How can I deter someone from getting an unsuitable dog?

[SilverLinings]

There seems to be a lot of people around who choose a dog breed based solely on their looks rather than suitability for the home they can offer (or the dog's welfare in the case of flat-nosed etc breeds). I have managed to put off someone at work who wanted a pug, but had no idea of the health problems and hadn't even bothered researching them (he is going to go to a rescue centre to look for a small crossbreed, and will take the rescue's advice).

A relative of mine now wants to buy a dog. She seems set on buying a large (the larger the better in her words) breed, and ideally a traditionally intimidating-looking breed. She has talked about rottweilers, doberman, boxers (although apparently they aren't big enough so would need to be a cross), great danes and european shepherd dogs like the anatolian. Her only experience of dogs is that her family had a jack russell when she was growing up, and she occasionally walked and fed it. The reasons I feel she is looking at the wrong type of dog is that:

- She can't explain why she wants a big, scarey looking dog (I asked), but I suspect it's just because she thinks it will attract attention in public
- she regularly babysits another family member's baby and toddler, they stay over at her house
- she has a very limited idea of how to train dogs, she is also physically tiny so would stand no chance if a large dog wasn't trained to walk to heel.
- she lives in a very small house, with a courtyard rather than garden
- she knows that she would need either a dog walker or to put it into daycare on the days she works, and several of these businesses in the area won't take at least one of the breeds listed above due to aggression problems in the
past.
- she wants to take it hiking for miles and out with her when she cycles
- she has a limited budget for ongoing care/upkeep (but would insure for vets' fees)
- she hasn't been good at sticking with things in the past so I worry that the sort of dog she wants will be harder to re-home if reality hits and she becomes bored or overwhelmed.

I know that big dogs aren't all 'bad' dogs, and with any dog training is key, but I worry that the risks of a poorly trained bad dog are greater than with a poorly trained small one. I also don't think her set-up would be fair on a large dog (I'm not sure where she could fit a large enough dog bed in her house for a start).

I have been positive about her desire for a dog, but have tried to encourage her to look at something smaller breed-wise. I have explained to her that large dogs are more expensive than smaller breeds (vet treatment, feed, collars/beds, insurance etc) but she doesn't seem to believe this. I have explained that large breeds have shorter lifespans on average, and many of them aren't evolved for long-distance running-type exercise. I have also pointed out that there is a history of breeds with high bite strength not necessarily being safe around children unless trained properly, but I think she has a limited view on how much time and effort it actually takes to train a dog properly.

It is obviously not up to me what she decides, but she keeps asking me for advice, and I suspect I will be the one she tries to rope in to help if it goes wrong. I think that she could give the right sort of dog a good home if she took the training seriously, but I worry for the dog if she buys the wrong breed. Does anyone have any suggestions of ways I might steer her towards a more suitable dog?

I don't want to fall out with her over this, but as she is asking for advice I would like to set her up for a happy outcome rather than a bit of a potential disaster.

 

[twiggy2]

A rottie or a boxer may suit her quite well if she puts in the training, time and buys from decent lines.
Personally both those breeds would be a no from me due to the cancer risk.
I am not sure I would be interested in any dog care provider who judges the dog on breed rather than the individual it shows basic lack of knowledge and understanding of dogs.

 

[skinnydipper]

she wants to take it hiking for miles and out with her when she cycles

Weimaraner, Dalmation, GSP, Husky.

ETA I can't speak for all mastiff types but mine would certainly not appreciate hiking for miles or running alongside a cycle. She is more of a leisurely sniff and amble dog.

 

[SilverLinings]

A rottie or a boxer may suit her quite well if she puts in the training, time and buys from decent lines.
Personally both those breeds would be a no from me due to the cancer risk.
I am not sure I would be interested in any dog care provider who judges the dog on breed rather than the individual it shows basic lack of knowledge and understanding of dogs.

She thinks boxers are too small, so I need a way to persuade her to consider something that size.

Re. the dog care providers, there was a spate of incidents caused by dogs from one estate, apparently the daycare and dog walkers didn't want to discriminate against owners from that postcode/area, so went by breeds instead. They also had a lot of other clients threatening to jump ship. I expect the rules will eventually lapse and it is a bit of a PR exercise, but it does currently limit care options.

 

[SilverLinings]

A pointer-type would be good (I really love them, particularly English Pointers) but again it is the issue of how to get her to consider a less aggressive-looking, smaller breed than she is currently in favour of.

There are plenty of great breeds (or mongrels) that would be more suitable for her, I'm just a bit stuck on how to get her to consider one.

I think if she was interested in one particular breed then I'd be less worried (as a lot of us have a favourite breed), but it's more that she is choosing an accessory with a certain 'look'/attitude which IMHO is not the best way to choose an animal (I know we all like certain looks, but that is our preference, rather than choosing a breed based on how you think it will make you look to other people).

