Is a hanging cheek too much for a youngster?

[myhorsefred]

I have a super sweet Connemara who I've recently bought for my daughter. He is 5, well nearly 6. He is very sensible, but a bit on the lazy side! More kick than pull, but that is ok for my daughter and my nerves at her riding! (am trying not to be an overprotective mother, lol)

Anyway, he is heavy in your hand. Not strong as in wants to tank off etc, just resists coming into an outline. CUrrently he is in a NS loose ring snaffle with lozenge.

I've sharpened him up to the leg since he's been with us, but is too lazy to work in an outline bless him. teeth, back, saddle etc all be checked and he has enough muscle and topline to carry himself, so no physical probs.

Yesterday I tried a single jointed hanging cheek on him. What a difference. Completely light in your hand and worked in a lovely outline. He mouthed/chomped on the bit loads but completely backed off if I took anything of a contact.

Now, I'm worried that the single joint was too much for him? Or the hanging cheek too severe? I don't want to over bit him, he is nearly 6 so still quite young really. Or, is it good to have a bit they respect? (Obviously when daughter rides him i will go back to his normal NS lozenge, I won't let her ride with the hanging cheek or single joint)

I'm waiting for Heather from Neue Schule to ring tomorrow as I'm considering buying a hanging cheek lozenge from her, but wondered if you guys could help me in the meantime please.

(Sorry, that ended up really long!)

 

[ThePony]

Hi,
I have a very green 8 yr old connie cross, I had a similar prob. Also tried the same ns, which she was comfortable in (head tossing and general evading tactics much improved) but she leant a fair bit still and brakes andn steering could be a little slower to activate than I would like! Also tried a few that offered a little poll pressure and she really wasn't happy in those, did the pony 'ridgid neck, lean away' trick or we lost her head as even with a loose rein she stuck her head to her chest! After trying loads (single jointed, 2 joints with a lozenge etc, loose ring, full cheek, eggbutt etc with a wide range of nosebands too!) she is now in a myler MB32 which is brilliant. It seems to give her more space in her mouth which she is much happier with, she also seems happier with it being quite still in her mouth too. She has generally stopped leaning and allows me to take a nice gentle contact, she comes back to me nicely without an argument and I think it is also kind on her mouth as it suits her mouth shape. She is so capable of going forward into a lovely outline, just seems she is very fussy about how her mouth feels. You can get one to try from the myler bit bank, also loads cheaper off ebay if you want to try one out.
Good luck!

 

[Theresa_F]

I used a french link hanging cheek on Stinky as a four year old - nice gentle bit and he likes poll action and is my dressage bit. He had a pelham as a five year old and this year will be shown in a double which he seems to prefer to the pelham.

If I need more brakes, ie jumping, then I have found a french link wilkie snaffle to be the answer with my chap.

 

[Hattiehorse]

I totally read that as 'Is a hamster cheek too much for a youngster?'
lol

And I don't have any advice either, I've got the opposite to you, a brakeless beast!

 

[Cheiro1]

I think a hanging cheek is fine for a young horse, but I dont particularly like single joints. I personally would get him a NS lozenge hanging cheek snaffle and then if you do want to change back to the loose ring for your daughter you could but you could always just leave him in the hanging cheek as with the lozenge it will still be a nice soft bit

 

[millitiger]

a hanging cheek is not a strong bit- there is no poll pressure involved.

it works by suspending the bit in the mouth and keeps it very still so much harder for the horse to lean into.

 

[myhorsefred]

Thanks everyone. Brilliant, as usual!

I hadn't thought about Myler. i'll look into that MB32 as well.

thanks again.

 

[gummybear]

Why bother paying out for a myler or a NS - if he is going perfectly well for you in the hanging cheek, and you have another but that your daughter can ride in - then why fork out for an expensive bit. Personally - my theory is we always coped with "normal" bits before so why go and spend £50+ on one of these new style bits now if what you are using works? Personally I see no problem with having a 6yr old in a hanging cheek. They arent severe at all - if they were you wouldnt be able to use them under British Dressage rules.

