold him and I now have a lunge rope shaped friction burn in my shoes

Any way thanks for the support guys its nice to know others have horses that are not perfect loaders its just a struggle to load him more often as we dont have out own trailer but I am saving all my pennies so hopefully we will have soon

 

[lily1]

I sympathise with you I've got a mare who takes a minimum of 3 hours to load & she was the "bad loader" at Monty Roberts demo and still she point blank refuses to load. She went away to be backed and wouldn't load to come home we have tried everything and she isn't a horse that gives in the more we push the more she fights back. I used to show her but she was so unpredictable I never would know if we would get to a show or home again. At a county show last year we were ready to go home and we loaded one pony & then went to load the dreaded and with people sitting besides their lorries we had a captive audience she got to the ramp and walked up first time as good as gold! I was left totally speechless!

 

[AndySpooner]

Well, training is the key to loading. It's not about force, it's not about the trailer. It's about you and your horses confidence in your leadership.

All the tricks may work once or twice, but they are not a proper solution.

 

[flutterby321]

I know someone who's horse is a problem loader, and they just spray fly spray or coat spray behind it, the horse hates the sound and runs straight on!

 

[LadyRascasse]

Well, training is the key to loading. It's not about force, it's not about the trailer. It's about you and your horses confidence in your leadership.

All the tricks may work once or twice, but they are not a proper solution.

this^ i have just started to retrain my new horse who has had a very nasty experience. day one it took me 10 mins to get 2 feet on ramp and stop. i praised him gave him some treats and put him away, i shall continue this until we can get him to walk through calmly and then we will get him to stop have everything shut up the unload him again, i expect this to take a good 2/3 weeks probably longer but i am in no hurry as i want this to be a permanent fix

 

[Ali27]

Our chesnut mare was awful to load during the winter and someone suggested the Richard Maxwell training halter. I watched the DVD several times and then did several sessions in the school using his techniques before trying to load her. It then took ten minutes the first time to load her and now she will resist once and rear and then gives up and quietly walks on. I would definitely say try the pressure halter again but do some groundwork sessions with it first so he understands and respects it. Richard Maxeell's DVD is definitely worth getting!
My daughter even managed to load her for the first time yesterday! good luck and I'm sure you will sort him out!

 

[Lanky Loll]

OK slightly different method to those suggested but one that I've seen work particularly well with small ponies...
You need 3 adults, head collar and rope and quiet
Park so pony can't go round the trailer, sometimes it helps to have the front doors open so they can see through (but breast bar in place so he can't go out).
Then one person lead - and stay as much as possible to the side - there is NO point in pulling.
Other two adults stand tight to the pony either side of the quarters facing forwards, link hands under the rump and apply forward pressure. IF necessary I've seen it done with the hind legs being lifted off the ground slightly so the pony steps forward - longest I've seen this take is 30 mins, minimal stress to pony and those around.

 

[soloequestrian]

I sent you a PM, hope it is of use.

 

[LouS]

I never load a horse with someone behind it, trying to chase/frighten or physically force a horse in like that is not the right way to go about in my opinion. So many things can go wrong and you can end up with a horse that is even worse to load.

You say your groundwork is good, but its obviously not, or he'd be loading. I'd get a RM halter or similar, learn how to use it, and take him away from the trailer and work him on the ground.

I do this with every horse I have and not once have I had a bad loader, even if they've come to me as "bad loaders", I don't think that's coincidence.

I don't know why people keep trying to beat/force/scare/bribe horses into trailers when its clearly not working. And for goodness sake practice! Why do people wait until the day they want the horse to go somewhere then ask him this question, when they know its a bad loader.

 

[cundlegreen]

If you can get hold of Mark Rashid's books, theres excellent advice there. Basically, the pony must move where you want it to. If you get one step forward, take right away to think about it and then try for another step. A "no no" is letting the pony go out the side. Once you keep them straight and have patience, they will offer to go in. It must be their choice, you don't get a permanent solution by forcing them in. I used to be asked a lot to sort problem loaders. Most of the time, the owners had no patience and kept saying "it won't go!". Once you've started to ask it to load, you must stay there until it does, however long it takes. Horses know if you mean it, and getting upset and shouting solves nothing. "NO!" is a good word though!!

 

[MagicMelon]

magic melon - he is unfortunatly not that motivated by food he would walk to the bottom of the ramp for the food but not go any further

He will get interested in it though, if you put his dinner in it every single night. It'll just become part of his routine. If you make the fenced area round it small enough (with very little grass or ideally in the yard so its concrete) then he'll be so bored he will take an interest in the bucket in the trailer.