Horse difficult for rugging and saddling

[happyhorse978]

Hi all, bit of a random topic here but wondering if anyone else has experienced the same and got any ideas for me!
Bit of background :- I've got a 16.3hh, 7 year old TB, I bought him straight out of racing when he was 5 years old (retired sound). He was always a bit grumpy with rugs and saddling, but nothing major, he would just pull a face. Anyway... he eventually became very aggressive with rugging and saddling so I suspected ulcers so had him scoped and treated and then he was re-scoped and completely clear from ulcers.

I am OCD in my management with him and always have been- he is on a full fibre diet, ad-lib forage, as much turnout as possible (out every day during winter, stabled at night & 24/7 turnout in summer). He is on gut supplements etc and I reduce his stress as much as possible. He is wonderful when ridden.

He improved massively a while after his successful ulcer treatment and I almost got to the stage of rugging him like a normal horse without any grumpiness. However, the past few days he has gone really aggressive again with rugs etc (ears pinned, lunging at me teeth baring, turning backend on me). I will not tell him off until I have ruled out pain/discomfort, and I also cannot actually tell him off because he comes back for another fight... I think he has been handled pretty rough in the past before he came to me and he is really defensive I don't believe horses do this for no particular reason, so I am currently suspecting a flare up of his ulcers (spring grass?!). I have arranged for my vet to come out next week to re-scope him for ulcers and also x-ray his back (just in case there is any underlying pain there).

Weirdly it is just the chest straps he seems funny with - he doesn't seem to mind the belly straps! Has anyone experienced this and how did you get round it ? I think there is a big element of pain memory there too - I just can't seem to get him to 'get over it'.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated! He is my world so I will do anything to make him happy again!

 

[Wizpop]

I would suspect that the ulcers have returned for some reason and would have a chat with your vet. Some will let you have Peptizole ( or whatever worked for him last time) without re scoping. If he improves then you have your answer- if not then further investigations probably needed. Ulcers are a response to something eg pain, stress as I’m sure you know.
Do hope you can get to the bottom of whatever is bothering him.

 

[soloequestrian]

Does he need to wear the rug? Could it be making him hot and itchy? I have one who will rip his rug off instantly if he thinks he doesn't need it. It took us a while to come to an understanding - now I am allowed to put it on if he is already cold and wet or if it is clearly nasty weather - he's worn it about four times all winter and he's out all night. WBxTB though not clipped.

 

[Hallo2012]

grass growing could have caused ulcers to flare again?

 

[Bellaboo18]

I imagine the ulcers have returned as you've not found the primary cause of them i.e pain somewhere.

 

[bouncing_ball]

grass growing could have caused ulcers to flare again?

This spring grass flushing, I’d trial a fortnight of Equishure

 

[ycbm]

I think the ulcers may have flared again and that needs investigating, and also possibly that there is a reason for them that has not yet been found. But you could also look, once you know they have been treated of he has them, at aloe vera juice as a (clinically proven) help in preventing them returning. I have a horse in a stressful situation on it at the moment as a preventative.
.

 

[sbloom]

Has a bodyworker seen him?

 

[happyhorse978]

I would suspect that the ulcers have returned for some reason and would have a chat with your vet. Some will let you have Peptizole ( or whatever worked for him last time) without re scoping. If he improves then you have your answer- if not then further investigations probably needed. Ulcers are a response to something eg pain, stress as I’m sure you know.
Do hope you can get to the bottom of whatever is bothering him.

thankyou, hopefully the vet will get to the bottom of it when they come out x

 

[happyhorse978]

Has a bodyworker seen him?

yeah only last week! He has physio every 12 weeks x

 

[happyhorse978]

I think the ulcers may have flared again and that needs investigating, and also possibly that there is a reason for them that has not yet been found. But you could also look, once you know they have been treated of he has them, at aloe vera juice as a (clinically proven) help in preventing them returning. I have a horse in a stressful situation on it at the moment as a preventative.
.

