House Training - caught in the act

[Fools Motto]

Rosie puppy and house training isn't going so great! She just doesn't seem to understand that the kitchen floor isn't the place to 'go'. She goes out very regularly, and performs, and constantly gets praised for those actions. But, in the house, if you are not watching ALL the time, she (owing to very soft pads) does her stealth walking about (you don't know she has got up, she makes no sound) she makes no effort to go near the back door - its often left open, she makes no effort to whine, or look like she needs to go, and she could have just gone a mere few minutes before outside, she'll just randomly go again - inside!

Anyway, we caught her, in the act of going, and not only growled, but smacked her bum, and put her out. Now, for the first time, she seems guilty. I don't even know if this is the right thing, or it is a step in the right direction? Any pointers would be good. I've never had one so stealth like!

 

[Love_my_Lurcher]

My Mum and I had some trouble toilet training our Greyhound and we got really good tips from here. I will pass some of them on. First of all, do not punish her when you catch her. This will make her even more likely to go in the house when you aren't looking. She will fear the punishment and will seek a way to do it when you're not around. Secondly, keep the back door closed as often as possible. When the back door is left open for longer periods of time it can blur the boundaries between outside and indoors. And lastly. Try and teach her a command for going. The command we taught was 'get busy', but you can come up with whatever command you like. Repeat it over and over when you take her out and keep up with the praise when she does the right thing.

I hope this helps and good luck!

 

[SusieT]

bad idea- and won't help.
Don't let her have the run of the house- she shouldn't be able to get to back door or another room without you taking her. Otherwise she will not realise why she should go out.
Do you hit your children when they don't make the toilet? Negative physical re inforcement has been proven time and time again to not do any good. What's done is done but restrain yourself to a growl. the 'guilty' dog look is the 'scared' dog look in reality.

 

[Sandstone1]

Don't hit her. Poor pup.
Close the door. Take her out every time she's fed, every time she wakes up and after she's been playing.
Use a command such as busy. When she goes in the right place say your command and loads of praise and a little treat.
She's not guilty she's picking up your body language.
Watch her as much as possible and get her out at the first sign of needing to go.
It is very time consuming but it will pay off.
Also make sure you clean up her accidents very well as if she can smell where she's been before it will encourage her to go then too.

 

[TGM]

It is worth considering using a crate for those times you can't keep a constant eye on her, until she gets a better idea of where she has to 'go'. Will prevent the 'stealth walking' occurring. I'm not suggesting leaving her in there all the time, in case someone gets the wrong idea, but just those occasions when you are otherwise occupied. Also she should have her naps in the crate, then she can't wake up unnoticed and wander off for an indoor wee. Instead, when you realise she is awake, you can whip her straight out and into the garden. If you do it correctly you shouldn't need to use the crate for very long at all.

 

[Possum]

Our girl sounds very similar. I'd always put it down to the fact that we found her as a stray at about 6 months so she was practically feral, but she has never whined or shown any inclination of 'asking' to go out - if the door wasn't open she'd just go on the floor.

It just took longer, you will need to carry on being super-vigilant, take her out ridiculously frequently and clean any accidents thoroughly so there's no residual scent marking. Keep her where you can see her, and if that's not possible then crate. We crated overnight and she didn't mess her crate. She was probably 18 months before I could really trust her not to just wee on the floor (particularly at friend's houses ) and even now if it's raining I've got to growl at her to make her finish her business outside else she'll trot back inside and poo on the carpet!

 

[twiggy2]

She wont look guilty (dogs don't do guilt) she will be looking scared (of you due to an outburst she does not understand), if a dog toilets in the house it is down to the owner not teaching the dog where is correct to go and where is not. You need to be aware of where your dog is at all times and what she is doing.
It can take a lot of time and a lot of repetition-on your last post I thing the general thought was scolding or scaring the dog whilst in the act will just make her secretive about going, very bad place to get to.
You cannot have a dog that is not clean in the house loose and unsupervised if you want to house train it.

 

[Sandstone1]

She wont look guilty (dogs don't do guilt) she will be looking scared (of you due to an outburst she does not understand), if a dog toilets in the house it is down to the owner not teaching the dog where is correct to go and where is not. You need to be aware of where your dog is at all times and what she is doing.
It can take a lot of time and a lot of repetition-on your last post I thing the general thought was scolding or scaring the dog whilst in the act will just make her secretive about going, very bad place to get to.
You cannot have a dog that is not clean in the house loose and unsupervised if you want to house train it.

