If you were to put your horse on sales livery

jhoward

jhoward

Demon exorcist...
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Im now taking in sales liveries, I currently have 3, totalling over nearnly 10k so a fair amount of money.

now my question is...

If you are the owner sending me your horse to be sold how would you like the money dealt with?

its something that comes up a fair bit 2 of the horses currently have belong to the same person and she would like the buyer to pay the money to her, im 100% happy for this to happen BUT for every sale I take 10% I have stipulated to her (in person and writing) that NO horse will be able to leave my yard until funds are cleared this includes me getting my 10%

now whilst im happy to deal with the finance side I understand itsa huge thing for me to have maybe 7k of someones elses money in my hands I also think its something that may put people off of sales livery.

BUT I see an issue with money changing hands this way..its almost guarenteed that at some point someone will try haggling/with holding my 10% if im not going to let a horse of my yard till everything is settled then it would cause an issue for the new owner.

so in simple terms..
if you used sales livery would you prefure the seller to handle funds or would you feel safer/more confident if you knew the money was going to land straight into your own account. ???
 
I would expect you to be paid the money. Then you would pay the outstanding amount to me taking off any livery cost/ commission. However i would also expect you to inform me if you were offered less than i wanted for the horse. Then I could say yes or no.

I have never sold through a 3rd party so perhaps not fit to comment but that is what I would see as appropriate.
 
Amounts ive got to negotiate with are discussed at the time of taking the horse. I know im being a bit picky but im not willing to even attempt to sell overpriced horses. also my sales livery is very cheap so i need to be sur im taking saleable horses not something that the owner wants thousands for yet has done nothing barring plod on the roads.

as far as im aware Id think id handle the money, its certinally how ive normally worked, but if it makes a difference to the business and people sending their horses to me then im happy to work a comprimise but it has to be as fool proof s possible for all parties.
 
Difficult one really. I have used sales livery before a few times and always been happy with it. The first time the cheque was payed to the yard then they sent me what was left after commission, livery bill etc. Second time the yard liked the horse so much they bought her themselves :)

BUT I have been in the situation where someone stole money off me re the sale of a horse when the money was paid to them and not to me. Makes it hard to trust again.

You need to be really upfront with the owner as in addition to the commission there will be livery costs, farrier, worming etc and there is nothing worse to a client expecting £xxx and getting £500 less due to additional charges. Keep everything clear and properly invoiced.

If you know the final livery bill then its no real hassle for the buyer to make out 2 cheques or bankers drafts. After all they will know the horse is on a sales livery anyway.
 
dozzie said:
I would expect you to be paid the money. Then you would pay the outstanding amount to me taking off any livery cost/ commission. However i would also expect you to inform me if you were offered less than i wanted for the horse. Then I could say yes or no.

I have never sold through a 3rd party so perhaps not fit to comment but that is what I would see as appropriate.
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Ditto this completely.
 
Agree with Mrs M. Can't see anyone complaining about that, would be fairest, most open way of dealing with it and I'm sure the people whose horses you're selling will be reassured with the fact the money from their horse is paid into a separate holding account.
 
hollycat..

livery is paid 4 weeks i advance on arrival of horse, things like worming shoes etc is also all set out in the begining. and again given in writing whats included whats not etc.

MM
I do have an account for the business,but in effect again its still only myself that has access to it so im still handling the funds.

Now I understand the words "contracts" but I dont think for something like this one would be of much use.

I think it may be rare cases that money is dealt with in this way but if its the difference between succeding and not then i have to think of ways round things.

as it stands at the moment im full already so can be pickie about what i take in but its not always going to be this way .
 
I as the owner would expect to be paid the money - and then I pay you what I owe. Sorry but I wouldn't trust a complete stranger with my money. I have sold a horse via a 3rd party and the money was paid to me.

You could say that it is wrong of me not to trust the dealer selling my horse - just as I can say it is wrong of you not to trust the owner to pay you the money they owe you. Why do you think you are at risk of not been given the money?
 
I always get the deposit to hold the horse of 10% or 15% (whatever the %age that the owner has agreed to pay) to me, that way I have my commission then once final arrangement have been made the final balance is paid directly to the owners prior to the horse leaving, that way there is no concerns on either side.

From a book keeping point of view, if you take the money you have to declare this as turnover and selling a 10 horses at 8k (cant remember the VAT threshold at present) this will take you quickly over the VAT threshold, which you then have to become VAT registered. If that makes sense.
 
dieseldog said:
I as the owner would expect to be paid the money - and then I pay you what I owe. Sorry but I wouldn't trust a complete stranger with my money. I have sold a horse via a 3rd party and the money was paid to me.

