how to get lazy lesson horse more forward

[BlueThePiebald]

Blue is extremely lazy, and I need tips from other riders with lazy cobs! I have:
Checked saddle fit, saddle is a little low at the front but the instructor has a riser pad to sort that out
Hes wide, but not ridiculously over weight,maybe 2/3kg over
He gets put out to the field every evening during summer, and gets 3 days off every week, so its not like he is depressed with being stabled 24/7
He is fed one haynet every evening to last him all night/early morning, along with a bucket of meal (plus mints/sugar from.me XD)

So, any tips to make him.more forward? Im just wondering coz I may be rising him.on a show in October but unless he is faster I may ride trooper in the high class and blue in the low one

 

[Lintel]

Interesting post.. To be honest if he isn't your horse and you are not consistently riding him(eg others also riding him) there's not alot of point as imo consistency is key. The only thing I could suggest is perhaps making sure you are not "kickkickkickkicking" as we all can do it! And instead one kick and if there is no reaction a smack.
Again though he is a riding school pony he may well be dead to all aids unfortunately alot of them are, all the best for your show

 

[Clare85]

I find that many horses who are 'lazy' are actually a bit bored. When I was training towards my Stage 3 a couple of years ago at a riding school, many of the horses were pretty sour in the school and just could not be bothered. The key is to wake then up and give them something to concentrate on - take them off of auopilot.

I find lots of upwards and downwards transitions in quick succession (five or six strides at each gait before chabnging up or down) to really get them on the aids and not too much repetitive work. Keep them thinking and listening to you by making their lives a bit more interesting. I also don't like to school mine in the school too often, I prefer hacking and the horses do mostv of the time and there's no reason you can't school whilst out and about.

Good luck at the show

 

[Moomin1]

Your instructor should be addressing the issue. If an instructor is a good one, you shouldn't need to be doing the things you say you have done and asking advice on a matter like this on a forum.

 

[suffolkmare]

Vary his work routine...take him somewhere new/different terrain...try a sponsored/pleasure ride? That might perk him up a bit. Although I'm not sure if you mean he's a school horse and is always lazy or is yours and only lazy in lessons? Best of luck

 

[NCIS]

i had an ex riding school horse that was totally switched off in the riding school. He was so bored, he used to just go round in circles. When I got him, he used to nap like mad, wouldn't leave the yard by himself etc... after a few weeks, he totally changed, was interested in being ridden again, and started to love jumping again. Boredom makes them lazy, keep it interesting for him and you should see a different horse. x

 

[Arzada]

He gets put out to the field every evening during summer, and gets 3 days off every week, so its not like he is depressed with being stabled 24/7

It sounds like he is bored/depressed in the school. A bit like me sitting through meetings! What else do you do with him other than schooling?

 

[Mahoganybay]

The best thing you can teach your horse is that legs don’t just mean “Go”. You shouldn’t have to kick for every stride. He should continue at the same speed until you tell him otherwise. It’s easy to get into a habit of kicking every stride but eventually your horse becomes dead to it.
Become a lazy rider. Teach your horse to go forward from the slightest of squeezes. You’ll need to be consistent and patient but it will be worth it in the end.
Warm up as usual but be prepared to spend the rest of the session in walk. Once he’s picked it up you’ll find the other paces come a lot easier but trot before the penny’s dropped and you’ll be wasting your time and energy.
Start by riding large and expecting him to walk from one marker to the next without you having to kick. At each marker give him a squeeze but if he slows down before because you’re not kicking then you need to use your whip.
When you use a whip don’t dither. Use it and mean it. It’s better to use it once and get a reaction than have to use it five or six times and get half the response. Riders often feel guilty about using a whip but never worry about banging at their horses sides with their heels. Which would you prefer?
You may find initially that you have to tap him every few strides but if you’re consistent he’ll soon learn and you’ll find you’re able to get further and further without using your leg.
Your aim is to increase the distance you can go without having to kick on. All horses can learn to do this in all three paces. Their riders just have to believe it too.

Advise from a Facebook Group I belong too, I am going to be trying it today with my lazy boy.

