Horses that stick tongue out whilst working

lochpearl

lochpearl

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Apart from changing to a flash noseband and having it tight, is there any other way to stop a horse from sticking his tongue out whilst working? Obviously at home this isn't a problem, but for dressage it is and showing with a cavesson will be hell!!

So any ideas?

Horse in question has no problems - just flew a 5 stage vetting and they checked teeth etc.

He is currently ridden in a Rambo Micklem bridle with bit but the noseband is very loose!
 
I was thinking this, but he is in a KK ultra and can't really think of anything else, apart from my NS verbinend (sp) as it it more angled. I think it is just total habit and concentration rather than anything, it's just he will get marked down. Plus when it comes to working in a double I don't want to get accused of Blue tongue lol!!! Vet quite happy with the way he worked and the fit of the bit and that there was nothing going on/wrong in his mouth.....
 
Absolutely change your bit - your horse is trying to tell you his tongue is uncomfortable, so strapping is shut is not a very sympathetic answer!

We made an entire range of bits to solve this problem as the grey in my avatar sticks his tongue out with normal bits, but I needed a non loose ring. So we now sell "Tongue Saver" bits! :D
 
Could you try breaking the habit by putting a much thinner mouth piece in - so something that doesn't fill his mouth as much - and then go from there??
 
A lady on my yard who is very into her affiliated dressage (and MUCH more knowledgable than me) has just turned down a horse she went to see for this very reason. Apparently it's very difficult to train them out of it.
 
CotswoldSJ said:
Absolutely change your bit - your horse is trying to tell you his tongue is uncomfortable, so strapping is shut is not a very sympathetic answer!

We made an entire range of bits to solve this problem as the grey in my avatar sticks his tongue out with normal bits, but I needed a non loose ring. So we now sell "Tongue Saver" bits! :D
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Lol! He only passed the vetting today, he's not mine until tomorrow, just wanted some ideas to try with him when I got him home! he doesn't look uncomfortable at all and the vet thought the same. However just looking at your tongue saver bits they all seem loose ring and also I cannot see much difference in it's appearance to the NS Verbindend. Please can you explain and perhaps send me a link to the bit you were referring to? Thanks
 
AM yes I will try all different types, just thought that someone on here might have already solved the problem with their own horse. The thinner one might be an idea as he is quite fleshy lipped isn't he? So will have a good look at his tongue and mouth tomorrow. Poor boy, will not know what's going on??!!
 
A girl at my yard has a horse that lolls it's tongue. She's tried all sorts but with now change, just one of those things/habits. Nothing wrong with it teeth wise and it's always done it. She got it cheaper because of this. She show jumps so it's not such an issue.
 
Tongue saver is similar to the verbindend, but doesn't have the 45o angle on the lozenge. I started in the verbindend, but then the flipping horse starting going pink and even a well fitting loose ring was starting to chafe so I had to apply lip balm every time I rode!

So I now compete in a tongue saver baucher, and to be honest I don't really find any difference in terms of lozenge angle as it was the bit shape that stopped the tongue from popping out.

I now compete in all disciplines with a cavesson and there's no tongue action! :D:D

Bauch_TongueS2.jpg
 
I'd have to agree with your other responses, he is trying to tell you he isn't comfortable. Please don't consider strapping his mouth shut to be a solution. Try a bit that would give him more room. I would def call one (or a couple) of the bit banks to get advice, then you can try a bit (or several, it's taken me a few to find a nice comfy one for my mare!) for about £5. Totally worth it in my opinion. On the plus side, when you do find a bit that suits him, I bet you he will go better in it. Loads of luck with your new boy, exciting stuff!
 
Lorraine - please don't say that!! lol we WILL sort this out lol!! Mostly I think it is the noseband, he has evented and not been marked down in the dressage and why? pics show flash noseband, and if it has to be out on a minute before the test and taken off straight afterwards - due to cruelty then so be it.