 

[myhorsefred]

Yes, I see your point. He does go nicely in it.

I was worried that because he was backing off it so much that the single joint might be hurting him.

Or is it good to have a bit that they totally respect?

 

[gummybear]

Maybe see if you can borrow a double joint or a french link hanging cheek, but I wouldnt bother paying out for a myler or NS.

 

[somethingorother]

I would say that a lozenge or french link hanging cheek would be fine and not too strong. But i would also not rely on a bit for getting him into an outline. Lots of bending and transitions and lengthening and collecting etc will help him to relax into an outline. I also find shoulder-in and lateral work helps a lot. This will then be a true outline from moving forwards correctly and not a forced one.

 

[Hippona]

[ QUOTE ]
a hanging cheek is not a strong bit- there is no poll pressure involved.

it works by suspending the bit in the mouth and keeps it very still so much harder for the horse to lean into.

[/ QUOTE ]


I'm sorry...but there IS poll pressure involved...


''The Hanging Cheek is also known as the Baucher, it uses pressure on the poll as the cheek piece has an extra ring above the snaffle ring where the bridle cheek pieces are attached to, this poll pressure encourages the horse to lower the head and come on to the bit especially useful for horses that have a high head carriage. This cheek has proven one of the most popular cheeks with various mouthpieces. It is a fixed cheek bit, which may be useful for horses that are unsure of the bit, as it doesn’t move around too much in the mouth. It may prove a suitable alternative to a snaffle if you could do with a little help to bring the head down.''

Although this is a good thing IMO...I use one on my giraffe, sorry horse

I likes 'em...

 

[Sol]

I'm going to disagree with the poll pressure thing too - because on any horse I've seen, unless you have it sit so high in the mouth that the lips crinkle about 50 times, the cheek pieces simply bow when pressure is put on the reins...
Personally, I don't see how there can be pressure when the things causing the pressure (supposedly!) are slack!

But to me it does seem that lots of horses like either hanging cheeks or also full cheek bits (with or without keepers) mostly because of the stillness... just personal opinion/experience though!

 

[Hippona]

Then they are not fitted correctly.....and if not fitted correctly, they won't work correctly.....
My horse isn't grinning like a cheshire cat, but the cheek pieces don't bow out....

Disagree as much as you like, its a free country

....but speak to a bitter or read descriptions regarding bits and their actions and it quite clearly states.....poll pressure is applied.....

 

[millitiger]

poppymoo- where did you get that quote from? is it the NS site?

there are lots of websites out there that would disagree and say there is no poll pressure.

as there is no fixed point for the rein or the cheekpiece you would have to pull the reins very hard to exert any poll pressure.

edited to add a post from a while ago with a quote from sustainable dressage-

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showflat.php?Number=4017927

 

[oldvic]

The hanging cheek is not necessarily a problem but I would be concerned about him coming behind the bit and not facing it. In my experience a lot of horses hold their jaw a bit fixed and don't really face the myler so with bitting it is an educated guess and trial and error. While I'm not a great fan of hanging cheeks, a lozenge version might be the answer. A not too thick loose ring might encourage him to mouth more or I have had great success with a demi anky for horses that lean or a verbindend.

 

[Boysy]

Exactly the same bit that i have put my youngster in only mine has a copper mouthpiece, he is 6 in May as well, he can also resist an outline (purely baby fashion) and is a 'kick along' type. I've tried all sorts of joints and bits as i am not a fan of single joints, he has disliked all of them and goes very well in this one so i'm sticking with it, i don't need strong brakes or poll pressure, just a bit that he is comfortable in.

He now mouths gently, doesn't shake his head around and doesn't chomp as he did with all the other bits and is happier to carry himself properly.

Don't attempt to fix what isn't broken and the Hanging Cheek or Baucher as it is properly known isn't a severe or strong bit at all even with a single joint, it's the hands on the end of the reins that matter................

 

[myhorsefred]

Thanks everyone. I'm happy now that a hanging cheek, single joint isn't too severe. Didn't want to overbit my little lad.