 

[Uliy]

Along with everyone else's great advice, a tip I have from a lazy horse we have is to give him a pat and say "good boy!" when he does go forward. It might be me putting human emotions on a horse, but after everyone else has sat there and kicked and smacked, I think it's much nicer to reward her (in my case) for moving forward. It does seem to make her more eager to move! Using your voice can also help, try and keep his attention on you and what you're asking for, rather than letting him drift off into auto-pilot.

Definitely also try to engage his brain. It's easy to get stuck just trotting around the school and maybe doing a few circles, so make sure you're doing serpentines, changes of rein etc just to make it a bit more interesting! Good luck with the show

 

[Sophiecollins11]

I brought my horse out of a riding school and kept him as a livery in the school for a while and I found nothing worked until I moved yards! He was simply bored of the school as out hacking and competing he was fine it used to frustrate me so much but it's hard to change anything when the horse isn't yours... I would say just lots of transitions and variety in your schooling he might hot up at the show anyways? X

 

[Woolly Hat n Wellies]

My Billy used to be totally numb (although to 'stop' as well as 'go'! - and turn, move over, and seriously Billy stop rubbing your head on me before I end up on my ar$e!)

I agree with a lot of the posters above. Billy really needed consistency from his rider, and he needed his brain to be kept busy. My instructor started me on the floor, tapping with the stick where my leg would go when mounted. I had to start with a very light tap and take it harder (a fairly quick escalation) until he stepped forward. The crucial thing is timing. As soon as he moves, STOP tapping, walk him on a little, stop, tap again. Don't pull him forwards, my instructor used to physically hold my hand just behind his chin, so that he could feel a contact as though he had a rider. I felt awful smacking him at first (he was sensitive as a breeze block) but with getting the timing right, he very quickly learned that all he had to do to stop it was step forwards, and once he'd got that he was off from the initial light tap. My instructor said that although the hard taps WERE hard, it's because his 'motivation point' to move forward was so high. Going quickly from a tiny tap to 'now I'm motivated to move' starts to lower the point at which the motivation to move forward outweighs the motivation to stand like a lemon. In the long run, it's kinder to be hard on him a few times in order to never have to do it again, than to nag and flap and whack forevermore. I still felt rotten, but now he moves off from a tiny touch, or even from my voice alone, and I think both of us enjoy our time together more, because I'm less faffy, and he knows exactly what I'm asking for.

Once I got him listening and reacting on the floor, it was easy to replicate on top. One touch from my legs, and then start tapping, escalating until he moved, and then STOP immediately. I still use this when we're out, if he's busy looking at everything and not paying attention, even though we don't usually need to use it at home any more.

Then, once moving off, as other posters have said, loads of transitions, rein changes, try to get the slowest trot you can for a few strides without breaking into walk, and then push on again. When I very first started riding Billy, he couldn't trot a circle on the grass without attempting to bog off sideways (after I'd struggled to get him moving to leave the yard!). I'm sure he' previously been bored rigid by trotting endless circles, and he just point blank refused to cooperate. I fixed it by spending weeks not doing a whole circle without changing something, and he eventually realised it wasn't boring, and there was plenty to keep his mind occupied just doing the things I asked without thinking for himself as well.

If it helps, Billy wasn't mine when I started schooling him either. Although I bought him in November, he was shared and then sort of part-loaned for quite some time before that, so his owner and her daughter were riding him as well, one hauling him to a halt if he so much as farted, and one galloping him everywhere and then socking him in the gob because he wouldn't stop. Billy was rude, Billy was bargey, Billy was lazy, Billy was strong, Billy wouldn't listen, Billy was a bad horse, and everything was Billy's fault. I think he's come a pretty long way since then.

Sorry for the essay. If you made it this far you should probably have read the more concise and to-the-point responses from other posters instead! I hope you have a lovely time at the show regardless of which horse you ride.

 

[BlueThePiebald]

It sounds like he is bored/depressed in the school. A bit like me sitting through meetings! What else do you do with him other than schooling?

