How to stop rein & leadrope chewing

[spacie1977]

Anyone got any pearls of wisdom on this? My horse has just turned 6yrs old and still has a major oral fixation. Anytime a lead rope or reins get anywhere near him he gets them in his mouth at lightening speed and has a good old chomp. His leather reins are completely mullered and I'm going through a new lead rope every week. I've tried spraying the lead rope with the same stuff I use to stop my dogs from chewing stuff but he's not at all fussed by the taste. I don't want to keep getting cross with him and giving him a smack on the chops to let go. Any suggestions? Is there a specific product I can use on leather an fabric that tastes really gross to horses? He's managed to get teeth marks on two nosebands now and I'm loathed to buy another whilst he's still unable to control his gnashers

 

[sarahann1]

Pass, my 20yr old still does it! Will be watching this with interest for suggestions

 

[flirtygerty]

Our TB loves to hold ropes etc in his mouth, but he doesn't chew them.
He held my lad for the vet the other day, I think it's a cute quirk of his, but like I say, he doesn't chew
Try topping and tailing a large pepper, thread rope through it, not sure it would be hot enough, same principle
on a smaller scale cured a pup of chewing phone lines on a daily basis, cover in popping candy, bubble wrap,
it shouldn't be too hard to cure

 

[Dry Rot]

English mustard.

 

[Alyth]

Crib stop or bitter aloes....

 

[L&M]

My youngster also likes chewing lead reins!

Easy fix was to buy a lead rein with a length of chain attached to the spring clip - I think mine is an Aerborn and not expensive. He tried to chew the chain once then gave up (although I did 'borrow' a solid rope one the other day and noticed he was happily munching on that again!)

 

[ellijay]

My friend had a pony that did this and we used a happy mouth bit on a headcollor that had bit attachments on it like the ones they use in TREC so whenever she was tied up she also had a bit in her mouth to chew on and after a few weeks she stopped as I think it broke the habit. This obviously won't work though if your horse puts the lead rope it their mouth with the bit already in!!!

 

[Brightbay]

The way to deal with it is the same as the way you deal with any unwanted behaviour. Decide what behaviour you do want, and reward it. Ignore the unwanted behaviour.

There are two challenges with rope chewing. (1) it seems to be a communication from the horse - mine does it when anxious about something or when his adrenalin levels go up, so it's self reinforcing and (2) you need to find something more rewarding than the chewing to reward the "not chewing"

I used standard treats. Randomly, a few times each day when leading, if the horse was walking nicely, head to front and not chewing, I would say "good boy" and feed a treat. You could also carry something "chewable" and offer it instead of the rope - mine learned to squeak a dog squeaky toy (this has freaked out a succession of vets, taken unawares by the EEEeeeeeEEEEEeeee noise when they least expect it ).

Punishing or coating rope in nasty stuff or using a chain will temporarily stop the chewing, but not do anything at all about the urge to chew. Rewarding "not chewing" will change the motivation - but it does take time. Using food also has the benefit of allowing the horse to chew (which seems to calm them down) and encouraging them to chew something that's not a leadrope or rein.

Mine did it a lot between 4 and 6 - I spent a month or so working on it and although he will still chew when worried about something, he never chews reins and it only happens about 2 or 3 times a year (dentist visits, for e.g.).

 

[mandwhy]

I agree with Brightbay about rewarding good behaviour, I think people often forget that standing doing nothing or walking alongside quietly are often the goals we need to reward!

I do think the chain thing helps though, it just makes it unappealing which helps. I used one of those web lead ropes with the chain about a foot long attached. It was for a 4yo TB who was just OBSESSED with chewing right through leadropes and also his reins including whilst being ridden! He would throw his head around to get hold of them and I was amazed how often he achieved it despite my best efforts. I didn't bother with leather reins (he especially loved to chew leather!), continental ones were good (I had plaited web type ones but he liked those as they were soft and probably nice to chew). He cribbed which I was not bothered by and was generally fixated with anything he could get in his mouth, was also very bad with nipping at one point. I just tried to combine rewarding him being good and sensible, with making the annoying thing a bit less fun to do (make the rope a chain, if he bit me get the elbow or a prickly brush, etc).