That’s what I’m thinking , it would make sense with the spring grass too but we will see if the vet finds anything on the back x-Ray / scope. Thankyou will deffo look at aloe Vera x

 

[happyhorse978]

I imagine the ulcers have returned as you've not found the primary cause of them i.e pain somewhere.

that's why I think it’s a good idea for me to have his back x-rayed just incase there’s some pain there perhaps , which would also explain resenting of the saddle etc

 

[happyhorse978]

grass growing could have caused ulcers to flare again?

That’s what I’m thinking x

 

[happyhorse978]

Does he need to wear the rug? Could it be making him hot and itchy? I have one who will rip his rug off instantly if he thinks he doesn't need it. It took us a while to come to an understanding - now I am allowed to put it on if he is already cold and wet or if it is clearly nasty weather - he's worn it about four times all winter and he's out all night. WBxTB though not clipped.

it’s only a mesh fly rug which fits him really well, he just runs around the field away from the flies if he doesn’t have it on x

 

[Piksija]

I think this is mental trauma for him, and probobly will stay forever. Meny years ago i had mare, who bites and actualy was angry and afraid from peoples, because of her first owner who was realy cruel with her. As you told, by the time he gets better and act like normal, but we had this backfalls time after time all her life.

 

[happyhorse978]

I think this is mental trauma for him, and probobly will stay forever. Meny years ago i had mare, who bites and actualy was angry and afraid from peoples, because of her first owner who was realy cruel with her. As you told, by the time he gets better and act like normal, but we had this backfalls time after time all her life.

Thankyou x

 

[stangs]

If his change in behaviour is as drastic as it sounds from this post, I would think it’s a definite sign of new/increased pain rather than remembered pain. Flare up of ulcers due to an unknown issue would be the most likely cause imo.

Before you treated for ulcers, was it also the case that he didn’t have problems with the belly straps, just the chest straps? If not, then I’d be wondering whether the rug’s been slipping back and causing discomfort that way.

If it does turn out to be remembered pain, then R+ can be a good way to rewrite bad memories of being rugged with positive associations.

 

[BBP]

When my horse had ulcers he would flinch when you touched his chest/chest straps but have no reaction to having belly straps or girth done up, so they can present in unusual ways.

 

[Cowpony]

Yes my loan pony has been scoped and has an ulcer. She's having sucralfate and is on aloe vera juice. She's so much nicer now! She hated having her rug put on, particularly if I moved it around once it was on, and the main sensitivity was her chest. She still pulls a face when I do up the chest straps, but doesn't try to kill me any more!

 

[happyhorse978]

If his change in behaviour is as drastic as it sounds from this post, I would think it’s a definite sign of new/increased pain rather than remembered pain. Flare up of ulcers due to an unknown issue would be the most likely cause imo.

Before you treated for ulcers, was it also the case that he didn’t have problems with the belly straps, just the chest straps? If not, then I’d be wondering whether the rug’s been slipping back and causing discomfort that way.

If it does turn out to be remembered pain, then R+ can be a good way to rewrite bad memories of being rugged with positive associations.

yes the change in behaviour is as drastic as it sounds, literally just in the past few days. He’s having the exact same symptoms as before he was treated for ulcers (he’s never been bothered about belly straps, literally just the chest straps!). I don’t think it’s anything to do with the rug itself because all his rugs fit him perfectly, I make sure of that, which had made me think it’s a flare up of ulcers for some reason

 

[happyhorse978]

When my horse had ulcers he would flinch when you touched his chest/chest straps but have no reaction to having belly straps or girth done up, so they can present in unusual ways.

Thankyou - did his symptoms disappear once the ulcers had gone?

 

[happyhorse978]

If his change in behaviour is as drastic as it sounds from this post, I would think it’s a definite sign of new/increased pain rather than remembered pain. Flare up of ulcers due to an unknown issue would be the most likely cause imo.

Before you treated for ulcers, was it also the case that he didn’t have problems with the belly straps, just the chest straps? If not, then I’d be wondering whether the rug’s been slipping back and causing discomfort that way.