We do different things really! We don't hack much during the winter, but we go for gallops during the summer, jump small courses, walk,trot,canter circles, we jump every session- sometimes big sometimes small, lots of rein changes, started dong lots of transition work and he always go reward! Also, he finds it enjoyable to try and Buck me off after big jumps 😂

 

[BlueThePiebald]

My Billy used to be totally numb (although to 'stop' as well as 'go'! - and turn, move over, and seriously Billy stop rubbing your head on me before I end up on my ar$e!)

I agree with a lot of the posters above. Billy really needed consistency from his rider, and he needed his brain to be kept busy. My instructor started me on the floor, tapping with the stick where my leg would go when mounted. I had to start with a very light tap and take it harder (a fairly quick escalation) until he stepped forward. The crucial thing is timing. As soon as he moves, STOP tapping, walk him on a little, stop, tap again. Don't pull him forwards, my instructor used to physically hold my hand just behind his chin, so that he could feel a contact as though he had a rider. I felt awful smacking him at first (he was sensitive as a breeze block) but with getting the timing right, he very quickly learned that all he had to do to stop it was step forwards, and once he'd got that he was off from the initial light tap. My instructor said that although the hard taps WERE hard, it's because his 'motivation point' to move forward was so high. Going quickly from a tiny tap to 'now I'm motivated to move' starts to lower the point at which the motivation to move forward outweighs the motivation to stand like a lemon. In the long run, it's kinder to be hard on him a few times in order to never have to do it again, than to nag and flap and whack forevermore. I still felt rotten, but now he moves off from a tiny touch, or even from my voice alone, and I think both of us enjoy our time together more, because I'm less faffy, and he knows exactly what I'm asking for.

Once I got him listening and reacting on the floor, it was easy to replicate on top. One touch from my legs, and then start tapping, escalating until he moved, and then STOP immediately. I still use this when we're out, if he's busy looking at everything and not paying attention, even though we don't usually need to use it at home any more.

Then, once moving off, as other posters have said, loads of transitions, rein changes, try to get the slowest trot you can for a few strides without breaking into walk, and then push on again. When I very first started riding Billy, he couldn't trot a circle on the grass without attempting to bog off sideways (after I'd struggled to get him moving to leave the yard!). I'm sure he' previously been bored rigid by trotting endless circles, and he just point blank refused to cooperate. I fixed it by spending weeks not doing a whole circle without changing something, and he eventually realised it wasn't boring, and there was plenty to keep his mind occupied just doing the things I asked without thinking for himself as well.

If it helps, Billy wasn't mine when I started schooling him either. Although I bought him in November, he was shared and then sort of part-loaned for quite some time before that, so his owner and her daughter were riding him as well, one hauling him to a halt if he so much as farted, and one galloping him everywhere and then socking him in the gob because he wouldn't stop. Billy was rude, Billy was bargey, Billy was lazy, Billy was strong, Billy wouldn't listen, Billy was a bad horse, and everything was Billy's fault. I think he's come a pretty long way since then.

Sorry for the essay. If you made it this far you should probably have read the more concise and to-the-point responses from other posters instead! I hope you have a lovely time at the show regardless of which horse you ride.

Some good advice on there! Yes, I rode him in the pairs with my friend and came second last but oh well lol. He actually did halt to canter for me with a small nudge... Cheeky cob lol just goes forward when he feels like it! Jumped a 13.1hh pony in the 80cm and he jumped like a dream, came 5th out of 20 or so riders

 

[BlueThePiebald]

I brought my horse out of a riding school and kept him as a livery in the school for a while and I found nothing worked until I moved yards! He was simply bored of the school as out hacking and competing he was fine it used to frustrate me so much but it's hard to change anything when the horse isn't yours... I would say just lots of transitions and variety in your schooling he might hot up at the show anyways? X

He was hyper at the show! Cheeky Cob haha 😂

 

[gnubee]