 

[DreamingIsBelieving]

There's a horse at my riding school who does this with her reins. Her reins have a length of metal chain which attaches from the bit rings to the rein. Only about 15-20cm long, fine link, clips onto bit at one end; there's a ring at the other end that you attach reins to. It works - she doesn't like chewing the metal. They look that they were made for that purpose, but I've never seen anything like that for sale.

 

[spacie1977]

I do think the chain thing helps though, it just makes it unappealing which helps. I used one of those web lead ropes with the chain about a foot long attached. It was for a 4yo TB who was just OBSESSED with chewing right through leadropes and also his reins including whilst being ridden! He would throw his head around to get hold of them and I was amazed how often he achieved it despite my best efforts.

I’ve tried using a lead rope with chain and that works at stopping me having to spend so much £ on replacing lead ropes. He doesn’t chew it, but does still tend to hold it in his mouth so it's not really breaking the habit. It just means I don't have to watch him so closely when he's tied on the yard as he won't be chewing through it and wandering off in search of food. A hay net distracts him for a while but again, it's just a temporary distraction and not actually stopping him from wanting to chew

He's also a pickle when I'm on him and we're standing still for a while. He'll grab the reins and he's so blooming big it's hard to lean forward far enough to yank them back out his mouth. I use the end of the whip to hook it out. Something some horses might be worried about but he's not at all bothered lol

 

[spacie1977]

I agree with Brightbay and Mandwhy that he needs to be rewarded for good behaviour rather than punished for bad, and treats definitely have worked with a lot of things; when I first got him he was testing the boundaries; barging, refusing to pick up his feet etc. and he was a complete nightmare with biting. He was also quite head shy which made me think he must have been smacked a lot on the face for his rein chewing. As he nipped so much his previous owner said I shouldn’t give him treats as it is likely to encourage the biting even more. However, after a couple months of more mickey taking, I started to give him treats when greeting him or when he was being good. He’s now perfectly behaved and happy for me to wipe his eyes, scratch his ears and rub his brow without shying. It’s just the chewing I don’t seem to be able to stop. It’s not anxiety as he’s a very chilled boy. I think it’s just become a habit. Every time I go to put his head collar on he'll happily put his head down for me to slip it on but then immediately grabs the lead rope, and as soon as I’ve taken the reins over his head to lead him he’ll grab for those. So I need to find a way of breaking the habit. Feeding treats isn’t going to work if he’s having a chew on his lead rope whilst tied up alone on the yard. I think flirtygerty might have a good idea there; I may try threading chilli’s on his reins or rub in some cayenne pepper and Vaseline. Temporarily stopping him with something gross on the rope or reins will hopefully break the habit for long enough to forget to go back to it and I can continue with the positive reinforcements with treats and praise. I’ve read somewhere someone tried washing up liquid mixed with cayenne pepper. I don’t know if that worked but doubt the washing up liquid would be very good for his leather reins

 

[Dry Rot]

If a horse chews something that tastes bad, it tends not to do it again. That is not punishment. It is doing something it finds unrewarding.

I'm curious about rewarding the good behaviour though. Do you feed a steady trickle of treats all the time the horse is NOT chewing the lead rope?

 

[spacie1977]

Lol I'd have a very fat and spoilt horse if it was a constant trickle of treats. But when I do treat him I use the Dodson & Horrell equi-bites as they're meant to have vitamins in them. The feeding guidelines say he can have up to 10 a day but he'll only have a few, and occasionally a polo or two. I can see how giving a treat whilst walking to and from the field can help keep him distracted from chewing and focussed on me/not stopping to eat grass, but giving him a treat every time he's not chewing would be bonkers. How would he know what he's getting a treat for?

 

[mandwhy]

Haha from your last post it sounds like the same horse who would also be just turned 6 (he was dark bay no white and 16.3ish just in case!)

