How do you TACTFULLY tell someone their horse is dangerous?

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joeanne

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I have a friend who has a rather "difficult" horse.
The horse has no respect for anyone's ground space, and has been known to kick and bite.
Thats bad enough, but frankly when ridden it's dangerous.
Friend (no1) turned up Sunday (unannounced) to hack out with me, my girls and another friend (no2) we had made arrangements with.
We changed our planned hack to one that involves no roadwork to accomodate the horse who I dont feel ought to be on the road.
Unfortunately the route we now have to take involves going over a motorway bridge. Bridge is narrow with low railings. Not safe to ride over IMO and my girls and friend 2 and myself dismount and start to lead horses over. Friend 1 insists she will ride over, despite my telling her I would rather she doesn't as it sets a bad example for my girls.
By this time all my enjoyment of hacking out with planned friend and girls is fast wavering.
Friend 1 does ride horse over the bridge, and encounters a cyclist the other side. Friend 1 asks horse to halt, horse spins round, starts backing up, and squashes this poor woman and her bike against the railings.
Friend 1 mutters an apology and trots off at speed.
My youngest daughter stops, asks the lady if she is ok and waits for me to cross the bridge and see the lady (whom I give friend 1's contact details as her bike is slightly damaged and IMO friend 1 owes her a more heartfelt apology!).
I can no longer see friend 1 as she has trotted off out of sight. I lose my temper and tell the girls to turn around, we are going home (friend 2 agree's this is the best thing all round).
Friend 1 later rings me and asks why we "ditched her".
Now, I DO like this friend, but I dont want to hack out with her anymore. My youngest is scared of her horse, and my eldest mutters the whole way round (a bit loudly at times) about turning her horse into pedigree chum, and friend 1's complete lack of awareness for anyone else. Its no fun for anyone. (My youngest was almost knocked off her pony in a similar fashion the time before this)
How on earth do I tell her I dont want her to hack out with us anymore if she insists on bringing her horse (as I am happy to lend her one of mine)?
If it were anyone else I would tell them straight, and say I dont want the horse's company anymore, but this friend has a history of histrionics and bursts into tears making you feel like its YOU in the wrong....:confused:
 
God I am glad I am not you , I am rubbish at stuff like this and would probably resort to hacking at 5am hoping she got the message. Not much help but good luck and remember it is supposed to be a hobby which means you are supposed to enjoy it!
 
Just be honest and tell her, you and yours dont feel comfortable hacking out with that horse. Start making excuses will only trip you up in the end!
 
I'm afraid if you kids are scared and not enjoying their own horses because of this idiot woman then tact is out the window. Tell her straight you don't want to hack with her because her horse is a danger to itself, to her and much more importantly your kids.
 
Benson I know I have to be honest and tell her, but its what I say???
She is such a drama queen that I am going to end up feeling like I am picking on her!
 
Hang on, you mean to to say this person nearly injured a person and damaged their bike and she just carried on regardless without so much as a word and left you to smooth things over? that's ...well that's just madness!:eek:

Just tell her you don't want to ride out with her as your children don't enjoy it and you feel it can get a bit dangerous at times, as a mother you are bound to be cautious anyway, so surely she should understand and respect your wishes.
 
Something like, really sorry, but after the other day and the incident on the bridge,I dont feel yr horse is safe out hacking, I am not comfortable coming out with you, but I am more than happy for you to ride one of mine.
 
Its your perogative to choose not to ride with a particular horse/rider. Better to be honest than do as you did. Leaving another rider on another hack without letting them know is not acceptable. It could have caused serious difficulty for the rider. I can't see the harm in riding over the bridge, my horses were trained to go over motorway bridges as we'd have never gone anywhere if we didn't. When faced with a potential hazard its up to the rider to deal with it in the way they feel best. I would not dismount either.
Bottom line is, you don't like riding with this horse, which is fine, but just tell her.
 
Tricky but i'd say something like - Its great that your so confident but he scares the c**p out of me! in order to avoid going into cardiac arrest i think i might have to give our rides a miss :)
 
Kenzo said:
Hang on, you mean to to say this person nearly injured a person and damaged their bike and she just carried on regardless without so much as a word and left you to smooth things over?
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^that. I'm not so sure that the problem is the horse to be honest.........
 