This is very true. You need to take the time and effort in taking her out very often, praise and give your command when ever she goes outside. NO PUNISHMENT if she gets it wrong, just take her out and show her the right place to go. Don't get angry with her. It will take time and patience but if you put the effort in it will work. Don't hit her!!
You would not hit a toddler when potty training.

 

[twiggy2]

I wanted to add all dogs give indicators that they need to toilet (circling/sniffing or similar) but scaring or scolding her you will stop her exibiting these signs and it makes your job much harder.
I suggest you smack each other each time you and your husband/partner are not attentive enough to prevent another accident.
Non of my dogs have ever whined at a door to go out to toilet, my lurcher used to just sit in front of me and stare (not helpful if you have fallen asleep on the sofa), my little white dog used to go and stare at the door handle (cos they just open if you wish it enough) and the little black dog used to just go if he needed to (he was clean 98% of the time after the age of 2yrs (he was the dog that had previously been scolded for toiletting in the wrong place so he just hid away to do it), he always used to run away from a poo when he had done it-poor dog always thought he would be scolded for pooing, it made no difference if it was indoors or out.

 

[twiggy2]

just read your other post,
Is this the pup that is left from mid morning till 5pm on work days at only 13 weeks old?
If it is then are you expecting her to house train herself?
I really think the best thing for Rosie is to rehome her if noone wants to put any time into training her/being with her and then you are going to smack her when she gets it wrong.

 

[gunnergundog]

Crate train her for when you're not in the house.
If you're in the house but can't pay attention to her as you are doing something else, get a length of rope and tie her to your waist such that she will always be in your vicinity and you will be aware of any movement indicating she wants to go out.
As said above dogs do give indication of when they need to go so you're obviously not spotting them. Try to be pre-emptive and take her out every hour; after every feed, every sleep, every drink, every play. Make much of her!
Slapping is a really good idea! That is so long as it is yourself you are slapping for having missed the signs that she needs to go out!

 

[Sandstone1]

just read your other post,
Is this the pup that is left from mid morning till 5pm on work days at only 13 weeks old?
If it is then are you expecting her to house train herself?
I really think the best thing for Rosie is to rehome her if noone wants to put any time into training her/being with her and then you are going to smack her when she gets it wrong.

I really hope this is not the case. How on earth do you expect this pup to be house trained?
A pup of this age needs to get out every couple of hours at least.
You will never get her clean if she's left for this amount of time. What do you expect the poor thing to do?
I'm sorry but it's just not fair.

 

[MurphysMinder]

Fools Motto, I am beginning to think you are posting just to wind people up. You asked for advice re getting this pup and then ignored it, and have since done nothing but complain about poor pup. If you won't rehome as previously suggested then please contact CAYLA and ask for a copy of her puppy training guide . I feel so sorry for this pup

 

[Alec Swan]

bad idea- and won't help.
Don't let her have the run of the house- she shouldn't be able to get to back door or another room without you taking her. Otherwise she will not realise why she should go out.
Do you hit your children when they don't make the toilet? Negative physical re inforcement has been proven time and time again to not do any good. What's done is done but restrain yourself to a growl. the 'guilty' dog look is the 'scared' dog look in reality.

For once, just this once p) I agree wholeheartedly with this poster. I'm also wondering Fools Motto, exactly what it is that you expect from a puppy which may well be giving you 'indicators', but signs which you fail to recognise.

Alec.

 

[Bellasophia]

Fools Motto, I am beginning to think you are posting just to wind people up. You asked for advice re getting this pup and then ignored it, and have since done nothing but complain about poor pup. If you won't rehome as previously suggested then please contact CAYLA and ask for a copy of her puppy training guide . I feel so sorry for this pup

Ditto....in fact I've stopped replying to her posts as she doesn't follow any advice and delights in creating a stir. Attention seeking imo.
It's the pup I feel sorry for...and yes it is being left too long without constructive input. Furthermore,this unhappy scenario will only go from bad to worse as the pup goes into adolescence.

 

[RunToEarth]

Fools Motto, I am beginning to think you are posting just to wind people up. You asked for advice re getting this pup and then ignored it, and have since done nothing but complain about poor pup. If you won't rehome as previously suggested then please contact CAYLA and ask for a copy of her puppy training guide . I feel so sorry for this pup

I agree. I just can't think anyone would go out and buy a puppy without knowing anything about basic house training, breed traits, even how long they should be left at home.

It really infuriates me, because ESS's are such willing, good natured dogs and the poor pup doesn't deserve this. Rehome her please for everyone's sake, there are several people on here who would take her off of your hands.

