Keep your bloody dog on a lead aaarrghghg

blackcob

blackcob

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Couple of weeks ago R got attacked by a collie, it's one we see fairly regularly and I am so sick of it, the woman walks a minimum of four and anything up to seven dogs at a time, most off the lead, no control over any of them but especially this one which is aggressive. It's had a good go at R several times now but this time actually had him by the throat, poor lad was squealing and made no attempt to fight back, I had to kick the bloody thing in the ribs to make it let go. Few choice words with the woman about if it didn't have a muzzle on the next time I saw it I'd give it another kicking. :o

Anyway, that incident has set us back weeks with his issues with other dogs, for days afterwards he was squealing and lunging and throwing himself on the floor if another dog passed on the other side of the street. He's getting a rep as an aggressive dog. :(

He's still absolutely fine at training, works off lead around other dogs without batting an eyelid, has been to shows and events with lots of other dogs there, it's just passing strange dogs out on walks - you can understand why, he howls and he lunges, people interpret it as aggression, they call/drag their dog away, the source of his anxiety is gone, he's 'won', behaviour is reinforced. In actual fact he's quaking in terror, it's all noise, when a dog actually approaches him he just cowers and does his anxious 'wow-wow-wow' yelp.

Anyway, I'm venting because we've just come back from a walk during which a very rude young lab (reminded me a lot of Dax as a puppy :o) came crashing into us, so rudely in fact that even D snarled and bit it on the back of the neck which is very unlike her, she's rude and plays too rough herself. Regardless, it was too much for R who was alternately lunging, howling and shrinking back against my legs. I haven't felt that hot wash of shame for a long time with the dogs, how stupid must I have looked standing there with both my dogs going nuts and pulling me about the place, lunging for this dog, to my shame I snapped at the woman as well. :(

Just a rant, I'm 99% sure we're doing all the right things to combat this, his focus is excellent and most of the time I could produce a piece of food and hold his attention while a pack of slavering wolves went by, it's just when dogs come bowling right up to him that he can't cope. I just hate being 'that girl with the aggressive husky' and appearing to be out of control.
 
Hi Blackcob, rant away!

I understand where you are coming from & agree with everything you say.

I am ashamed to say that I was on the other side of this problem the weekend before last. Please don't shout at me, I know I created the issue & I feel so guilty that I exposed Dylan to such a dangerous situation.

You met Dylan (choc lab) at the summer BBQ. He's basically a good boy with reasonable basic training.

We were walking around a quarry, Dylan off lead & about 5 metres in front of me, sniffing as usual. He bumbled around a corner in the path, my attention was on something else & I didn't call him back so that I could see him, which I usually do. When I got to the corner I could see that he was bounding towards a man with 3 dogs (all off lead). Dylan was about half way between me & the man. I tried recalling him, but he chose that time to become deaf. With that the man threw himself straight onto one of his dogs, pinning it to the ground. His other 2 dogs launched themselves at Dylan, grabbing him by the throat. The pinned dog bit his owner & wriggled free, grabbing Dylan by a leg. Luckily Dylan decided 3 against 1 wasn't a fair fight & he led on the ground & did not defend himself, probably what saved him from serious injury. It was all a bit of a blur if i'm honest. The man managed to lay on the worst of his dogs again & I wheel-barrowed another one off dylan's throat, the 3rd let go of his own accord, allowing Dylan to get out of the way while I helped the man find leads & get his dogs sorted (worst one attacked owner again & also 1 of his other dogs before he got proper control).

Did I shout at the man or rough handle his dogs? No. I apologised for Dylan approaching them & made sure he was ok before getting Dylan out of there & checking him over.

I feel absolutely wretched for what Dylan went through, but equally as bad at the situation we put this man & his dogs in. I am responsible. This is the first time this has ever happened to us & I will do everything I can to make it the last. Going back to basics & doing lots of long-lining & training again. The thing is, if I'd called Dylan back before he disappeared around the corner, as I usually do, this may never have happened.
 
