How would you reschool a strong horse?

[Jambarissa]

Said I'd ride my friends Connie when she had her baby. First ride today and my god she's strong. It was thoroughly unpleasant and I felt like I was holding her mouth with nearly all my strength.

She goes nicely, well balanced at all places and through transitions but I'd say the amount of pressure I had on the reins is equivalent to a tug of war with an adult.

Tried riding from my seat but that just seemed to make her stride out more.

I can't really say I won't do it now so I'm on her at least 2 times a week for the next few months. I can grit my teeth and manage but is there anything I can do to correct this a little?

 

[blitznbobs]

Every time she leans drop her on her nose . .. or lateral flexing depending on how they are leaning

 

[hock]

So I’d call this leaning and for me I’d be back to basics in walk and keep the bit one sided with your contact as soon as you feel the lean and lots of riding forward out of the natural rythmn until they learn to carry themselves. Then to trot etc. Lots of lengthening and shortening the rein (constant medium walk to free walk on long rein) and the tempo within the same the pace. This actually is my favourite type to reach oil because it’s just about supplying and teaching them to carry themselves and very rewarding.

 

[Jambarissa]

Thank you for your responses. I think I maybe haven't described it well.

If I do not keep a very tight hold of her she belts off. Any relaxation of the reins and she tries to take it up a gear. If I dropped the reins I think we'd be deathwalling

 

[Jambarissa]

Half halts do help a little. I just ended up doing constant circles and changes of rein to stop her taking off.

Could western style one - rein stops help in this situation?

We don't start off too fast, the initial walk is lovely and light and swingy, the first trot is a controlled pace but she's hard to bring back to walk. After that it becomes a tug of war. She seems to expect faster and faster work as the session goes on.

 

[moosea]

I agree with @hock
Go right back to walk.

If it was me the first thing I'd want to establish is a really good half halt, which you can acheive while doing as hock suggests and play with the length of the stride.
I'd be working on what I was doing more than what the horse is doing and really getting a good response to the seat everytime.
Frequently horses like this lean because they are falling onto the forehand, they sometimes feel that if you drop the reins they will stumble or run away in the pace.
Use loads of transitions - halt walk 2 steps, halt walk 10 steps etc, all over the school. This can help to get them using their hocks a bit more and also gets them listening for your half halts and preperations to halt.

It's really important on horses like this to not be afraid to use your leg to support and guide them. Common mistake is to think that the horse is going forwards so needs no leg, but often the horse is unbalanced, on the forehand and is in fact not in front of your leg in the true sense and needs more leg than you expect.

I also really enjoy horses like this. You've got a horse that is prepared to try and go forwards so you've won half the battle

ETA: Just read the update. Make her use her brain - a lot! Use pole on different stride legth and work her around them, through them and over them.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

In that case I would work in walk for the entire session, plenty of lengthening and shortening strides, changes of direction, walk/halt transitions, polework, until you are sure that she is listening to you, when you could introduce trot but still mainly work in walk

 

[SEL]

Thank you for your responses. I think I maybe haven't described it well.

If I do not keep a very tight hold of her she belts off. Any relaxation of the reins and she tries to take it up a gear. If I dropped the reins I think we'd be deathwalling

Are you in a school? I did do lap upon lap with a Welsh pony once who had got into the habit of tanking.

He didn't actually do many laps when he realised I was just going to sit there. RS had been taking him out of lessons when he was naughty so he just escalated his behaviour to get out of work as quickly as possible

 

[maya2008]

Depends why she’s doing it. My TB would have been like that if she’d not been cantered enough lately - well, attempting to run and then attempting to buck high enough to get the human to let go of the reins, then running. If I had been away or injured I just got back on and knackered her out before attempting to actually do anything. Worked for us.

I know one who leaned who was then diagnosed with hind end issues and is a thousand times better now after treatment.

I have known young ponies who leaned because they could…who were unbalanced and. needed rebalancing with lots of turns and circles and transitions.