A lot of people say not to treat a horse that bites, I just think horses need to know that standing being quiet is generally good behaviour to be rewarded, like I don't treat a horse who paws or nudges or nips me for them, but motivating them to behave can reap rewards!


E.g. if grooming and they are being chilled and good I would periodically say 'good boy' and give a fuss, with random treats decreasing in frequency depending on what you are focusing on. I start off giving them occasional treats while being groomed or standing tied and if they start turning to nudge me I just gently push their head away, or if they turn to nip they'll meet my elbow and if they really go for it they will get shouted at too!

I don't like the idea of chains on the reins, sounds a bit clunky! I remember the reaching to get the reins out of his mouth though haha, I must admit I did put a flash on a couple of times to see if he would stop but it just drove him crazy trying to grab those reins, he was really obsessed and threw his head around to get them, he was ok once he started working on a contact a bit more and concentrating!

 

[fburton]

If a horse chews something that tastes bad, it tends not to do it again. That is not punishment. It is doing something it finds unrewarding.

It is positive punishment in the behavioural sense.

 

[Alyth]

If a horse chews something that tastes bad, it tends not to do it again. That is not punishment. It is doing something it finds unrewarding.

I'm curious about rewarding the good behaviour though. Do you feed a steady trickle of treats all the time the horse is NOT chewing the lead rope?

So were the earlier suggestions of mustard/crib stop/bitter aloes tried? Any results??

 

[fburton]

Using the technique described in my post in the link below to stop leadrope chewing in my presence. It works by making the act of chewing unpleasant enough that the horse decides it's not worth it, without the unwanted side-effects that retributive punishment (such as smacking) from the handler can create.

One advantage of this technique over use of foul tastes is that the unpleasantness comes the instant the horse goes to chew, rather than a little time after chewing has started, so the association between chewing and the consequence is made quicker and more strongly. The unpleasantness also goes away quicker when the horse stops trying to chew. Also, it doesn't need any pre-preparation, so can be applied anywhere and at any time.

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=587030&page=4

Obviously one does need to be there, but it still covers a lot of typical cases, such as leading or tying up in the stable for grooming (although the latter requires vigilance and dexterity initially).

 

[Equilibrium Ireland]

I've only had one horse with an oral fixation. Before she was ever bridled I hung a big thick braided rope from her stable door to use at her own free will. By the time she was 3 she had gotten over it. She may occassionally do it on a rope if bored. Like standing for trim. I don't know if that's a right or wrong thing but it's just how I dealt with it. Free time do what you want. But mostly she would live out as a youngster. It was just there the odd time she came in.

Rope chewing is not dangerous really but I'm sure we all know what can happen with a rein or chain in the mouth as it can go pear shaped if pressure is applied while in mouth. Have seen a chain nearly cut a tongue in 2 and horses flip with rider on board when rein got stuck in mouth and pressure applied at the exact wrong time. I couldn't do the treat thing with my former rope chewer as she'd just try and shake me down constantly. But if it works go for it.

Terri

 

[spacie1977]

Haha from your last post it sounds like the same horse who would also be just turned 6 (he was dark bay no white and 16.3ish just in case!) ...

E.g. if grooming and they are being chilled and good I would periodically say 'good boy' and give a fuss, with random treats decreasing in frequency depending on what you are focusing on. I start off giving them occasional treats while being groomed or standing tied and if they start turning to nudge me I just gently push their head away, or if they turn to nip they'll meet my elbow and if they really go for it they will get shouted at too!

Hopefully I'm on the right track then as I'm doing the same And nope not the same horse. Mine is a ginger giant of 17.2h - hence the reason why I'm so adamant to quickly put a stop to any cheek; he's way too big to let get away with any naughty habits.

So were the earlier suggestions of mustard/crib stop/bitter aloes tried? Any results??

Not tried it yet - he had a nasty fall so has been on box rest, and moved to new livery on Monday so I thought I'd give him a couple days to settle in first before riding again. But will keep you updated on what (if anything) works. I'm not holding my breath over whether any nasty flavours work though as he's quite happy to chew on wood covered in creasote(!)

