How quickly would you expect a horse to move up the levels

sam-b

sam-b

Well-Known Member
Joined
7 January 2008
Messages
816
Visit site
in BS, if the horse nor teh rider has ever done it before? for example after 3 montsh would you be expecting them jumping Newcomers? Assuming owner is an amateur rider holding botha full and part ime job down, and fitting in riding around it - DIY livery, competing on average a class maybe 2, every 2 maybe 3 weeks and a lesson once a month?
Rider has ridden for a few years but only unaffilaited with mixed results, horse is a green youngster??
 
id say once the horse is jumping consistent double clears in a class for say 4 or 5 times then move it up to the next class, as long as you feel ok with going up the grades too

i dont think you can say specific time periods to be in each class, some young horses will jump british novice for a long time before moving onto discovery and then newcomers, yet some 5 yr olds are jumping 1.15 (height of the 5 yr old scope final)
 
I think jumping newcomers after 3 months for an amateur rider and fairly green horse is quite ambitious. I would try not to set yourselves time scales - there is no set time for anything and it is best just to wait until you feel absolutely ready and confident. Yes professionals will have 5 years olds jumping Newcomers / Foxhunter in no time at all, but they are professionals after all and there is no saying that it actually does the horse any good in the long run. I think it is much better to take it slowly and let the horse and rider develop and gain in confidence. I would aim is to jump consistent and confident double clears at british novice and discovery before you start to think about moving up to Newcomers. For example, it took me at least a year on my greenish 5 year old before I was established at that level and confident to have a try at Newcomers. I think at Newcomers level it starts to become a bit of a different ball game and you need to be sure that you are both ready for it. Having said that, if you have done all of the above and are feeling confident in 3 months then there is no harm giving it a go!
 
Depends totally on horse and rider.
Juno was quite scopey but the brain just wasn't there so a lot of time was needed to get her to settle in the ring. This has to be done over the lower heights.
Zed I think is a different story. He has a super attitude to jumping with what seems to be endless scope. Popped him round a 1.05 course last night and it was the most effortless jumping I've done in a long time. He gave everything a couple of extra feet. Not because he was worried, simply because he could without having to try. Very obvious he loves the job.
So I would expect Zed to probably be jumping newc within 3 months but will only know for sure once we start competing. It it all goes to pot in the ring then it will take how ever long is necessary. Plans have to be very fluid.
 
I think it will not only depend on the horse's brain as Juno said but also your ability as a rider and how much training etc you have, i'm not suggesting you do but I watch alot and so many riders who "miss" at 90, 1.00 where the horse can help them out go on quickly to bigger classes, but if you miss at 1.10, 1.20 then it is only so long before they will say no!!! So as everyone else has said get truly established before moving on however confident and easy it may seem at a lower level and the best of luck and most importantly have fun!
 
Go at the speed you feel is right for you and the rider, never overreach, always make sure the basic training is solid. Never hurts to stay too long at a level but over-facing rider or horse can result i a disaster.
 
wonkey_donkey said:
A half decent horse will be out of Newcomers after it's first year BS and out of Foxhunter after it's second year.
Click to expand...

Is this a half decent horse with a pro rider, though? I was thinking that an awful lot of amateurs don't even move out of Disco, do they? Interesting about what stage a horse "should" be at and when - WD, would you term a half decent horse a horse that is headed for Grade A?
 
wonkey_donkey said:
A half decent horse will be out of Newcomers after it's first year BS and out of Foxhunter after it's second year.
Click to expand...

It totally depends on the horse. Mine as a 4YO with an Amateur was jumping Fox. Her first class was a Newcomers. In her second year as a 5YO she was wining 1.25s on the Sunshine Tour - all with a 16yo amateur girl.

It makes no difference how many full and part time jobs you have. Good horses don't need to jump at home or have loads of lessons.
 
dieseldog said:
It totally depends on the horse. Mine as a 4YO with an Amateur was jumping Fox. Her first class was a Newcomers. In her second year as a 5YO she was wining 1.25s on the Sunshine Tour - all with a 16yo amateur girl.

It makes no difference how many full and part time jobs you have. Good horses don't need to jump at home or have loads of lessons.
Click to expand...