Before I got my own I had a bit of a reputation for getting the slow horses going properly at the various schools I was at, so did a lot of it. One of the big things I noticed was riding school riders rarely carry a schooling whip, so if that is the case and you have one you instantly have an aid that everyone else is not making him dead to. I also like a schooling whip for the variety of ways you can use it. In addition to the proper tap behind the leg, you can swoosh it through the air to make a loud sound, rustle it in tree leaves or tap along the fence posts, or hold it out to the side a bit and wobble it in the horses eyeline. No one else ever does these things, and IME riding school horses that can ignore great pony club kicks will often still be quite reactive to new sights and sounds. I also think that to really get them going well long term you have to really like the horse and be emotionally connected to the point where you can share an idea of what is fun- for ages I couldn't understand why I could jump the little horse that hated it and win races on him when others struggled to get him to trot, but found it impossible to get him to join in drill riding. Then I realised I find drill riding boring and my attitude had gone from 'let's do this together, it's fun and we can win and as soon as we are finished I will give you gig pats and a cookie and I will do whatever it takes to get you round this course' to 'meg, drill riding, hope this is over soon and we can do domething fun. Come ooon, why are you being do horridly difficult today!'

Beyond this, the answer to this question depends on whether the horse really is dead bored of the riding school environment and no one can move him, or if it's that you struggle. I had 2 that I never really cracked, both of which I saw instructors (very occasionally) ride beautifully. The first was a dressage horse and if you didn't ride it dressage style- into a rein contact with loads of impulsion- wasn't interested. My rein contact is ok but wasn't consistent enough to get that horse to come into an outline for me, and consequently it wouldn't go forwards for me. The instructor could run alongside doing the reins for me and I could feel the horse change. 2 lessons from that one - 1, a lot of slow horses still benefit greatly from a fair rein contact to build impulsion. Don't assume that because you can't kick forwards on a loose rein the horse won't go forwards if ridden more correctly. The second is to ask your instructor how they would ride in a situation and keep asking until you start to understand. Often they don't know what the magic trick to their riding is (especially in this case when the trick was basically just riding 'properly' sat in a perfect position and holding horse between hand and leg as they would on any horse).
The other I had mostly mastered except I couldn't get it into canter when we went out to jump a course. One day the instructor shouted that she would never go in if I didn't mean it. Confused me at the time cos I was exhausted and trying everything I could think of, but next time the instructor rode her I noticed she did just go in for her off a normal quiet canter aid. The key was that right from the point she got on, she made what she wanted happen straight away. It didn't take 3 kicks to get her into trot. She halted square in the jumping queue and didn't just dribble in on a loose rein. She might have used her stick the first time she asked for canter, but I don't recall she needed it again in the lesson.

I have seen a lot of very hard very sluggy school horses, but instructors don't buy ones that can't produce a reasonable ride for a skilled and determined rider.

 

[rachk89]

Transitions. I put my horse on a circle when he is lazy and do a quarter of the circle in walk followed by a quarter in trot the back to walk. I eventually up this to trotting the whole time except for halting at each quarter then trot on again. His reactions are getting better and better. You can do this around the whole school too just i use a circle for bending work too.

For the whole school at every corner have a downwards transition even if it's just a slower more collected walk/trot/canter. Even ask for more energy on the tiny straight bit at the short sides that really confuses them as they are rarely asked for that. My horse had a tantrum the first time as he didn't understand haha.

 

[[69117]]

Without knowing the horse I can't comment, but i am an instructor in a busy riding school, and we have a lot of horses who switch off when they are allowed to.

One horse in particular is incredibly backwards and stuffy in the school, unless he is ridden forwards and not allowed to get away with it. I have a client in my advanced group who gives him one good smack when she gets on, and then has a responsive and forward horse for the rest of the lesson. He will happily do a beautiful halt to canter, is quick off the leg with just a squeeze, and is lovely to ride. However, when someone less experienced gets on him and 'asks' him to go forward rather than 'telling' him, he takes complete advantage and just switches off. I've lost count of the amount of times I've jumped on horses in my lessons to prove to clients that they CAN go forward, you just have to ride them.

My advice would be to listen to your instructor. Maybe ask her to ride the horse in front of you so you can see how he goes for her and what she is doing differently. Good luck!