Horses For Courses And Mares For Stallions!!

[Eothain]

Rightio, it's been a while since we picked apart some stallions and discussed what mares would in theory suit them best!
So, looking for thoughts and opinions on the following horses:

L'esprit (Lupicor X Landgraf X Calvados)

Ustinov (Libero H X Nimmerdor X Marco Polo)

Carmena Z (Carthago Z X Irco Mena X King Of Diamonds)

Tornesch (Lux Z X Libero H X Caletto)

Livello (Limbus X Ahorn Z X Raimond)

VDL Harley (Heartbreaker X Carthago X Caletto)

Quality Time (Quantum X Cantus X Mowgli)

Ringfort Cruise (Cruising X Nimmerdor X Majoor)

Peter Pan (Pilot X Domino X Gepard)

Mermus R (Burgraff X Ramiro Z X Joost)

Discuss!!

 

[Simsar]

King Of Diamonds & Cruising were the only bits I understood from the above!! so the discussion won't get very far, the others all sounded like foreign talk to me

 

[gadetra]

I'm thinking where do you start! And also which one for Supermare...

 

[Eothain]

Supermare? Who's Supermare?

I was thinking of something along the lines of ....

" *Insert stallion here* tends to bring progeny that are a little vertical in the neck and long lined with strong backs that are usually quite uphill in their canter and generally have a good length of leg and are quite refined so he suits a mare that's perhaps a bit heavier and doesn't maybe have the strongest back and a slightly more horizontal neck so that the resulting offspring 'should' be able to jump more through their shoulders and have a good shape while losing no power in their canter because of the strength in their backs"

 

[gadetra]

This is Supermare:

This could be a very interesting thread. Like the famous stallion's quirks thread.

 

[Eothain]

It could be interesting if we could get it to take off!!

Supermare is a lovely model. Pedigree?

 

[Yorketown]

Would be very interested on any coments on Peter Pan as he was on my long list last year but couldn't get much feed back from people so he didn't make it to the short list. Can we also add Iroko (Pilot / Bengale / Remus) to the list!

 

[RealityCheck]

VDL Harley: Everyone I've heard of here in the USA attempting to AI has had no success, despite it looking okay under the scope, so I've never managed to meet his progeny in real life, but I'll toss my opinion in anyway
Obviously Harley has a great sire-line, but from what I've heard he can throw big, coarse stock, and they don't tend to have very pretty heads in my opinion. He has Heartbreaker's back, which I love, and a powerful rear end to hopefully pass on that jump.
For my needs (hunter jumper market) I'd probably want to create a more refined head and neck, I have 2 TBs that he may suit, but Id be worried about it ending up cut and shunt. So instead, IMO a stockier mare (not cobby, just a more heavy set warmblood) with dressage blood would make a nice low level eventer - I have 2 oldenburgs that would be suitable for this.

Iroko (Pilot / Bengale / Remus): Iroko tends to pass on a bold and outgoing temperament, and several I've seen could do pure dressage, as he seems to give a powerful hind with plenty of suspension. They tend to be fairly refined - which is something I like - and if I recall, on the small side. Looking at the rankings, he's slipping down as a jumping stallion, which says to me that perhaps his progeny are more suited as allrounders (a reflection of temperament perhaps, meaning more end up in amatuer homes - all I've met have the talent). Personally, I don't see anything I'd want to 'breed out', but I've also seen him put to Animo mares, which although a bit hotter are very nice youngsters.

Mermus R: Although not from lines I personally use or would seek to use, I can't deny how great this guys lines are; very strong on the dam, and amazing performance in the sire. The progeny I've seen have all been athletic with good temperaments, though they can be late maturing, which is why I assume he's less popular round here compared to TB/TBx for sport. I may be inclined to use this guy on a mare lacking in hind power/action, as he seems to pass it on very well. To be critical, he isn't a hunter mover, so for me I'd use a mare with a wider shoulder, any mare would need a great croup to balance out what can turn out overly straight, and be very correct in the legs as I've seen a few that toe in.

Livello: I'd use to improve scope, jump, and front end. As a hunter breeder, he has a hunter trot, and his progeny seem to be inheriting it, so it could improve something like a TB mare. While he may not improve top line, he can throw a pretty head and neck with good placement. Livello is a very soft mouthed, easy ride (well, easy compared to your typical horse at that level) and progeny seem to also have this lovely easiness undersaddle.

 

[gadetra]

Eothain She's by Flagmount King out of a point to point winning mare by Stubbs Gazette. She has NH winning siblings and one by Cavalier Royale that supposedly evented to 2* but I can't find her.
Reality Check that is very informative. Thanks!

 

[Yorketown]

RealityCheck, I need a like button! Very interesting about VDL Harley and loving the Iroko comments

 

[Eothain]

Thanks RealityCheck, that was fantastic. A reality check of sorts!!