 

[Bellasophia]

Run to earth ....the pup was free gift from her sisters home bred litter...hub wanted it,she didn't....now the hubs lost interest so the pup is paying the price.

 

[RunToEarth]

Run to earth ....the pup was free gift from her sisters home bred litter...hub wanted it,she didn't....now the hubs lost interest so the pup is paying the price.

OP - it breaks my heart, because I love my dogs SO SO much, I can't possibly understand why you would be so unkind to a 13week old puppy, I can't possibly understand why she isn't the centre of your universe, and if she isn't at this cute stage of her life, I dread to think what is in store for her later on down the line.

Please let me know if you are rehoming her, I would buy her just to give her a job and a purpose.

 

[Alec Swan]

…….., I dread to think what is in store for her later on down the line.

…….. .

With luck, a degree of tolerance, then understanding, and THEN discipline. In a previous thread the OP came across as being able and willing to take over when the OH had predictably lost interest. That may yet happen.

OP, the best few words of advice that I've ever been offered regarding dogs is 'Think like a dog'. I'd add to that, 'Consider that your puppy doesn't speak or understand English, at least not until you teach her'. Lessons for both humans and dogs are very rarely 'light-bulb' moments!

Alec.

 

[Thistle]

The best way to house train a puppy is to get a rolled up newspaper and then smack yourself hard with it every time the pup messes in the house. The pup will go when it needs to, it's up to you to take it out regularly and to watch the pup and read the signs. Not the pups fault you aren't reading the signs.

If you don't want/like the pup rehome it whilst it's still trainable. An untrained adolescent springer will be an absolute nightmare.

 

[Clodagh]

I feel sorry for OP as she didn't want this dog in the first place and has been landed with it.
On the other hand, why post when she must know the responses she will get? Odd.
I can't bear Boxers as a breed (for instance) but I don't think I could dislike a boxer pup, although I do see it would perhaps make me less tolerant.

 

[Fools Motto]

Hold on guys...
Lets set a few things straight.
Firstly, I admit, I didn't want a puppy (of any breed) at this time of my life. I've JUST started a wonderful new job, and wanted that to be my full attention.
Secondly, also admiting, springer spaniels are just not 'my breed'. Of course they are lovely, cute, soft ect.. but their busy mannerisms, just don't ''do it'' for me. Sorry. (I'm a whippet fan).
Rosie IS part of the family, I care for her very much. I however, don't love her. Doesn't mean she doesn't get love, she gets more than you'd know thanks to OH! 'My' dog, a whippet X is MY love. Just the way it is.

Right, moving on... Rosie is left for 2 hours in the morning, while we both go to work. OH comes home and 'entertains' her for upto an hour. She is then left again for another 2 hours before my mother and then the children come home, where she isn't left again til the following morning as both OH and I return approx 5. I think this is acceptable?

House training....
Rosie has been doing very well. She understands the command 'wee-wees' and performs in the RIGHT place outside. She duly poos out on walks too. BUT, often in the evenings, when she has been walked, regular trips into the garden and much attention spent on her, she will just wonder around the kitchen and with NO warning, just crouch and wee - this is where I wanted advice.. how to tell her off as we caught her in the act of going.

I told my dog off when she was a pup, in the same way when I caught her in the act - 11 years ago, and she didn't mess in the house again - as implying that system worked. I appreciate time changes methods, hence why I asked.
I do, and have taken on much advice, but equally decide how some advice won't work for me (us). I thank you all for everything, and understand peoples concerns. My situation may not have been totally clear to all. Rosie IS a lovely pup, she IS in a happy home.

 

[AmyMay]

https://positively.com/dog-training/myths-truths/humane-discipline/

But surely the 'warning' is her getting up and wandering in to and around the kitchen. You simply follow her and take her out.......

 

[Fools Motto]

https://positively.com/dog-training/myths-truths/humane-discipline/

But surely the 'warning' is her getting up and wandering in to thekitchen. You simply follow her and take her out.......

We're with her! OH has often just been giving her some TLC, training, cuddles she could have just come in from 'wee-wees'. We DO allow them to walk around the kitchen, getting a drink or coming to see us (office is at the end of the (small) kitchen. Being a spaniel, she isn't very still for very long!

 

[RunToEarth]

she will just wonder around the kitchen and with NO warning, just crouch and wee - this is where I wanted advice.. how to tell her off as we caught her in the act of going.

