info on kissing spine please

weesophz

weesophz

Well-Known Member
Joined
21 September 2011
Messages
2,536
Location
West o' Scotland.
www.facebook.com
my boys sore back has significantly worsened. he was given physio and a week off. after a week i lunged him and he seemed fine.

couple of days after tried riding - no go. could only get a slow trot on the lunge aswell. have been reading up on it and he is showing a good few of the symptoms. have the vet coming on tuesday to get him checked out as its my only day from work and uni.

can you share your experiences please, and what the outcome was? i dont want to jump the gun obviously but i like to be prepared if the vet does diagnose it..
 
Hi, my boy had a sore back that just didnt get better. He was fine to ride- would hunt for 5 hours, ears pricked and never miss his turn but something wasnt right :( we tried 6 months in field followed by 5 months careful rehab and nothing had changed. Under Xray there were two close vertebrae- not kissing or fused. If you rode him overbent he was fab but with his head up, he felt wrong. We looked at Cotts in Wales for the ligament surgery but they were a long drive then my vet found someone closer who had experience in this. Our chap was done 48 hours ago so its still early days but everyone is very positive he will be back in full work after we complete the 6 weeks rehab and a graduated fittening program. When xrayed at hospital, they found more suspect vertebrae so we opted to have them done at the same time.

Pic taken last night, 24hrs after surgery- NB the marks are pigmentation as he is a greying out spotty!

IMG_20130131_203428_044_zps68a898fa.jpg


IMG_20130131_203509_740_zps2084f703.jpg


IMG_20130131_203351_399_zpsbb34daa4.jpg


IMG_20130131_203403_856_zps1b71b847.jpg
 
thanks for your replies! DDD its good that you knew something just wasnt right, it shows its right to go with your gut feeling.

those stitches make me winse, im such a woose with needles haha :( glad things went well though, keep me updated with his rehab! x
 
My last horse was diagnosed with kissing spines at 10 years old. She had been raced only 4 times as a 2yo (broken at 18 months) but the vet had no doubt that this was a factor. After racing she was sold to a polo yard but was branded as stubborn and lazy. She wasn't of course. She was actually very sweet and willing. When I took her on and built up to doing long hacks with her, I realised that she wasn't right. She dragged a hind foot in trot, at the same time chomping on the bit with her head held to one side - and was as stiff as a board going down even the gentlest of hills. (However, she could go like the clappers when you pointed her at a grassy slope, so it was a puzzle.) She also used to lapse into a very odd walk stride which bounced me up and down, while she seemed to be pulling herself along with her front legs. Having said that, she appeared to improve the first summer I had her - and I'd had a better saddle fitted.
The following winter she started to become stiff again, and the funny walk strides became more frequent so the vet was called. A set of xrays later and the diagnosis was KS. A lot of things fell into place then. The vet felt that she was not fit even to be used for light hacking and since she was not a valuable competition horse, he did not recommend the op, which is obviously quite a big procedure.
The symptops of KS are many and varied. The horse can appear to be tying up - as the condition causes painful muscle spasms in the back and hindquarters. During this time, I attended a lecture by a well-known remedial farrier and I always remember him saying that while squaring off of front toes is normal, the same thing on hinds (which my mare did) is most definitely not normal - ever. .
If your vet suspects KS then he will only be able to confirm it with xrays or (I think) a bone scan.
Well good luck - I really hope that your horse does not have KS, but you are doing the right thing in checking it out. Do keep us updated.
 
d_morrow said:
My last horse was diagnosed with kissing spines at 10 years old. She had been raced only 4 times as a 2yo (broken at 18 months) but the vet had no doubt that this was a factor. After racing she was sold to a polo yard but was branded as stubborn and lazy. She wasn't of course. She was actually very sweet and willing. When I took her on and built up to doing long hacks with her, I realised that she wasn't right. She dragged a hind foot in trot, at the same time chomping on the bit with her head held to one side - and was as stiff as a board going down even the gentlest of hills. (However, she could go like the clappers when you pointed her at a grassy slope, so it was a puzzle.) She also used to lapse into a very odd walk stride which bounced me up and down, while she seemed to be pulling herself along with her front legs. Having said that, she appeared to improve the first summer I had her - and I'd had a better saddle fitted.
The following winter she started to become stiff again, and the funny walk strides became more frequent so the vet was called. A set of xrays later and the diagnosis was KS. A lot of things fell into place then. The vet felt that she was not fit even to be used for light hacking and since she was not a valuable competition horse, he did not recommend the op, which is obviously quite a big procedure.
The symptops of KS are many and varied. The horse can appear to be tying up - as the condition causes painful muscle spasms in the back and hindquarters. During this time, I attended a lecture by a well-known remedial farrier and I always remember him saying that while squaring off of front toes is normal, the same thing on hinds (which my mare did) is most definitely not normal - ever. .
If your vet suspects KS then he will only be able to confirm it with xrays or (I think) a bone scan.
Well good luck - I really hope that your horse does not have KS, but you are doing the right thing in checking it out. Do keep us updated.
Click to expand...