CCP - I am the bit bank - think I have every damn one on and off the shelf so will start with those, problem is, that he is so soft in the hand and mouth I really don't want to monkey about with something that he is comfortable in and moves well in. I guess it is like me - I have a habit that I do - I bite my nails when I get stressed, I pull funny faces when I concentrate and I just think that the harder he concentrates the more he flaps his tongue out.
 
lochpearl said:
I guess it is like me - I have a habit that I do - I bite my nails when I get stressed, I pull funny faces when I concentrate and I just think that the harder he concentrates the more he flaps his tongue out.
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I disagree - dear old Patrik Kittel has shown that excessive pressure on the tongue will make it loll out or the horse will poke it out to avoid the pressure.

Therefore you need a shaped mouthpiece (any brand! ;)) and voila!, it will be fixed.
 
Hmmm... YO also has a SJer that lolls his tongue (but not as bad). Personally I would try and find out why but their horses appear to go fine and have never caused them any other problems so they just ignore it... might be something specific or might just be habit... sorry..
 
Chancer started doing this. Although his teeth had been done, they had not been done as well as they could. I knew something was wrong and he was saying he was uncomfortable.

My vet sedated him and used power tools to really get the sharp edges of the very back teeth. He also gave him a slight bit seat. He also did the same to Farra.

They are both far more happy in their mouths and Chancer is now rarely hanging his tongue out. If he does, I flex him and it pops back in.

I also often have to play with his bits and currently we have wilkie, two types of pelham and the double depending on how he is going.

Personally I hate flash nosebands - I think they hide a lot of problems that could be resolved without strapping the mouth shut. I did use one for a short period on one mare who had got into the habit of opening her mouth wide and setting her jaw, but with schooling and playing with bits, doing teeth etc, I was able to have it very loose, just enough to allow her to open her mouth but not set, and within the year it was gone.

Now, Stinky concentrates with his ears back, hence many of our lovely showing pictures are him going along like that, doesn't stop him winning, though I have had a judge put him down for it as she liked to see ears forward. He does it in hand or ridden, and even when being loose schooled, so I think I will have to learn to live with that one or tie them forward to his browband:D
 
CotswoldSJ said:
Tongue saver is similar to the verbindend, but doesn't have the 45o angle on the lozenge. I started in the verbindend, but then the flipping horse starting going pink and even a well fitting loose ring was starting to chafe so I had to apply lip balm every time I rode!

So I now compete in a tongue saver baucher, and to be honest I don't really find any difference in terms of lozenge angle as it was the bit shape that stopped the tongue from popping out.

I now compete in all disciplines with a cavesson and there's no tongue action! :D:D

Bauch_TongueS2.jpg
Click to expand...

Great so the verbindend would be great as the loose ring is no problem as he gets no problems there. He just likes to flap it out like a dog! I will try this one first as I have one and perhaps bin the KK. Thanks Cotswolds, definitely more food for thought now.
 
If for competitions you need to "encourage" him to keep his tongue to himself try a drop rather than a flash, they can generally get the same effect without needing to be so tight and therefore the horse's mouth isn't strapped shut. They also look much smarter than a flash.

The other thing to try would be riding either with no noseband at all or with a mexican grakle as sometimes a cavesson can pinch the cheeks against the teeth and be uncomfortable.

You'll need to decide whether he is evading some discomfort (in which case remove the discomfort and it should stop) or whether it is more of a bad habit that he has got into, in which case a drop noseband might be the answer.
 
lochpearl said:
Great so the verbindend would be great as the loose ring is no problem as he gets no problems there. He just likes to flap it out like a dog! I will try this one first as I have one and perhaps bin the KK. Thanks Cotswolds, definitely more food for thought now.
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Yes if you have a verbindend you already have the solution! Although don't try it in front of the vendor if you are trying to get a discount for the tongue!!
 
thanks for all the ideas - the vet was very happy with his mouth and teeth but the dentist is due next month for my other boy so will get him to have a real look and give me an idea what to do. No sharp edges so I don't have to worry desperately, I will just try bits and bobs out. There is no rush and we can take our time.
 
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