I have known young ones who were just a little rude. We dropped down a gear every time they took a hold. It was the opposite of what they wanted, so they got the point quite quickly.

I have had one who was just scared of life. She settled in time and the death grip was lessened. In the meantime I rode her in a Dutch gag with two reins. Rode off the snaffle, leveraging the bottom rein as required to correct her.

I also have a Shetland whose speciality it is to tank off with small riders…and have met a similar Welsh A. We upped the bitting to get control, then dropped it again once we had made the point.

 

[millikins]

What is she like with her owner? Is she reacting to the change in riding style?

 

[millikins]

I have to say I'd be deeply unimpressed if I was your friend and found out that after one ride you were asking strangers on a forum how to re school her pony. Does she want her reschooled? Was that part of the deal?

 

[Jambarissa]

I have to say I'd be deeply unimpressed if I was your friend and found out that after one ride you were asking strangers on a forum how to re school her pony. Does she want her reschooled? Was that part of the deal?

I can understand that reaction. I'm the only person she said she'd trust to ride and she's booked for a C section next week. I don't want to say I won't do it and add to her stress, but I do not want to do it so need a solution.

The owner actually says she's too strong and has considered selling several times, I think she'd be thrilled if I made her more controllable. Realise I could have said this in op but didn't really see a need. Possibly I should have made it theoretical.

 

[TPO]

Right back to groundwork in a rope Halter.

If a horse doesn't understand pressure and release that's where to teach it and if you don't have a solid foundation at that stage you're never going to get it starting in the saddle.

 

[Jambarissa]

What is she like with her owner? Is she reacting to the change in riding style?

Owner doesn't actually ride that much recently, mainly hacks round the village with one other, she's a different horse in that scenario.

 

[Jambarissa]

Should have said I used to ride her just after she'd been prof broken when my friend was injured and she was unbalanced back then but easy to control. I'm not sure what's happened, several people have shared her over the years including some hung ho teens so possibly she reacts badly to new riders.

 

[DabDab]

What does she do if you just drop the contact?

A horse can only pull if you give them something to pull against, so I would be dropping the reins, letting her bomb around if that's what she wants to do and then gradually bring her back with my seat, and gradually take a contact on the outside rein, and then take it from there. Riding very square three loop serpentines can be useful to regain control of the shoulder as you pick the rein contact up gradually

My connie is very soft mouthed but also quite buzzy and forward and if you took a bit of a hold to try to contain her with rein contact she would absolutely match you and you would quickly end up in an unpleasant pulling contest.

 

[Michen]

I’m another with an extremely forward Connie who can ride very heavy and strong. When he’s like that we do a transition every quarter of the arena. Whether within the pace or between them.

 

[Cowpony]

If she wants to bomb, let her (provided it's safe of course). Wait until she's had enough, and make her do another couple of laps in the same pace and at the same speed. They soon get the message that it's hard work!

 

[sbloom]

I would argue that, using the definitions of the words and how horses need to move, a horse can't be strong and well balanced. Work on balance as much as possible rather than micromanaging the strength ie all the aiding that is needed to try and stop it happening. It needs to come from her body feeling better.

Take it right back down and find things she IS balanced and lighter doing, and work on those. I would always recommend postural groundwork as horses that are unbalanced will always struggle more with a rider but understand that may not be so easy/appropriate in your situation.

 

[scats]

I’m going to disagree with the letting her bomb thing, because my experience of riding these types is that it simply winds them up more. I also find lots of transitions can actually do the same. Instead, I aim to keep the trot small, as I find they take more of a pull when powering around. Focus on using your seat and keeping the trot small, lots of little turns- circles, loops. If they start taking a pull and speeding off, quietly to walk, some more circles and turns, then into a small trot again.