I think you need to be totally honest with your friend and ignore any tears. Your friend needs to be told she has to be more aware of others and not be so selfish. What would have happened if that poor woman had gone over the railings onto the motorway??



It actually comes across that your friend turns on the tears so she doesn't have to face the consequences of her own actions
 
joeanne said:
I have a friend who has a rather "difficult" horse.
The horse has no respect for anyone's ground space, and has been known to kick and bite.
Thats bad enough, but frankly when ridden it's dangerous.
Friend (no1) turned up Sunday (unannounced) to hack out with me, my girls and another friend (no2) we had made arrangements with.
We changed our planned hack to one that involves no roadwork to accomodate the horse who I dont feel ought to be on the road.
Unfortunately the route we now have to take involves going over a motorway bridge. Bridge is narrow with low railings. Not safe to ride over IMO and my girls and friend 2 and myself dismount and start to lead horses over. Friend 1 insists she will ride over, despite my telling her I would rather she doesn't as it sets a bad example for my girls.
By this time all my enjoyment of hacking out with planned friend and girls is fast wavering.
Friend 1 does ride horse over the bridge, and encounters a cyclist the other side. Friend 1 asks horse to halt, horse spins round, starts backing up, and squashes this poor woman and her bike against the railings.
Friend 1 mutters an apology and trots off at speed.
My youngest daughter stops, asks the lady if she is ok and waits for me to cross the bridge and see the lady (whom I give friend 1's contact details as her bike is slightly damaged and IMO friend 1 owes her a more heartfelt apology!).
I can no longer see friend 1 as she has trotted off out of sight. I lose my temper and tell the girls to turn around, we are going home (friend 2 agree's this is the best thing all round).
Friend 1 later rings me and asks why we "ditched her".
Now, I DO like this friend, but I dont want to hack out with her anymore. My youngest is scared of her horse, and my eldest mutters the whole way round (a bit loudly at times) about turning her horse into pedigree chum, and friend 1's complete lack of awareness for anyone else. Its no fun for anyone. (My youngest was almost knocked off her pony in a similar fashion the time before this)
How on earth do I tell her I dont want her to hack out with us anymore if she insists on bringing her horse (as I am happy to lend her one of mine)?
If it were anyone else I would tell them straight, and say I dont want the horse's company anymore, but this friend has a history of histrionics and bursts into tears making you feel like its YOU in the wrong....:confused:
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Hmmm I can see her point of view if you just turned around and went home without her :confused: Although admittedly it was flipping stupid of her to ride off out of sight at a trot anyway, even more so if you guys were still crossing the bridge (was it in order to get the horse back under control do you think?)

Its your children and your horse's safety which is ultimately being compromised, so much though she may have hysterics and try to guilt trip you (rod for your own back already being in place with you turning around and leaving her), I think you really do need to bite the bullet and tell her she is welcome to come out with you if she wants to ride one of your horses, but she must respect that when you ask her to do something to set a good example to your children that she does it, and under no circumstances will you be hacking out with that horse again.
 
horserider said:
Its your perogative to choose not to ride with a particular horse/rider. Better to be honest than do as you did. Leaving another rider on another hack without letting them know is not acceptable. It could have caused serious difficulty for the rider. I can't see the harm in riding over the bridge, my horses were trained to go over motorway bridges as we'd have never gone anywhere if we didn't. When faced with a potential hazard its up to the rider to deal with it in the way they feel best. I would not dismount either.
Bottom line is, you don't like riding with this horse, which is fine, but just tell her.
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Have to say i agree with this although i appreciate it is not always that easy to 'get out' of riding with someone, and although it is up to the rider to deal with their own horse in the way they feel best, its a whole different ballgame when riding/looking out for your own children.

I would personally say that although you are happy to ride with her (keeps the peace whether you are or not) you are not happy for her to ride out with you when your children are involved.
 
She has "histrionics", to control your behaviour, ie it stops you asserting yourself. Ignore her bad behaviour and tell her that her animal's behaviour worries you too much to continue hacking in her company.
Good Luck!
 
Anonnymouse said:
^that. I'm not so sure that the problem is the horse to be honest.........
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Indeed, I wouldn't want to ride out with someone who had that type of attitude anyway.

OP, listen to your children, they maybe young but sometimes kids tend to be excellent judges of character at times.
 