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Have the same problem here too.
Might be fine if their dog is friendly but 1 dog I walk a few times a week isn't as far as other males are concerned.
We were out last week, kept him on lead as always as I can't trust that he'll listen and come back if we meet other dogs. Met a lady out with her 2 dogs on a narrow path. Both hers were off lead. Her male lab came up for a sniff and the dog I was walking lunged at him, other dog took an aggressive stance and I managed to pull we'll call him 'my dog' back so there was a bit of distance. The loose dog's owner was further back the path keeping hold of her other dog by the collar and was calling the loose dog back but he just ignored her. loose dog was blocking our path past and the owner just stood back holding the other dog :o
I got my dog on left side and I blocked the 2 dogs with my body and marched on past or I was going to be stood there all blooming day :(
With Storm I keep her off lead in places away from cars. She will wait if I tell her to if I see another unknown dog. We then slowly approach. Storm usually approaches like a collie herding sheep, she lies down, moves a bit, lies down lol. Gives the owner time to tell me not to approach.
She then goes over for a sniff if it's ok and then she comes with me when I call her, not always 1st time if the other dog is playful mind you, but considering she's not 5 months old yet I'm pleased with her :D
Seen plenty dogs round here off lead by the road too, owners with no control :( 2 ESS's in particular have nearly been hit by cars (and 2 add to the rant both owners thought it'd be nice to breed pups from them :o) Yet their owners still insist on having them off lead :o 1 of the ESS owners I met on the path I mentioned was relieved to see me (after walking up and down the path about 5 times trying to catch her dog) and Storm (Storm was off lead) as she knew her dog would come over if I shouted Storm over to me :o Which he did cause of course Storm was a good girl :p

Davisn I can't figure from the story why you feel to blame? His dogs were off lead and aggressive, I could see if his were on lead and yours went up and got attacked. His should be on leads anywhere where he might meet other dogs IMO :)
 
davisn said:
Hi Blackcob, rant away!

I understand where you are coming from & agree with everything you say.

I am ashamed to say that I was on the other side of this problem the weekend before last. Please don't shout at me, I know I created the issue & I feel so guilty that I exposed Dylan to such a dangerous situation.

You met Dylan (choc lab) at the summer BBQ. He's basically a good boy with reasonable basic training.

We were walking around a quarry, Dylan off lead & about 5 metres in front of me, sniffing as usual. He bumbled around a corner in the path, my attention was on something else & I didn't call him back so that I could see him, which I usually do. When I got to the corner I could see that he was bounding towards a man with 3 dogs (all off lead). Dylan was about half way between me & the man. I tried recalling him, but he chose that time to become deaf. With that the man threw himself straight onto one of his dogs, pinning it to the ground. His other 2 dogs launched themselves at Dylan, grabbing him by the throat. The pinned dog bit his owner & wriggled free, grabbing Dylan by a leg. Luckily Dylan decided 3 against 1 wasn't a fair fight & he led on the ground & did not defend himself, probably what saved him from serious injury. It was all a bit of a blur if i'm honest. The man managed to lay on the worst of his dogs again & I wheel-barrowed another one off dylan's throat, the 3rd let go of his own accord, allowing Dylan to get out of the way while I helped the man find leads & get his dogs sorted (worst one attacked owner again & also 1 of his other dogs before he got proper control).

Did I shout at the man or rough handle his dogs? No. I apologised for Dylan approaching them & made sure he was ok before getting Dylan out of there & checking him over.

I feel absolutely wretched for what Dylan went through, but equally as bad at the situation we put this man & his dogs in. I am responsible. This is the first time this has ever happened to us & I will do everything I can to make it the last. Going back to basics & doing lots of long-lining & training again. The thing is, if I'd called Dylan back before he disappeared around the corner, as I usually do, this may never have happened.
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I am very suprised that those dogs, if they are that aggressive were not muzzled!!


I have trouble like that with my Dylan at the moment, we are back on a long line 80% of the time as he just takes off, thing is where we walk I know most of the dogs now so its just a friendly play around but it doesnt help that.
 