If it does turn out to be remembered pain, then R+ can be a good way to rewrite bad memories of being rugged with positive associations.

yes the change in behaviour is as drastic as it sounds, literally just in the past few days. He’s having the exact same symptom

Yes my loan pony has been scoped and has an ulcer. She's having sucralfate and is on aloe vera juice. She's so much nicer now! She hated having her rug put on, particularly if I moved it around once it was on, and the main sensitivity was her chest. She still pulls a face when I do up the chest straps, but doesn't try to kill me any more!

thanks so much it’s really interesting that it seems to be the chest area they don’t like x

 

[Sossigpoker]

Ulcers are usually secondary to pain somewhere in the body (KS and hind limb lameness seem to be common ) so I suspect that the actual reason for the ulcers hasn't been resolved.
Given that he's an x-racer I'd be highly suspicious of kissing spine.
I wouldn't certainly have the vet back ,.look into x-raying the back and doing a lameness work up.

 

[happyhorse978]

Ulcers are usually secondary to pain somewhere in the body (KS and hind limb lameness seem to be common ) so I suspect that the actual reason for the ulcers hasn't been resolved.
Given that he's an x-racer I'd be highly suspicious of kissing spine.
I wouldn't certainly have the vet back ,.look into x-raying the back and doing a lameness work up.

Thankyou as above in my post the vet is coming out to rescope him and x Ray his back to check

 

[Sossigpoker]

Thankyou as above in my post the vet is coming out to rescope him and x Ray his back to check

That's excellent news ,.sorry I must have missed your reply earlier.

 

[happyhorse978]

That's excellent news ,.sorry I must have missed your reply earlier.

no problems x I’m hoping it’s just a flare up from the grass etc but best to be safe than sorry x

 

[Green Bean]

I would go with kissing spine purely as my horse is difficult with rugging and saddling when her ks is playing up. She is clear of ulcers which were checked when this first started so I know this isn't a factor. X-rays and injecting need to occur every two years so you may want to ask the question of your vet

 

[Cowpony]

Just been up to feed mine and remembered that the other product that seems to help is Coligone. The vet recommended it. I just put a capful in each feed, but they can have up to 50ml. Mine will eat it happily but you can also syringe it.

 

[Birker2020]

Hi all, bit of a random topic here but wondering if anyone else has experienced the same and got any ideas for me!
Bit of background :- I've got a 16.3hh, 7 year old TB, I bought him straight out of racing when he was 5 years old (retired sound). He was always a bit grumpy with rugs and saddling, but nothing major, he would just pull a face. Anyway... he eventually became very aggressive with rugging and saddling so I suspected ulcers so had him scoped and treated and then he was re-scoped and completely clear from ulcers.

I am OCD in my management with him and always have been- he is on a full fibre diet, ad-lib forage, as much turnout as possible (out every day during winter, stabled at night & 24/7 turnout in summer). He is on gut supplements etc and I reduce his stress as much as possible. He is wonderful when ridden.

He improved massively a while after his successful ulcer treatment and I almost got to the stage of rugging him like a normal horse without any grumpiness. However, the past few days he has gone really aggressive again with rugs etc (ears pinned, lunging at me teeth baring, turning backend on me). I will not tell him off until I have ruled out pain/discomfort, and I also cannot actually tell him off because he comes back for another fight... I think he has been handled pretty rough in the past before he came to me and he is really defensive I don't believe horses do this for no particular reason, so I am currently suspecting a flare up of his ulcers (spring grass?!). I have arranged for my vet to come out next week to re-scope him for ulcers and also x-ray his back (just in case there is any underlying pain there).

Weirdly it is just the chest straps he seems funny with - he doesn't seem to mind the belly straps! Has anyone experienced this and how did you get round it ? I think there is a big element of pain memory there too - I just can't seem to get him to 'get over it'.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated! He is my world so I will do anything to make him happy again!

Yep mine can be funny when the breast strap is done up and sometimes walks backwards. I think he's been roughly handled somewhere in his past. He can also do this if he objects to having a rug on when I leave and its 15c even though its dropping to 5c at 2am!

 

[happyhorse978]

Thank

Just been up to feed mine and remembered that the other product that seems to help is Coligone. The vet recommended it. I just put a capful in each feed, but they can have up to 50ml. Mine will eat it happily but you can also syringe it.

Thank you, funnily enough I have just taken him off Coligone, I cant say I noticed a difference really