 

[skinnydipper]

she has no idea how to train dogs, she is also physically tiny so would stand no chance if a large dog wasn't trained to walk to heel.

Even a small dog needs training.

 

[Archangel]

I meet a lot of very nice Pointers, running and beside bikes. I don't know anything about the breed but they all seem easy going and well behaved,

 

[blackcob]

From experience, short answer - you won't be able to persuade her and she'll get the dog she wants. Up to you if you want to be available when it goes wrong.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

A rottie or a boxer may suit her quite well if she puts in the training, time and buys from decent lines.
Personally both those breeds would be a no from me due to the cancer risk.
I am not sure I would be interested in any dog care provider who judges the dog on breed rather than the individual it shows basic lack of knowledge and understanding of dogs.

A Rottie will not be suitable for walking miles, they are very heavy dogs and, being black, feel the heat easily. Having had several, I would never recommend them as a first dog, or one for an inexperienced owner.

 

[CorvusCorax]

Livestock guardians are bred to conserve energy, not exert it. Should exclude a few breeds.

 

[misst]

Another one who has found pointers really great. Three locally and all of them lovely friendly passive natures. All 3 were boisterous when young but all 3 are well trained. They seem to be able to run for miles in that lovely loping gate, ignore small dogs/barking dogs/reactive dogs. They are a bit big for me but I really like them. They seemed amenable to training as well - but maybe they just had good owners. I guess if you want a fierce looking dog (but why??) they won't fit the bill but they are quite large.

 

[KittenInTheTree]

Are you sure she's not just winding you up?

 

[fiwen30]

Your relative sounds like a fruit loop, and not the type to take advice, even though they’re asking for it.

Personally, I’d disengage and not get myself involved - from what you’ve written, I can’t see this going anywhere good.

 

[Dexter]

A big dog wont be mature until 2yrs old so she will have to wait that long before she starts huge walks and cycles. A smaller dog will mature quicker and be out doing the things she wants to do much sooner. Maybe that will sway her?

 

[Highmileagecob]

Point her in the direction of your nearest rescue centre and advise her to volunteer for a month to get to know the type of dog she is so set on having.

 

[JumpTheMoon1]

Fall out with her and tell her some home truths.

 

[Christmascinnamoncookie]

None of the breeds she’s mentioned are suitable for running/cycling. I’ve been told that pointers are harder to train than springers, so I’m not sure that’s the best idea. Whilst I’m not a believer of gundogs needing endless exercise, the 2 pointers I know get decent walks and would benefit from more training, so again, I don’t think the OP’s relative sounds like she’s suitable for that kind of dog. She wants a lazy lap dog-greyhound might suit given how everyone says they don’t need tons of exercise.

 

[cbmcts]

If she's set on having a certain type of dog - and by sounds it, a type that looks a bit hard - would she consider a staffie? Generally very sweet forgiving dogs so at least no one would get eaten, small enough that even untrained, she could hang on to it and don't need lots of space at home

Mind you, if she has a limited budget, none of her chosen breeds are cheap to buy, nor would the breed rescues consider her and it's rare to find anything other than the Anatolian shepherd in general rescues so she might find she's priced out before she even starts.

 

[paddy555]

A big dog wont be mature until 2yrs old so she will have to wait that long before she starts huge walks and cycles. A smaller dog will mature quicker and be out doing the things she wants to do much sooner. Maybe that will sway her?

does the 5 minutes a month rule apply to some of these larger breeds. It was drummed into me when I got my GSD. I stuck to it but it did mean that going out for hikes, bike running was very limited for a long time. Also stairs, jumping, etc
Would the waiting deter her?

It did also mean that you have a very large dog who wants a lot of exercise but can't have it so you have to find other ways to amuse it.

 

[TPO]

The 5min a month doesn't apply as a rule to any breed, its been disproven a few times ans the inital "research" was highly flawed.

Common sense should prevail and obviously no dog should be over exercised or exerted at a young age etc. Unfortunately common sense isn't a flower that grows in everyone garden and it doesn't sound like OPs relative has much of it (sorry OP).

It's got disaster written all over it. The person in question is clearly clueless and has no idea about owning, training or exercising a dog. Their set up sounds less than ideal and their lack of commitment to anything makes it sound like the dog being rehomed is a real possibility.

If OP has already pointed out the obvious and gotten nowhere I can't imagine what would change the person's mind to at least research what getting a dog entails.

Not a relative but ice been where you are with people I know over lockdown. I posted about the one who got the crocked German shepherd from a well known dodgy person and would not be told. Before it was a year it was crippled with hip dysplasia and was dead before his first birthday all down to their ignorance and not listening to any advice. As you can tell it makes me a bit peeved ? The others at least got small dogs (all doodle crosses at great expense), the dogs are all neurotic, unsocialised and not good with other dogs or people (as in extremely timid not aggressive) but at least get regular vet care and have homes for life.