 

[Alyth]

Using the technique described in my post in the link below to stop leadrope chewing in my presence. It works by making the act of chewing unpleasant enough that the horse decides it's not worth it, without the unwanted side-effects that retributive punishment (such as smacking) from the handler can create.

One advantage of this technique over use of foul tastes is that the unpleasantness comes the instant the horse goes to chew, rather than a little time after chewing has started, so the association between chewing and the consequence is made quicker and more strongly. The unpleasantness also goes away quicker when the horse stops trying to chew. Also, it doesn't need any pre-preparation, so can be applied anywhere and at any time.

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=587030&page=4

Obviously one does need to be there, but it still covers a lot of typical cases, such as leading or tying up in the stable for grooming (although the latter requires vigilance and dexterity initially).

Which post are you referring to? None seem relevant to me!!

 

[hippo-horse]

My mare is a rope chewer. I have had her for a long time, she no longer chews through her ropes, just pulls them in her mouth,bites down, has a suck and then spits it out.It seems to be a comfort thing now. It is a huge improvement on the rope destroying beast she used to be! For a while I tried to stop her, the most effective thing was a rope I had that had a plastic sleeve near the clip, like the ones that you get on some fillet strings. She bit down on it a few times then gave up. That rope snapped eventually, but she no longer destroys ropes so I'm counting that as a win! She didn't chew her tack while I was on top, but I still don't leave anything in chewing range when she is loose, just in case .

 

[fburton]

Which post are you referring to? None seem relevant to me!!

The one at the top of the page. What applies to clothing applies equally well to the leadrope.

 

[Countrychic]

I can't find it either?

 

[fburton]

Hmm, that's odd! You can't see my post that starts with "I'm going to be lazy and paste... Concerning the issue of general mouthiness and tendency to chew on hands and clothing..."?

 

[Garnet]

Hmm, that's odd! You can't see my post that starts with "I'm going to be lazy and paste... Concerning the issue of general mouthiness and tendency to chew on hands and clothing..."?

I can't find it either! The link you have given takes me to page 4 of a 57-page thread, and I've checked page 3 and page 5, so give us a clue!

 

[Alyth]

The link goes to the thread about smacking your horse...can't see anything about chewing clothing!!

 

[babymare]

The big lad as learnt this because others found it funny (my exs horse that i help look after) but to me its rude and dangerous. he knows me so well that a stern "ha ha ha" gets him to drop rope and look sheepish but both him and my lass know ha ha ha means"you are stepping over boundaries so think"lol god knows why as never have shouted or hit either in 7 years

 

[fburton]

The link goes to the thread about smacking your horse...can't see anything about chewing clothing!!

Not sure why you can't see the post. I just wanted to save repeating myself by giving a link, but I'll cut and paste. I've added some notes relevant to leadrope chewing in square brackets.

Concerning the issue of general mouthiness and tendency to chew on hands and clothing, as is common in colts. It isn't usually aggressive -- at least not initially -- and is in contrast to truly aggressive biting in which the horse strikes, teeth bared, ears back.

[The horse doesn't distinguish between chewing on clothing or on leadropes. They get oral satisfaction from both. Neither is it aggressive at all - they just want something to chew on. The approach taken here is to discourage unwanted actions and reward alternative behaviours incompatible with the unwanted ones. This post describes only the discouraging aspect. It can be used on its own, i.e. without rewards, very effectively.]

For nibbling, pinching the upper lip works quite well, especially with foals. It must be perceived as a direct result of lips/teeth contact with skin, so it is best to do it instantly, silently and without fuss. Maintaining the pinch for a second or two while the foal recoils seems to work better. It shouldn't be painful, just a bit uncomfortable.

[I don't do this any more because the technique below works better, I have found.]

