horse falls backwards when falling asleep or tied up

[Marion]

My 23 yr old cob has at time to time for the last few years staggered a bit when falling asleep whilst tied up in the sun. He is now falling back when he falls asleep in the field or when tied up being groomed, shod or clipped. Looking on the internet it suggests this is due to sleep deprivation when a horse is not lying down to sleep due to pain or not feeling safe. Otherwise he is good for 23, hacking out regularly and eating well, rolls in field etc. He lives alone as he cannot cope with busy yards and this was the only place we could find when the last quiet livery closed earlier this year. I would get him a companion but it is expensive where he is and I would struggle to afford 2 horses. Has anyone experience of this and how did you manage it?

 

[Cobbytype]

Not personally, but the warmblood mare in the field next to mine has a similar 'disorder'. She spent a few years on her own and is now afraid to lie down in case her mates clear off whilst she's snoozing. She rocks on her front legs, they splay out in front, she sometimes falls over and on occasions has injured herself crashing through fencing. The mare's owner is the owner of the land and has taken on single liveries over the years, but they don't last and the mare inevitably ends up alone. She's better/calmer now because the latest livery has 3 horses, but I haven't seen her lying down for years and she freaks out if anyone tries to put her in one of the stables for a rest.

Sorry I can't offer anything constructive other than some horses really don't cope well being alone and in the warmblood's case it terrified her and has had a long lasting effect on her psychological well being.

I think your cob is one of those that desperately needs a buddy - perhaps you could advertise for a companion with a paid contribution for its upkeep. Some horses get along well with a goat/sheep as companions.

 

[Flora]

Ask your vet about narcolepsy! Sounds very like it

 

[Shay]

Horses alone often don't lie down to sleep. They are just not designed to live alone I'm afraid. Flora is right about checking our narcolepsy - if this is the early stages he could become dangerous to ride. And equally there might be something that could be done to help. But otherwise can you at least get others in view for him, if you can't manage a companion animal for him?

 

[Goldenstar]

Ask your vet about narcolepsy! Sounds very like it

It does .
you need advice from the vet .
Sadly it is a sign that something wrong and you need to get specialist advice .
Do you ever see the horse lying down if not did you in the past .
If he's stopped because of pain a good regime of pain relief could solve the problem but going into winter it's the time to have a good talk with your vet .

 

[Amye]

Second the getting a vet to check him out. But it does sound like it might be caused by him being alone. When a horse is in a herd, whilst some lie down to sleep, one horse will stay awake/on their feet looking for danger. If he has no other horses for company or can't see any other horses, he may not be lying down to sleep as there's no one to keep him 'safe'. Is he stabled at all? He may rest better in a stable for a couple of hours.

If you really can't afford a buddy - is there anyway you can work it so he can see other horses from his field?

 

[Pinkvboots]

It sounds like his just not sleeping properly because he is kept alone so his over tired hence the falling over, I think you need to keep him with other horses they don't like being kept alone they are by nature a herd animal. I would also getting a vet out as it could be something more serious and best to get to the bottom of it as he could fall on you.

 

[AShetlandBitMeOnce]

Not personally, but the warmblood mare in the field next to mine has a similar 'disorder'. She spent a few years on her own and is now afraid to lie down in case her mates clear off whilst she's snoozing. She rocks on her front legs, they splay out in front, she sometimes falls over and on occasions has injured herself crashing through fencing. The mare's owner is the owner of the land and has taken on single liveries over the years, but they don't last and the mare inevitably ends up alone. She's better/calmer now because the latest livery has 3 horses, but I haven't seen her lying down for years and she freaks out if anyone tries to put her in one of the stables for a rest.

Wow, this is so desperately sad. Poor thing

 

[Cobbytype]

Wow, this is so desperately sad. Poor thing

Tis sad yes. She's a very insecure horse anyway - perhaps due to being an orphan. My horse spent a couple of years in full livery when I worked away, so at that time she was completely alone for 8 months of the year with no horses nearby as our other field neighbour didn't turn her horses out from Autumn to late Spring and even in Summer they only went out for a few hours.

I cried when I hacked my horse back home because she was screaming hysterically when she saw him walking down the lane... then she bit him for leaving her alone so long.

 

[Damnation]

Following with intrest.

There is a cob at my yard who will fall asleep and almost fall over when tied up, she has loads of friends in a herd set up, doesn't get bullied, but was told by the previous owners she never lies down. She had company there too.

I didn't think it was right, so this thread is very interesting indeed.

 

[Wagtail]

I agree with those saying it is most likely living alone which has caused this condition. Just because he doesn't like busy yards does not mean he needs to be kept alone. There are plenty of yards where there are only a handful of horses and it's very quiet. My yard for instance only has five horses and it is really quiet without much coming and going. The horses are in a set routine with their friends and new horses settle extremely quickly. A new horse arrived with the same symptoms as yours less than a week ago. He'd been on individual turnout and wouldn't lie down. Now he lies down no problem (he's in his twenties too). He has a field companion here and talk bars between the stables.

Cobbytype - I feel heartbroken reading about that poor mare, and any others that are kept alone for that matter.

 

[Cobbytype]

I agree with those saying it is most likely living alone which has caused this condition. Just because he doesn't like busy yards does not mean he needs to be kept alone. There are plenty of yards where there are only a handful of horses and it's very quiet. My yard for instance only has five horses and it is really quiet without much coming and going. The horses are in a set routine with their friends and new horses settle extremely quickly. A new horse arrived with the same symptoms as yours less than a week ago. He'd been on individual turnout and wouldn't lie down. Now he lies down no problem (he's in his twenties too). He has a field companion here and talk bars between the stables.

