How to get a horse's head up when on the lunge.

[Olderrider]

Help! I'm desperately trying to get my mare fitter, so upping the work and lungeing her on days she isn't ridden. Big problem - she goes round with her head in the sand, and getting any sort of impulsion is pretty much impossible! I think I end up more exercised than her!

 

[Auslander]

I love it when mine lunge with their heads down - it stretches them far better than stumbling round with their heads in the air. I really wouldn't worry about that, and focus on getting her more forward. Do you lunge with a whip? Flick her just below the hocks to encourage her to move smartly forward, and don't give up. Keep sessions short and snappy - 10 minutes on the lunge going forward is better than half an hour slopping around not going anywhere!

 

[Olderrider]

Will certainly give it a go - I do use a whip, but mostly she's pretty oblivious to it. She is quite lazy, which is why the change of diet, vit. mineral supplement etc. Probably my technique at fault, or do you think she might be better if I worked her in the field?

 

[HeresHoping]

Please don't ask her to bring her head up. As Auslander says, that's what you're trying to achieve.

I have a naughty one, though, who is quite lazy on the lunge and flicking his hocks just causes an adverse reaction (bum swinging, hooves at you and tanking if you inadvertently make contact) so I have found that really getting behind the shoulder and saying 'trot, trot, trot' to the rhythm and tempo at which you wish to go helps. Or clicking. And the odd whip crack - but only occasionally.

 

[Hippona]

Agree....the day my giraffe/Arab started stretching down I nearly wept with joy....

 

[Olderrider]

Certainly not naughty - simply takes a huge amount of effort, including verbal, to actually get much in the way of enthusiasm from her. Even 10 mins seems a very long time. I have to say that she can move when inclined, quite well in fact, but I really want to start doing more in the school, both on the lunge and ridden as she is not great with big tractors, but she is really, really, hard work, and also a true cob so lots to get the leg round.

 

[Spring Feather]

Lol you have a 'problem' that almost everyone else is trying to actually have their horse do Although I very rarely lunge, I do occasionally free school in the round pen and long and low is desired.

 

[Olderrider]

Nose literally brushing the surface? Right, if that's fine, then hopefully if I can get her fitter I should get a bit of activity going on too so will persevere.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

It sounds to me as if your mare is very much on the forehand and that is what you are trying to correct. You will need to do lots of correct ridden work in order to develop the muscles to get her off the forehand before she is likely to work from behind on the lunge.

 

[Olderrider]

You are absolutely right there. She is fine out hacking, as she is more stimulated, but it's almost an evasion when trying to school her. Poles etc do brighten things up a bit, but she quickly drops back on her forehand. Maintaining a canter is VERY hard work, although the transition is really good.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

You are absolutely right there. She is fine out hacking, as she is more stimulated, but it's almost an evasion when trying to school her. Poles etc do brighten things up a bit, but she quickly drops back on her forehand. Maintaining a canter is VERY hard work, although the transition is really good.

I'm not really a fan of gadgets but I wonder if something designed to get their backends under them while lunging might be what you are looking for.

 

[MotherOfChickens]

transitions will help her, although don't 'over drill' her. Also, if you don't already, lunge all round the school and send her forward on the long side, circles at the ends etc-mix it up a bit. Why not try a tail bandage around her back end, attached to a roller-an oldie but a goodie!

 

[Olderrider]

I do try and avoid small circles by moving round the school and doing straight lines as well (stops me getting bored too). Tail bandage is a new one, would it not pull the roller backwards? I'm also not a lover of gadgets, but feel I might need to resort to something, just no idea what as most are for bring the head down and in. Definitely need to encourage the hind end to be more active though but I just get so little reaction to voice or lunge whip.

 

[MotherOfChickens]

tail bandage shouldn't be tight-see this pic for an idea (I know nothing about this site-random google). the bandage doesn't do anything other than make her aware of her backend. If you don't like gadgets, use transitions but you'll have to get her off your voice. If you can long rein/double lunge then one/two steps of rein back into trot/canter (for a few strides) will get her bum under her. Try using your lunge whip every stride (not on her obviously) as the inside hind leg goes forwards.

http://retrainingdesertsea.files.wordpress.com/2012/10/dsc00505.jpg

although I would have the bandage lower on the roller than this.

How often are you lunging her and whats her level of fitness and age etc? its quite hard work for them.