mine does the toe dragging going uphill, also a when trotting a circle, only noticed the going in a cirlce the other week. starting to strongly suspect that could be what it is :( what happened to your mare?
 
Well although not right - toe dragging might not necessarily mean KS.
The vet said that she would be fine to use for breeding and through a lucky contact, I was offered a place for her at a professional establishment where I knew she would be extremely well looked after, never ridden again, and not passed on at the end of her new career. I was very sad to part with her, but it was the sensible and practical thing to do, as I could never have afforded to keep a second horse (for riding) at livery. Having said that - I would have kept her if I hadn't found that place! I know someone who works there so I am able to get updates from time to time. She was scanned in foal last year but reabsorbed the embryo - so she is still on a very long holiday!. They really like her though - for her sweet temperament and it's good that I can keep updated on what she is doing.
 
my horse was operated on 12 weeks ago, same method as cotts, its a very slow process with him but hopefully we are getting there x
 
If you have transport I think I would take your horse to your vet (if he has facilities) so he can have a full work-up, be x.rayed etc. It would save you a callout charge and as KS can only be diagnosed by an x.ray you will end up having to take him anyway.
 
My TB who is almost 11 was diagnosed with KS last August - the farrier had noticed that he was stiff and uncomfortable when being shod behind. The only other symptom was a dipping of his back if you pressed hard over the affected area, otherwise nothing. I had the physio out, then the vet and then he was referred to 3 Counties. After x ray the verdict was "overriding DSP from T12 to L3, secondary sclerosis and multiple focal radiolucent areas" (not sure what the last bit means). Anyway it was glaringly obvious on the pictures and I felt sick. Surgery is not an option as the affected area is too great so I have gone for the following:

1. 10 cortisone injections across the area to remove pain
2. Intensive physio involving laser and ultrasound (6 90 min sessions)
3. lunging using draw rein arrangement to encourage him to lower and round his outline and strengthen the muscles, every day starting with just 5 mins each side and increasing gradually to 15 minutes at walk/trot/canter - this was for 6 weeks
4. Daily stretching exercises, ongoing.

By October the physio and the vet said to start riding him again, and so far I've managed 4 days hunting with him (2 long ones) on top of general hacking with no effect at all on his way of going or his general demeanour.

He has been stabled for the last 4 weeks with awful mud fever and although going out for walks daily, and being loosed into a barn during the day I was really concerned about him stiffening up and losing condition. The physio came out for a check up and said that he was absolutely fine and not to worry so she gave him a nice gentle massage and some ultrasound treatment.

I know he is not going to last forever, "the prognosis for a continued athletic career must, however be guarded" were the exact doom laden words but I do feel a little more hopeful now. I will see whether it is worth having another set of cortisone injections "just in case" but have been advised to carry on as normal for now.

So, it's not exactly a happy story, but bearing in mind the original verdict I feel lucky to have him in passably good health and still enjoying life.
 
"secondary sclerosis and multiple focal radiolucent areas" translated into English means that there were some hard bits that aren't meant to be hard (sclerosis = hardening of structures), caused by these overriding DSP's they are talking about (not sure of the abbreviation for DSP - something spinous processes?) and there were also several areas that were more dense than usual (radiolucent = appear whiter on x ray due to a denser structure.) If that hasn't cleared it up let me know and I'll explain it more clearly!

I can second what someone else has said, that you would need an x ray to diagnose KS, because you need to see the vertebrae of the back clearly to assess their position and relationship to each other. Try not to fixate on the worst case scenario until you have had a discussion with your vet and you're fully informed.

Hope everything goes well for you!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top