I told my dog off when she was a pup, in the same way when I caught her in the act - 11 years ago, and she didn't mess in the house again - as implying that system worked. I appreciate time changes methods, hence why I asked.
]

She is a young puppy. She should not be shouted at, told off, smacked when she messes inside. You need to praise her when she goes outside - my code name was "wee wees" and outside wees were rewarded. Inside wees were completely ignored, she needs to go out every half an hour at least as a puppy, and when she does outside wees, reward it with a praising "wee wees" and a pet on a little treat. Puppies wonder when they are looking for wee places, so that is your que to shout "wee wees" and usher her outside.

House training is hard but shouting and smacking is only going to make things worse.

 

[Fools Motto]

She is a young puppy. She should not be shouted at, told off, smacked when she messes inside. You need to praise her when she goes outside - my code name was "wee wees" and outside wees were rewarded. Inside wees were completely ignored, she needs to go out every half an hour at least as a puppy, and when she does outside wees, reward it with a praising "wee wees" and a pet on a little treat. Puppies wonder when they are looking for wee places, so that is your que to shout "wee wees" and usher her outside.

House training is hard but shouting and smacking is only going to make things worse.

I think the problem I'm having here now then is the fact that she is a very active breed, and is always wandering about (when OH is here! - another issue, as its easier without him, accidents happen when he is here!!!)... So.... if the wandering stops, then the 'sudden crouching' should do too??

 

[Alec Swan]

Hold on guys...
Lets set a few things straight.

……..

I'll say it again; You have a cracking pup there. You have eye contact and you have focus, for now. 'For now' means just that, and not for always. The attention that puppies give us can be flattering, but it flatters to deceive! I understand that this pup has been rather 'wished' on you, and I also understand that whilst under duress you're certainly able to take on the responsibility (now that the OH's apparent novelty's warn off), and there's no doubt that you will end up with a very smart little dog.

Though I may be quite wrong in this, I do wonder if you may be jumping the gun, and expecting too much from a puppy which is still but a few weeks old. Expecting her to have grasped the understanding of being house-clean, and without your support and help, is perhaps asking too much. The length of time that a puppy will stay clean, during a day, needs gradual extension, not expecting her to, from the outset, grasp the idea that she must be clean. No dog is EVER clean for us, they're clean for themselves. Allow her to be so by recognising that her wandering about is an indication that she wants to go out, and you've cracked it. Two days, maximum! Easy-peasy!

Alec.

 

[AmyMay]

Inside wees were completely ignored,

House training is hard but shouting and smacking is only going to make things worse.

Yes, we were the same. Completely ignored any accidents in the house, and praised when done outside. I still do on ocassion...

Anyway op, my dog was about 8 months old before I can say hand on heart she was 100% fully house trained. That might be late, I don't know. But I never raised my voice at her, let alone my hand.

Bottom line is, you have a puppy, it's a work in progress, and accidents happen. Don't sweat it.

 

[Alec Swan]

……. ... So.... if the wandering stops, then the 'sudden crouching' should do too??

The 'wandering' is an indication that she needs to go out. That's what puppies do, whippets included.

Alec.

 

[Fools Motto]

I'll say it again; You have a cracking pup there. You have eye contact and you have focus, for now. 'For now' means just that, and not for always. The attention that puppies give us can be flattering, but it flatters to deceive! I understand that this pup has been rather 'wished' on you, and I also understand that whilst under duress you're certainly able to take on the responsibility (now that the OH's apparent novelty's warn off), and there's no doubt that you will end up with a very smart little dog.

Though I may be quite wrong in this, I do wonder if you may be jumping the gun, and expecting too much from a puppy which is still but a few weeks old. Expecting her to have grasped the understanding of being house-clean, and without your support and help, is perhaps asking too much. The length of time that a puppy will stay clean, during a day, needs gradual extension, not expecting her to, from the outset, grasp the idea that she must be clean. No dog is EVER clean for us, they're clean for themselves. Allow her to be so by recognising that her wandering about is an indication that she wants to go out, and you've cracked it. Two days, maximum! Easy-peasy!

Alec.

Thanks Alec for the 'lovely pup' quote. (I DO agree, promise!).. she would rather wander about, than be still... so thats the problem I'AM having with her, the breed. Obviously active. NOT what I'm used to! She is 13 weeks, we WILL get there. She usually does one wee over night, (perhaps the odd poo, but not consistantly) then one wee before OH comes home after 2 hours, and she has been clean and dry there after for my mum (who I'm paying to come over) and then usually one wee in the evenings, her 'stealth time!'. This is clearly the time we can 'catch her in the act' rather than any of the other times. Obviously also get used to 'reading' her signs, but at the moment, we're speaking different languages.