 

[oldie48]

Nose literally brushing the surface? Right, if that's fine, then hopefully if I can get her fitter I should get a bit of activity going on too so will persevere.

Well, i'm no expert but I think there's long and low but with shoulders up stretching the topline and working the back muscles and there's on the forehand with the back end "freewheeling" that doesn't really do much at all. I'm guessing you might be getting the latter? i think lungeing is quite a skill and if you can find a good trainer to give you a lesson, it's money well spent as it's a useful tool if used well. Frankly, I've seen too many horses spinning around on the end of a lunge line that is doing nothing for either their fitness or their way of going.

 

[Olderrider]

I'm pretty sure you're right Oldie-48. I think I could also do with a different lunge whip as mine seems very heavy/badly balanced which doesn't help me. I'm only lungeing about 2/3 times a week max., she's 13 and in regular light work, but I know she needs to lose some weight and am working on that. I'm starting on Allen & Page's Slim & Healthy plus Vitamin and Mineral supplement due to the low rate of hard feed. I've started keeping her in at night with soaked hay, and out in the day with restricted grazing. I'm hoping a bit of weight loss will help boost the energy level.
I'll certainly book a lunge lesson as suggested.

 

[Baydame]

It sounds to me as if your mare is very much on the forehand and that is what you are trying to correct. You will need to do lots of correct ridden work in order to develop the muscles to get her off the forehand before she is likely to work from behind on the lunge.

If you're looking to help her lose weight maybe start doing trot sets. You can build up how long you go for and you'll be able to work a at keeping her off her forehand.

 

[Olderrider]

I've not heard of trot sets so can you please explain to me?

 

[Baydame]

Trot sets are basically interval training. Trot for so many minutes. Walk break for a minute. Then redo for a second 'set'. You can up trot time and/or number of sets as fitness improves. You can also add in a canter set. It's what we use to get our eventers fit. The two I took out yesterday are in decent shape and we did 20 min trot with a 2 min walk. Did two sets of that with each horse. Start out with what you're comfortable with and work up to more.
Walk breaks usually only 1-2min until cool out.

Eta I like to do the trot sets along a nice trail or the road if not paved or a wide shoulder. Hills are even better! Not something to be done in a school

 

[JillA]

The problem with horses who are lazy (or in other works ignore your cue to get more impulsion) is that they very effectively teach you to nag with legs or whip and the more you nag the more meaningless your aids become. Trust me, I have one, and it takes quite an effort of will not to keep on at him.
What I do now is set him off in a pace (ridden usually, he is very good on the lunge) and wait. The instant he slows down to what I don't think is acceptable (what Mark Rashid refers to as asking if he can stop) he gets more than just a leg aid, he gets his bottom smacked lol - one sharp tap behind my leg. Not over used - that can become desensitised just as your leg aid can. He is learning not to ask, and to carry the pace until I ask for a downward transition. May not be the case with yours but worth thinking about - as soon as you get her to carry the pace consistently, then you can begin to ask for more impulsion at times.

 

[Goldenstar]

Carrying the head low does nothing except wear the fore leg out on the lunge if the horse is on it's forehand not moving forwards with impulsion and engaged.
I would try the tail bandage round the bum it worked very well on some horses always use something as a Brest girth from the roller ,( I use a lead rope ) just in case the roller slips back .
Use poles on the ground , trotting ones and single ones and lots of transitions .

 

[Olderrider]

Thanks everyone, you've all been really helpful and given me loads of ideas to work on.

 

[Fides]

Actually I don't think it's the problem with the forehand.

Why ?

 

[mandwhy]

Long and low is great, but your mare sounds just like mine in that she is simply lazy and on the forehand not pushing from behind (if she did she'd end up on her face!). I have the added issue that I have to lunge on grass and of course she thinks we're going for a picnic ;-) I use loose side reins just so that she can't quite do that.

I also find that if you have anywhere other than home like a field or even at a show, you get much better work because it is a more stimulating environment. I don't lunge mine at home much as I have found a wide enough bit of land that is much better, and also a clearing in the woods near me, lunging on the go! As she doesn't much like leaving her friends, it is a great way of channeling that nervous energy into work

At home you could literally poke my mare in the eye with a lunge whip or wrap it round her legs, if she's not in the mood she simply doesn't care, it's more about being disciplined in your body language and not allowing them to turn in etc. Mine rears a little sometimes and turns in, but I've learnt to stand my ground.

 

[Olderrider]

Snap! We have a pair!