Naturally said:
Hmmm I can see her point of view if you just turned around and went home without her :confused:
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I can see what you are saying, but she had gone off, not stopped, and left me (and my 10 yr old) to deal with the end result of her lack of control.
She had also been gone a good ten mins, and daughter's pony is an oap who was out for a gentle amble. Not up to a 10 minute stretch of trotting in order to catch her up.
And I was in danger of loosing the plot and really shouting at her....again something I dont want to do in front of my girls.
Home seemed like the most sensible option!
 
Maybe she trotted off at speed because she was worried her horse would push the woman, the bike and itself over the bridge!! I'd have been terrified and nothing would persuade me to hack out with her again. Your children have to come first, she is selfishly putting them in danger. I'd simply tell her your kids are getting nervous and that you won't be hacking with her anymore. She'll end up killing herself and her horse.
 
Wrong on both sides of this story by the sounds of it.

Yes, this woman was very much in the wrong to just trot off without giving her details to the cyclist, although if she was still on the bridge and the horse was playing up I can see why she would want to quickly get the horse away to somewhere a bit safer.

I wouldn't dismount going over a bridge either - more in control if you stay on the horse and if you're riding something difficult I wouldn't want to get off and risk not being able to get back on board.

I also think you were seriously in the wrong to turn around and leave her. Some horses go absolutely nuts if they are suddenly left on their own, and if this horse is as dangerous as you say it is, then you could have seriously endangered her life.

Whilst I can understand riding out with her makes you uncomfortable, and I understand your wish not to do it again, it doesn't sound like you were in immediate danger.

Anyway I would just say that her horse's behaviour scares you and you like hacking out with her but you'd prefer if she'd go out on one of yours.
 
Sounds exactly like someone I used to ride with at an old yard. The problem was infact the person not the horse, thats another story though.

Anyway, after a few near misses and her tanking off and upsetting our horses I had to say something. I just said to her the next time she asked to come out with me that I was worried about her safety, her horses safety and the public. It was nothing against her but i would rather not hack with her. She took it really well, she then relised she needed some help with her issues.

She then got a DVD and a carrot stick. say no more.

P.S 4 yrs later things are no better, she can not even hack out at all!!!!!
 
The answer is; don't do it tactfully and don't use the kids as an excuse. If she's prone to hysteria it's bound to effect her horse's temperament/behaviour. If you put her on one of yours it may behave in the same way. If you don't want to confront her, make hacking arrangements covertly. Trotting on and leaving you all with her fallout doesn't make her much of a friend anyway.
 
xspiralx said:
Wrong on both sides of this story by the sounds of it.

Yes, this woman was very much in the wrong to just trot off without giving her details to the cyclist, although if she was still on the bridge and the horse was playing up I can see why she would want to quickly get the horse away to somewhere a bit safer.

I wouldn't dismount going over a bridge either - more in control if you stay on the horse and if you're riding something difficult I wouldn't want to get off and risk not being able to get back on board.

I also think you were seriously in the wrong to turn around and leave her. Some horses go absolutely nuts if they are suddenly left on their own, and if this horse is as dangerous as you say it is, then you could have seriously endangered her life.

Whilst I can understand riding out with her makes you uncomfortable, and I understand your wish not to do it again, it doesn't sound like you were in immediate danger.

Anyway I would just say that her horse's behaviour scares you and you like hacking out with her but you'd prefer if she'd go out on one of yours.
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what she said ^^
 
xspiralx said:
I wouldn't dismount going over a bridge either - more in control if you stay on the horse and if you're riding something difficult I wouldn't want to get off and risk not being able to get back on board.
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Nobody rides over that bridge for very good reason. Its narrow, and the railings are low. If you were to fall off you fall straight over the side and traumatise the poor s*ds going up the motorway!

xspiralx said:
I also think you were seriously in the wrong to turn around and leave her. Some horses go absolutely nuts if they are suddenly left on their own, and if this horse is as dangerous as you say it is, then you could have seriously endangered her life.
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If her horse were worried about being on its own she wouldn't have bu**ered off out of sight. We had stopped for a good ten mins to talk to the cyclist. If she were that worried, she would have come back to us on the bridge.

THIS time none of US were hurt (although thats not always been the case). The horse doesn't scare me, its what could happen because of the riders lack of ability to adequately control her horse.
She had not been invited along, we had actually made plans and then changed them to accomodate her.
I ride for enjoyment, and I feel nothing but uptight and anxious when she comes out.....and sadly am normally proved right for feeling so!
 