However, the technique I find most effective, especially with older horses, is to let him start to take my hand into his mouth, then instantly stick a knuckle into his soft palate causing him to try and spit my hand out. One has to be prepared for the few horses that either raise their heads up beyond arm's reach (it helps to keep everything calm and matter-of-fact - but one would be doing that anyway, no?) or that find unexpectedly pointy objects palatable! In my experience, these cases are extremely rare - almost all horses respond in exactly the same way.

Obviously, one should always have a quick escape route for your fingers, using the gap behind the incisors. Very small pony mouths or the presence of tushes demand a bit more caution. Alternatively you can poke the palate with a finger, palm turned upwards. I try to keep my hand in the horse's mouth for a couple of seconds while he tries to spit it out/get rid of it with his tongue. You don't want to hurt or injure him; you just want him to really dislike the sensation.

[For foals, who have small mouths, the finger variant is neater.]

With deft movement you can intercept nibbles elsewhere (e.g. on your clothing) in such a way that the horse comes to realize that it is unpleasant and not worth nibbling anywhere on your person. It's kind of hard to describe the exact moves and timing in words - showing a video clip would be better!

[It can be used equally well with leadropes as with clothing. In some ways it is easier because you don't have to be quite as agile in reaching the horse's mouth at the instant the horse goes to nibble.]

I think it is crucial that your response to nibbling is perceived as a consequence of his own action and NOT as a reprimand. At least, it will be more effective that way as you will avoid it being taken as an act of aggression which could escalate to "dominance games". I firmly believe those are to be avoided at all cost. Sometimes one can get away with being aggressive, but the cumulative effect in any horse is an erosion of trust and cultivation of resentment. However, with stallions, the changes in attitude caused by repeated aggressive reprimanding are more likely to surface in overtly aggressive behaviour on their part.

Please note that I am not arguing against use of punishment at all. However, I am pointing out that the way punishment is administered (and with what intent) matters a great deal. To reiterate: from the horse's point of view, nasty things shouldn't come from you the person. Rather, they should follow directly from specific actions or behaviours.

[I use the word "punishment" because that's what the behavioural definitions says it is, even though many people would associate the word with a person or other horse delivering a very visible physical reprimand. If a horse chews a leadrope with bitter aloes on it and this causes the chewing to stop because of its unpleasantness to the horse, that would also be punishment in the behavioural sense, even though the unpleasant response is coming from a chemical rather than the handler. In any case, the punishment here is very mild.]

Two or three repeats in a couple of sessions is usually effective to extinguish the nibbling [or leadrope chewing] behaviour completely and permanently. If you then offer your hand up to his mouth, you will see the horse thinking about taking it, as he would have done before, and then deciding to keep his mouth firmly shut!

[Actually, a few more repeats may be necessary when discouraging chewing on leadropes, I imagine because the habit is often more deeply ingrained by the time we decide to do something about it. Chewing on people is less well tolerated!]

With this method I have taught many foals and young colts not to nip. I've also used it successfully with a few problem stallions who had their mouthiness turned into more serious nipping by badly administered punishment (which turned it into a pernicious "game"). Success rate has been 100%; injury rate 0% (in over 20 years of using this method).

[Those statistics continue to be true.]

Despite what you may now be thinking, I am very safety conscious. Actually, going into a horses mouth isn't a big deal is it? I am sure many of you have done it before - e.g. when opening a horse's mouth to put a bridle on. And it's not like you have to do it very often - maybe half a dozen times per horse in total.

Finally, it is an effective alternative to smacking, and avoids some of smacking's potential downsides.

In summary, the palate-poking method:

- doesn't involve hitting or scolding the horse
- doesn't hurt the horse
- is 100% effective (so far, in my experience)
- fits seemlessly with and doesn't distract from whatever else you may be doing with the horse
- needs very few repetitions
- doesn't create any bad feelings towards the handler

I hope this has contributed something useful to the discussion.

 

[HBrae2]

Thanks fburton. Really keen to try this with my chewing obsessed 5yr old. Not entirely sure how you do it when they pick up a rope though? How do you get your hand in their mouth? Can you come and do demos lol