That's impressive! How far up the grades did she go? I'm trying to calculate the trajectory of a Grade A horse as opposed to a BN/Disco/riding club horse, and compare where they "should" be at various ages! (If that's possible.)

For example, the 6 yo champs are, what, 1.30? So you could say that a world beater should be jumping 1.30 by the time it's six?
 
Move up when you feel ready. Once you are jumping DC's at BN and placing your horse on the correct strides and having nice round move up and so on..

There is no time limit as to when you should be jumping newcomers/fox!
 
dieseldog said:
It totally depends on the horse. Mine as a 4YO with an Amateur was jumping Fox. Her first class was a Newcomers. In her second year as a 5YO she was wining 1.25s on the Sunshine Tour - all with a 16yo amateur girl.

It makes no difference how many full and part time jobs you have. Good horses don't need to jump at home or have loads of lessons.
Click to expand...

You do need to have some ability though. Look at Parkmore Ed.... :D
 
HotToTrot said:
That's impressive! How far up the grades did she go? I'm trying to calculate the trajectory of a Grade A horse as opposed to a BN/Disco/riding club horse, and compare where they "should" be at various ages! (If that's possible.)

For example, the 6 yo champs are, what, 1.30? So you could say that a world beater should be jumping 1.30 by the time it's six?
Click to expand...

At 6 she was winning 6YO classes on the Sunshine Tour - and other 1.30s in the UK. She got to Grade B about £100 of Grade A, although £2,700 actual.

She was hammered - at 5 she was 4th in the under 16YO Final at Festival of Show jumping against Grade As - really Hammered - so by 9yo she had broken down. I've got her now and only jump amateur stuff on her, not really sure how big she would ever jump again. Saying that even with her totally knackered legs the dealer I bought her off was winning 1.20s on her, they didn't care that she was lame:mad:.

I think if a pro had owned her she probably would have been looked after a lot better and lasted a lot longer - so just jump the big classes that matter and not every single weekend.
 
dieseldog said:
She was hammered - at 5 she was 4th in the under 16YO Final at Festival of Show jumping against Grade As - really Hammered - so by 9yo she had broken down. I've got her now and only jump amateur stuff on her, not really sure how big she would ever jump again. Saying that even with her totally knackered legs the dealer I bought her off was winning 1.20s on her, they didn't care that she was lame:mad:.
.
Click to expand...
Sounds like my lad, glad you gave her a good home.
 
That does bring up some interesting related points, dd, which are pertinent to the OPs question. One would be is the fastest progression the best in the long run for a horse someone wants to keep for years.

Second would be, just because some horses can progress at such a rate, should others? People seem to forget the YH horses classes are TESTS for potential world class horses, not an optimum training program for all horses. And, as such, they aren't for all - or even most - horses in the first place. They certainly aren't meant to be educational for the average horse.

Thirdly, and this has been mentioned a few times, the rider and program play a HUGE part. Horses jumped sparingly on good footing, with good riding and a well thought out plan for progress will simply progress faster (given the ability, of course) and hold up longer. A horse with a top rider with lots of mounts will never have to jump "for the rider" at home, in warm ups etc. and will likely jump fewer jumps at home to get the same skills developed. Big American JR/YR/AA barns often keep "practice horses" so students can jump good sized jumps at home without taking jumps out of their top horses.

So it really is a piece of string question. And, as Juno pointed out, it depends a lot on how the horse shows, too. I've had some that were a bit green at home but kept it all together in the ring, others looked like stars at home but struggled with the demands of showing and couldn't be pushed while they were still learning the ropes, even if they were leaving the fences up.
 
totally depends upon the inidividual horse and rider... i'm an amateur but have only ever made it up to 1.05 bsja and this was over about 2 years! could jump 1.10s at home but the thought of doing a newcomers made me feel sick :eek:

my 5 year old starting jumping last summer (with me...so he has to put up with a numpty pilot :rolleyes:) at the same time as my trainer started a 5 year old...trainers horse now doing discos and newcomers wheras my lad has only done 1 90cm amateur class...partly this is down to her getting her horse out more...but also because she doesn't get nervous and i do and obviously she is much more accurate and talented than me...

in answer to your ? OP i would be very impressed if an amateur and green horse started doing newcomers after only 3 months :)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top