My bitch is terrified of meeting new dogs. She show a mixture of aggression and submission at the same time. All due to being attacked by 3 dogs. One was an apparently friendly dog but growled and chased her(she would of ran all the way home if he hadn't of caught his dog as when she's scared she will just run) second incident was when my brother had a staffy that lived with us at the time. Was a very misunderstood dog and if it had been trained from a young age would of been a lovely dog but was deaf when out walking. My brothers girlfriend had taken my bitch and the staffy out for a walk when they met 2 dogs that are known to be viscous (sp) in the village. Owners of dogs have no control, ones a staffy and other is disgustingly over weight beagle. They both went for my bitch so gf stood in the way. Staffy then went for gf so their staffy went for staffy which then made the beagle attack. Luckily owner wasn't too far away and managed to waddle quickly enough to help. These dogs are never on a lead and never muzzled. The owner with the 2 dangerous dogs have now bought a third and of course is now as dangerous as the others. This all now makes my dog look bad as she will bark and growl when others go past
 
I have to say, davisn, someone was in the wrong in your situation and it damn well wasn't you! If I thought R was actually aggressive and a danger to anyone he'd be muzzled as well as on a lead (which he is at all times, except where fully enclosed).

Being on a lead in public places isn't the death sentence a lot of people think it is, neither is having to wear a muzzle. Either is easier than teaching a perfect reliable recall, I'd wager. It's something I can see from both sides, my old terrier didn't wear a lead for the last half of his life, not even to walk down the high street, he just unquestionably did whatever I wanted him to. I know I cannot achieve that with my current dogs and, judging by this and other examples I see every day, a great deal of other people can't either.

The most frustrating bit is when you see a dog approaching, move to one side of the path and have your dog focusing on you, dipping into the treat bag as necessary, waiting for the other dog to pass. This is 100% guaranteed to result in a calm, happy Ricoh who doesn't even blink at the other dog... except when the other owner allows their dog to approach and sniff him when he's paying no attention to what's going on behind him, causing him to leap a foot in the air, spin, lunge and scream. :rolleyes: Or they dawdle, or they make snide remarks, or they try to be helpful and pull to one side themselves - no, just hurry up and pass! :mad:
 
Zak has to go for other dogs if they're smaller than him (just to make sure they dont attack him? Dunno) then he's their best friend. Big dogs get his respect. He's now either on lead (recall issue also :rolleyes:) or if he's off, he's muzzled. He doesn't bite or hurt the other dogs, but I can't let him wander round and look like he's attacking other dogs. :(

He wasn't socialised enough as a baby due to having to be kept on the lead cos of his HD. :( It breaks my heart, especially when his brother and big dog are off lead and ignore other dogs.

I do wish people would respect the factbtha he's on a lead and not let their dogs meander up to him. A bloke I know with three springers stopped to chat the other day, nearly strangling one of his dogs who is very aggressive towards Brig and saw I was struggling big time to hold Zak but still wanted a big chat! Thank God I had Brig on a lead (unusually) or his dog would have attacked him.
 
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R wailed at an Irish wolfhound the other day, size is no deterrent. :o He's better with small dogs, if anything? Collies are the worst, even if they're a good distance away the slink and the stare set him off, he goes rigid and then trembles before he starts howling.

I think he's a bit of a speshul sensitive dog all round, he's also terrified of the horse, loud noises, slinks around grimacing in high winds and can back out of a harness in a flash if any of those scare him sufficiently. If you raise your voice he actually cringes. So different from D who, when you shout at her, thinks it's a great game and howls back, tail wagging. :rolleyes:
 
Having had/have 2 reactive dogs both rescue Fred and now Darcy its a real problem and dealing with it and resolving it then having it undermined by other dog walkers is enough to make you tear your hair out.

When I took Fred to training classes if another dog barked in class he wanted to kill it, if I over checked he would come back up the lead at me. If another dog lunged at him he just wanted to kill it, we did manage to train him out of this but it very much depended on the other dog. He was friendly with normal dogs and showed restraint when pressurised by a dog he knew.