So yeah for your own sanity walk away (of you want to scream at your relative first for being ridiculous I'd think that would be understandable)

 

[Equi]

When my aunt asked me for advice about a 3rd dog in so many months (one was too big so rehomed, one was too hyper so rehomed etc) I bluntly said “I will not help you get another fugging dog to abandon nor will anyone else you’ve asked. Forget about it”

she’s not got another dog and also hasn’t fallen out with me or them so.

 

[paddy555]

The 5min a month doesn't apply as a rule to any breed, its been disproven a few times ans the inital "research" was highly flawed.

can you give me a link to where is was disproven please? thanks

 

[skinnydipper]

can you give me a link to where is was disproven please? thanks

https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=438781708251331&set=a.396695732459929

https://www.mylamedog.com/post/what...ng-puppies-until-the-growth-plates-are-closed

 

[JBM]

I don’t really think big dogs should be a first dog when they have no previous training experience and may not have the budget for a trainer when it goes wrong
Big dogs are dangerous when badly trained even if they don’t mean it..they can nock people over and can accidentally injure someone during play if you don’t teach them when to stop
People need to stop buying dogs without research it’s why so many people end up putting them into dogs trust or pounds

 

[paddy555]

https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=438781708251331&set=a.396695732459929

https://www.mylamedog.com/post/what...ng-puppies-until-the-growth-plates-are-closed

https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=438781708251331&set=a.396695732459929

https://www.mylamedog.com/post/what...ng-puppies-until-the-growth-plates-are-closed

thanks that's interesting.. Every GSD I have had up to now never stuck to the 5 mins rule as I had never heard of it.
With the current one every breeder was fanatical about this. These were all dogs with low elbow and hip scores. I stuck by it but always wondered why feral young dogs would be off hunting and no one would time them.
What made breeders, especially GSD breeders, so fanatical about this?

 

[Dexter]

thanks that's interesting.. Every GSD I have had up to now never stuck to the 5 mins rule as I had never heard of it.
With the current one every breeder was fanatical about this. These were all dogs with low elbow and hip scores. I stuck by it but always wondered why feral young dogs would be off hunting and no one would time them.
What made breeders, especially GSD breeders, so fanatical about this?

thanks that's interesting.. Every GSD I have had up to now never stuck to the 5 mins rule as I had never heard of it.
With the current one every breeder was fanatical about this. These were all dogs with low elbow and hip scores. I stuck by it but always wondered why feral young dogs would be off hunting and no one would time them.
What made breeders, especially GSD breeders, so fanatical about this?

A flawed study from the 70s. Theres a post about it somewhere on here as thats where I first read it

 

[satinbaze]

Maybe she needs to check out local dog walkers and daycare as many won’t take the giant breeds.

 

[SilverLinings]

Thank you everyone for the advice, I will try mentioning to her the fact that larger dogs take longer to physically mature, and attempt to persuade her to volunteer at a rescue.

I think this may sum it up:

From experience, short answer - you won't be able to persuade her and she'll get the dog she wants. Up to you if you want to be available when it goes wrong.

...but I am sick of seeing miserable dogs bought by unsuitable owners so I wanted to try to make this situation work out better. I think I will have a final conversation offering the above advice, and if she still wants to get a large, aggressive-looking breed then I will tell her I won't be available help as I advise her against it as unsuitable. If it goes completely t!ts up then I will point her in the direction of a reputable trainer followed by a reputable rescue, but I am not prepared to do more than that (e.g. train it myself).

I really struggle to understand how/why some people go about choosing a sentient animal like they would a handbag or motorbike etc. Actually, maybe I should suggest if she wants to look 'hard' she could buy a leather jacket and motorbike instead (unfortunately I think she would deny that being the reason for her wanting a particular type of dog)

 

[stangs]

As a last ditch attempt, I’d send her some videos/photos from recent dog attacks on the news - especially ones where the dog went for the owner - just so she knows what the potential repercussions are.

I can understand why someone might want an intimidating dog to feel safer walking around at night and whatnot, but this is ridiculous. The idea of someone like this buying an Anatolian Shepherd is horrific.

 

[bonny]

Thank you everyone for the advice, I will try mentioning to her the fact that larger dogs take longer to physically mature, and attempt to persuade her to volunteer at a rescue.

I think this may sum it up:



...but I am sick of seeing miserable dogs bought by unsuitable owners so I wanted to try to make this situation work out better. I think I will have a final conversation offering the above advice, and if she still wants to get a large, aggressive-looking breed then I will tell her I won't be available help as I advise her against it as unsuitable. If it goes completely t!ts up then I will point her in the direction of a reputable trainer followed by a reputable rescue, but I am not prepared to do more than that (e.g. train it myself).

I really struggle to understand how/why some people go about choosing a sentient animal like they would a handbag or motorbike etc. Actually, maybe I should suggest if she wants to look 'hard' she could buy a leather jacket and motorbike instead (unfortunately I think she would deny that being the reason for her wanting a particular type of dog)

What breed of dog have you got assuming you have one or more ?