You could say that it is wrong of me not to trust the dealer selling my horse - just as I can say it is wrong of you not to trust the owner to pay you the money they owe you. Why do you think you are at risk of not been given the money?
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Why? well to be blunt its the world horses lol! to be honest im not sayin it will happen but I want every angle covered for every party involved.
 
scally said:
I always get the deposit to hold the horse of 10% or 15% (whatever the %age that the owner has agreed to pay) to me, that way I have my commission then once final arrangement have been made the final balance is paid directly to the owners prior to the horse leaving, that way there is no concerns on either side.

From a book keeping point of view, if you take the money you have to declare this as turnover and selling a 10 horses at 8k (cant remember the VAT threshold at present) this will take you quickly over the VAT threshold, which you then have to become VAT registered. If that makes sense.
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I think I love you... excellent way of making sure all is good for all parties and everyone should be happy.

yes I had considered about the going through the books side of things. im not trying to be underhand in any way so im prepared for this... all reciepts kept all out goings/in goings already kept track of and accountant on stand by!
 
jhoward said:
Why? well to be blunt its the world horses lol! to be honest im not sayin it will happen but I want every angle covered for every party involved.
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Exactly - and you are just as likely to be corrupt and rip the owner off as the owner is to rip you off.

The only angle you are covering with your method is your own - the owner has to trust you - would you trust all the dealers you know with your money? I wouldn't!!

Scally seems to have a good compromise - but I have never paid a deposit for a horse and I wouldn't. What happens if the horse fails the vet etc? I have also never taken a deposit for a horse I have sold.

* I'm not saying that you are corrupt :D but the reputations of dealers in general is not good :mad: These are just general comments that the average horse owner would think
 
DD

totally agree about dealers and reputations why is why im trying to ensure the best for my customers and also be able to offer reassurance for all including myself yes.
Of course I will, this is a business that meens a huge amount to me and im just not willing to risk anything or comprimise anything.

The deposit sounds good yes. and I can have a basic contract drawn up for the buyer saying that will only be refunded on failed vettings etc not something I want to do but it is an option

See whilst I cant fail to say im a dealer I can pride myself on a good reputation which currentley I do have, belive me Im in no way about to tarnish it.
 
Just had a rethink! I was thinking as a seller!

Having had a friend stung by an intermediary i wouldnt consider paying an intermediary as a buyer. It is so hard to get any comeback.

Sorry. it is a hard call for you. Damned if you do damned if you dont.:confused:
 
My friend has my boy on sales livery after a disastrous LWVTB. The arrangement is that when she finds a buyer they need to leave her a 10% deposit to secure th purchase then the balance is payable direcct to me and the horse leaves when i have cleard funds

This keeps my contract/payments to her as livery + shoeing/vet/chiro and comission is already sorted :)
 
ok having thought about this. how about...

on passing of vetting 10% deposit required on the day if needed this can be done via bank transfer, cash or I can upgrade my paypal account to use as business and payment could be done this way. or depending on when they wanted th horse could even be cheque.

if no vetting. on the yes I want the horse I ask for a 10% deposit. (im not looking to rob any one so if a buyer pulled out would give it back im not going to put daft conditons on it. )

the remainder is then paid direct to owner.. generally I find most owners want to stay in contact with a new owner or new buyer may want to talk to them about the horse so this I think is a good time to pass over details the 2 parties can then sort out finances.. again through all of this it will be made clear that no horse leaves the yard until full amount is clear.

what do we all think to that?
 
My only experience of this was when I bought my last horse the dealer took a 10% deposit from me when the horse passed the vetting and then when I came to pick the horse up I had a bankers draft for the rest of the money made out to the owner. Everyone was happy with this arrangement
 
bankers drafts can still be returned so unless cleared funds id not be happy to be honest.
I have to think of myself and the owner of the horses. it may meen a week later the horses goes but id much rather be safer than sorry.
 
My horse is on sales livery at the moment. She hasn't been advertised yet as they've been bringing her back into work for me. But I trust her to give me the money once she's sold. If I didn't trust her I wouldn't have given her my horse. Naiive maybe, I hope not, but she's sold a friends horse and has been great over the last couple of weeks Lucy has been there.

Your deposit scheme sounds good. But are the owners going to speak to the buyers? How do they know that the agreed purchase price is the one you're saying? I am going to let my lady sort it all out and then ask to see the reciept the buyer signs for her.
 
Galaxy Im not sure about if a buyer wasnt intrested in speaking to the owner.. another thing to consider, I have found in the past that the new owner always wants to speak to the owner.. but yes maybe it wont always be the case.

damn.

I understand about trust but I also understand about the what ifs which is what im trying to find a way around. and doubt.. you hear so many horror stories these days I just want to be able the safest ways possible for all involved..

I guess if a buyer was going to talk to an owner then the agreed amount would be obvious. to be honest id not even considered the possibility of dishonesty.

LOL at some point I MAY stick up my website address ... when im feeling realllllllllly brave!

in honesty thanks everyone I really wanted outsiders opinions good or bad.
 
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