Cobbytype - I feel heartbroken reading about that poor mare, and any others that are kept alone for that matter.

Well the mare's life is better now to a degree. She's 'adopted' a little rescue gypsy foal who belongs to the livery and has spent the summer being step-mum to him. She's now in a field on her own because their dietary requirements are very different, but has company in adjoining fields and she likes my donks too and can stand at the fence and see directly into their field shelter which is only a few metres away from the dividing fence.

 

[scats]

Sounds like narcolepsy, or a symptom of lack of REM sleep (which a horse can only do lying down)- which often mimics narcolepsy.

 

[Goldenstar]

I had a very interesting conversation with my vet about sleep disorders cause by lack of REM sleep , they very very rarely used to see these conditions but see them often now caused by in the vets opinion DIY yards that lack roultine and have very fluid populations of horses and no bedding or minimal bedding systems ,in the horse that brought up the subject the problem was solved by providing a proper bed the horse then lay down and the symptoms stopped .

 

[Pinkvboots]

I had a very interesting conversation with my vet about sleep disorders cause by lack of REM sleep , they very very rarely used to see these conditions but see them often now caused by in the vets opinion DIY yards that lack roultine and have very fluid populations of horses and no bedding or minimal bedding systems ,in the horse that brought up the subject the problem was solved by providing a proper bed the horse then lay down and the symptoms stopped .

it's funny you should say that about bedding I worked at a yard for a very short time some years back and all the horses were on matting with a very narrow strip of shavings at the back, and 2 horses there used to fall asleep when tied up and I did wonder then if it was down to the fact they didn't want to lie down, I know my horses would not lie on matting alone and I personally wouldn't keep horses on minimal bedding I think a lot of horses just don't want to lie on just mats.

 

[Cobbytype]

I had a very interesting conversation with my vet about sleep disorders cause by lack of REM sleep , they very very rarely used to see these conditions but see them often now caused by in the vets opinion DIY yards that lack roultine and have very fluid populations of horses and no bedding or minimal bedding systems ,in the horse that brought up the subject the problem was solved by providing a proper bed the horse then lay down and the symptoms stopped .

I think you are right Goldenstar. The mare next to me is happiest when things are settled and she's the sort who would benefit from a routine. She's better with geldings around - they seem to have a soothing effect on her. I can't remember her having the problem when she first arrived as a 3 year old (many years ago) and was kept with 3 other horses belonging to the land owner. She used to stable okay but won't go in a stable now without going berserk once the door closes behind her. She's always been quirky and was retired whilst in her prime because she was so unpredictable when ridden. Since then the land owner has lost interest in horses. The single liveries never lasted long because she'd go crazy when they wanted to take their horses out for a ride and they all left after a short time.

 

[Marion]

Thank you for your replies, I will contact the vet but wanted to discuss it first. Being on your own at the field there is no one there to ask. He has done this falling asleep tied up for some time and we just thought it was due to the sun and being too relaxed. He has been on small livery until earlier this year so it is not just down to being on his own. Will have a good look at finances and see if I can take on another horse to be with him. Not able to share field as owners are rather particular and we are only there on condition we have no one else there. Even have to take him home for the farrier.

 

[fburton]

Horses alone often don't lie down to sleep. They are just not designed to live alone I'm afraid.

I would agree that it sometimes happens. On the other hand, I've seen horses lying down to sleep in stables alone (not even with neighbours present) many times.

When a horse is in a herd, whilst some lie down to sleep, one horse will stay awake/on their feet looking for danger.

Very often, yes, but not always. On several occasions I have witnessed a group of horses all lying down sleeping or dozing, i.e. no horse "standing guard". I guess they must have felt safe enough to do that.

If he has no other horses for company or can't see any other horses, he may not be lying down to sleep as there's no one to keep him 'safe'.

Quite possibly.

... REM sleep (which a horse can only do lying down)

Never say never when it comes to horses - there are always exceptions! What you say is true in general but it is possible for horses to have REM sleep standing up. I knew a horse that would usually REM when in sternal recumbency with his chin resting on the ground, but I have also seen him REMing while standing up. However, he would always rest his chin on something (occasionally that was my shoulder or the top of my head). Amazingly, despite doing the usual limb twitching associated with REM sleep, I never saw him fall over.

 

[Marion]

Quick update, had vet to my cob. He has said it's narcolepsy possibly caused by not lying down due to pain in his hip. He is now on 'bute ' and we have seen shavings under his belly and on the side of his face so it looks like he is now lying down at times. Vet also said to keep riding as he was unlikely to fall over whilst riden. Not been out though, as he has been lame due to charging around the field as fireworks were being let off locally. Have been looking on rescue sites for companion and trying to work out how to afford two.

 

[Cobbytype]

Quick update, had vet to my cob. He has said it's narcolepsy possibly caused by not lying down due to pain in his hip. He is now on 'bute ' and we have seen shavings under his belly and on the side of his face so it looks like he is now lying down at times. Vet also said to keep riding as he was unlikely to fall over whilst riden. Not been out though, as he has been lame due to charging around the field as fireworks were being let off locally. Have been looking on rescue sites for companion and trying to work out how to afford two.

Glad to hear your cob seems to be getting some rest and I hope the lameness improves soon. Bloody fireworks have a lot to answer for.

Hope Pastures near Leeds seem to have a number of rescues at any one time, or you could try horses4homes for a long term loan.