 

[splashgirl45]

How about lunging her for 10 mins or so to take the edge off , then once on keep everything very quiet do lots of turns and I found lateral work helped with mine when she was in a very forward mood. Also instead of doing circles try riding squares instead … that can bring them off the forehand

 

[Ratface]

Very "onward bound in all gaits everywhere" Old Horse responds to seat aids better than when asked to slow down a bit. Riding patterns with lots of changes of direction and gaits seems to get the required results. Polework in walk on a long rein is usually my main aim. Old Horse, being a previously professional show jumper, treats them as water jumps without the water!
This can be "interesting" . . .
I also pair physical aids with voice aids, which I realise is not de rigeur in many disciplines. Also, I to thank my horse after every meeting, as I feel privileged to have him in my life.

 

[AnShanDan]

I’m going to disagree with the letting her bomb thing, because my experience of riding these types is that it simply winds them up more. I also find lots of transitions can actually do the same. Instead, I aim to keep the trot small, as I find they take more of a pull when powering around. Focus on using your seat and keeping the trot small, lots of little turns- circles, loops. If they start taking a pull and speeding off, quietly to walk, some more circles and turns, then into a small trot again.

I agree with this, I have a TB x conn, she can be v strong and forward and would lean if you let her. More transitions and faster work can make her worse. I do exactly what scats says, keep everything very small, tiny trot, tiny canter, hint of leaning back to walk. Ride squares all the time through turns on forehand and hanches. Spiral in and out in walk then trot, make them use themselves and not just resort to their way of going.

 

[Melody Grey]

A good old fashioned ‘hands up leg on’ would be my approach. They can only lean if you let them.

I’d be very reluctant to teach that bombing around/ them setting the pace is acceptable in any way (my Welsh x would be an absolute nightmare if he’d learnt this!)

ETA: in my experience, chronic leaners are on the forehand and not well balanced.

 

[Burnttoast]

She may well be unbalanced, but does she actually understand the complete basics, that leg = go and hand = stop?

 

[SEL]

I wouldn't say it's so much as letting them bomb as refusing to let them have a rein to lean on. I have many times tied the reins in a knot (to prevent me taking hold) and ridden from my seat. If they get forward and unbalanced then just circle, but from your legs. It doesn't take long before they realise you'll let them fall on their nose unless they remember they are responsible for their balance.

Always in a school though. Nothing worse than being given something that leans on you out for a ride.

 

[Barton Bounty]

Owner doesn't actually ride that much recently, mainly hacks round the village with one other, she's a different horse in that scenario.

Well that all makes sense now, if she isn’t used to being ridden in a school environment she may just need a bit more education.
Being professionally broken means absolutely nothing if the education is not continued, hence why there are so many unfinished ponies out there.

If since being broken the pony has had no more schooling, i suggest that’s probably where the issue lies

 

[TPO]

All the transitions, riding from your seat, long reins, etc, in the world won't make the slightest difference if the horse doesn't have the understanding (or if the horse is in pain, be it something physical or an external factor like badly fitting tack).

 

[blitznbobs]

Thank you for your responses. I think I maybe haven't described it well.

If I do not keep a very tight hold of her she belts off. Any relaxation of the reins and she tries to take it up a gear. If I dropped the reins I think we'd be deathwalling

Then that is just poor training… but a great trait to have tbh. Id take a good hard pull on one rein. Smooth pull to bend horses head so it touches your knee … the second the horse gives (relaxes) towards your knee give the rein back to the horse - you can start this at halt and do it with both reins. Then do it at walk - big smooth pull (but strong if necessary) and release the second the neck relaxes into it. Over time (usually minutes) the relax will come sooner so that a smaller pull is required to acheive it and eventually a twitch of the fingers works. It has two functions
1) its very difficult for a horse to f off with its head on your knee
2) it trains giving to the rein rather than leaning against it and pulling

 

[Miss_Millie]

All the transitions, riding from your seat, long reins, etc, in the world won't make the slightest difference if the horse doesn't have the understanding (or if the horse is in pain, be it something physical or an external factor like badly fitting tack).

I think checking tack would be a good idea too. A pinching saddle did come to mind when I first read OP's post.