Sorry but I would have left her as well. I can understand her wanting to get her horse off the bridge but to then trot off and leave you with her mess - not on really!

She obviously didn't care what you were having deal with with the person she'd squashed so why shouldn't you have turned round - your child was upset and that has to come first.

As for your friend sometimees blunt is the best way TBH. I used to ride a complete nutter who could be dangerous on roads and with other horses - I always hacked alone by my choice because I didn't want to put anyone else at risk until I had his issues sorted.
 
Okay it wasn't good to leave her, but if you can't catch up there is no option.

There is the flip side of you still being near the bridge when she trotted off, could have upset yours & placed you in difficult position.

Bottom line is your children were placed in a potentially dangerous siutation. Are you happy to accept that in order to hack out with her. If (as I suspect ) not, as you posted on here, then be straight. If she is controlling say you wish to remain friends but as her horse has shown dangerous behaviour for safety you will only hack out with her when she rides one of yours, & not 'the' horse. Do explain that you couldn't catch her up due to aged pony, & didn't know where hse was so again for safety you returned to the yard. It would be nice if she realised you took action because of her behaviour, but given her attitude to the cyclist I doubt it. If she can't take hacking on your terms, leave her to her paddy. If she can't see a dangerous horse is not good around young kids hacking, then she wont show any concern for their safety anyway so you don't need her about near your kids.

I have a lovely friend, such a sweet lady. But she can't stand up for her kids. People at the yard are rude to them, push them around (metaphorically) because they are adults & they are kids, rude about the horses etc & she wont face up to them. I've done it before now when I was there (I have been bullied in the past & now wont take it or see it dished out), but she is just too nice. Those kids get so upset & it totally spoils their enjoyment of their horses. I love my friend to bits but somedays I just want her to say 'that's enough' for their sakes.
 
Joanne - If it's a case of not wanting to hurt her feelings then just say that you won't be riding out with her on a regular basis because it's quality time that you want to spend as a family (bit of mum and daughter time sort of thing;)) but will sometimes bob out with her if you are just taking your horse out.

Problem solved :)
 
Might be something I can try Kenzo.
She knows that a group of us regularly hack out, but I guess we could swap that to a weekday as she only hacks out at the weekend.
Its more the risk involved for others that makes me feel I ought to make her understand that her horse is a bit of a nut job, and her actions are really not acceptable behaviour. You really cannot tootle off if you have caused someone else injury or damage (a proper apology would have been a good start!) especially if that person needs your contact details to claim on your insurance for the damage done.
Its silly because if it were anyone else I would have thrown the book at them. But the minute I mention her behaviour and her horses lack of control she will start to cry. Then I feel bad. Guess I need to toughen up!
 
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By the sound of things, she ditched you by trotting off and leaving you, not the other way round! And the crying thing just sounds like manipulative behaviour so she gets her own way!
 
What xspiralx said.

I ride near several motorways, none of the bridges have high sides (eek!) and if on a horse I think likely to chuck me off I do dismount or avoid the bridges all together.

Having said that there are horses I can control much more safely on the roads (or anywhere else) from on top. Horses are stronger than us and I can't physically stop one tanking off in hand if they really want to. The only time I've been responsible for a horse getting onto a road (thankfully no harm done but it was a 60mph one several fields from where I was so I didn't know it was OK at the time) was when I got off hacking. I'd never EVER get off that one out and about again.

In this case the group of horses & riders clearly isn't suited to going out together. No harm in saying that. No need to criticise any of the horses/riders in so many words.
 
TGM said:
By the sound of things, she ditched you by trotting off and leaving you, not the other way round! And the crying thing just sounds like manipulative behaviour so she gets her own way!
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That's what I was going to say!! If she'd wanted to carry on the hack with you she should have gone back to the bridge, but I suppose that might have entailed apologizing to the cyclist :rolleyes:. I also understand why you got off going over the bridge - we have a river bridge to cross to reach a lot of our hacking and it has very low sides which are probably just about level with my feet when I'm riding my 14.3hh mare. I went through a phase of being terrified I'd get tipped over the edge and used to get off and walk over.
I think you need to tell her straight. Say that you found the last hack extremely unnerving in regards to the safety of your girls and that you're not willing to do it again. She needs to hear it!
 
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