Darcy was nervous of strange dogs and any that came into her space she would lunge at and bark so people used to think she was aggressive. In actual fact she was nervous like Ricoh and I spent a lot of time walking and meeting strange dogs having done lots of focus and clicker training beforehand. This has worked so well and at agility she has had strange dogs run up to her and bark in her face and she didnt react. If she is on the lead and she was restricted she would Im sure react and fall back into her old ways. Its a management situation and Ive been lucky in that we have our own land on which we dont meet the general public only friends with dogs she knows. Im sure she has been frightened in her past and its something that is very difficult to erradicate. One thing my current trainer has taught is very often our tensions go down the lead to the dog ,well his solution is to stand on the lead and your hands are free to treat etc. That is all well and good if you have a small dog but Im afraid with a 40kg angry Dobermann you would be sat on your arse very quickly but I can see his logic.:)
 
Out of interest how do you train your dogs just to bumble along infront of you?? Mine all have recall (Dylan being iffy atm in certain situations) but when I let them off they are all over the place, I have access to my landladys land so they wont meet any other dogs sometimes but I barely see them on the walk as its wooded but three pips on the whistle and they are there at my feet, Buster bumbles along infront nearer the end but just tends to follow Dylan everywhere. Is it just that I have youngish dogs??
I can also recall them, lead them, and all three walk on the lead nicely.
 
Thanks for the kind words of support.

The reason I feel so bad & responsible for what happened is because Dylan approached them first, they didn't really react until Dylan was only about 10 metres or so from them. The way I see it, if Dylan had kept his distance they may well have stayed with their owner & been under control.

Obviously the guy knew he had a problem with at least one of his dogs, otherwise he wouldn't have thrown himself on top of it before Dylan got there. So yes, I agree that he probably should have had muzzles on, but that doesn't alter the fact that Dylan & I instigated the issue.

I admit that Dylan is rarely on a lead, mainly due to the fact that we usually walk on the beach or mountain were I can see for miles & can recall Dylan ever before 'exciting' things are close enough to be an issue. I must admit that since getting the border terrier pup I haven't put as much time & effort into Dylan's training.

I didn't want to hijack the post. I just wanted people to understand what can happen if you allow you own dog, no matter how friendly, to approach other dogs without checking with the owner first. Dylan is such a friendly dog with no malice in him at all, he was so lucky to get away without serious injury, just some puncture wounds. There was a lot of blood, but I think most of it was from the other man.
 
a_toffee_xmas_pud said:
Out of interest how do you train your dogs just to bumble along infront of you??
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Toffee, not something i knowingly trained for. I think it's just because we didn't really do a lot of lead work when he was little. He had to follow me everywhere whilst i worked on the smallholding. He usually just wants to be with me. He wanders ahead a bit sometimes, but a whistle or a shout & he's back within an acceptable distance again. Usually, at home, if he goes out of site & I don't appear almost straight away, he comes back to the corner so that he can see where I am - bless him.
 
If Dylan was at lest 10 meters away,and the gentleman knew he had a problem with his dogs, they should be on leads and muzzled all the time and it really wasn't your fault.But I'm glad I've seen this thread as I have a jack russell x, who has been attacked several times, when he's on the lead and the reason he's on the lead, he'd disappear off rabbiting and he'd never come to call, so now when he see other dogs he will try to attack first now, so I always pull him and the other two out of the way.
 
Thankfully we don't have too many idiot owners here but we did have one day with a woman and 2 dogs. One followed her and the black lab came running straight towards us. The woman walked the other way expecting dog to follow her but not actually looking to see if it was. In meantime, mine is howling and leaping about,I'm trying to boot the dog to keep it away from mine. She then came towards us, and started cooing it towards her. Yeah, that isn't going to help. Dog is totally ignoring her and finally runs away from me and mine. Woman quickly marched off without an apology.

On the plus side, we're definitely getting better and as long as they don't run up to us I can have him sitting while they calmly pass him as opposed to a bouncy dog on 2 legs howling like he's being strangled. God awful noise that one.
 
I met a lady with three dogs yesterday on a bridlepath whilst hacking out one of my client's horses who is a bit nervous.
She HAD HOLD of all three dogs and yelled to warn me that she didn't know what the dogs would be like with horses.
She then LET GO of all three dogs. One chased my little terrier who was minding her own business almost all the way back to the yard, and another dog went for the horse I was on. She had no control over the third either.

I can't believe she let them go! She had the opportunity to clip them on to a lead. I would have been gone in less than a minute and she could have let them off again.

I later saw her getting into her car, which had her petsitting business logo and phone numbers on it!! They were not even her dogs then! I wonder what the owners of the dogs would have thought if they had known this woman who was trusted to walk them safely was allowing them to risk getting kicked by horses!
 
Went for a run with them both yesterday, passed several dogs with no incidences at all, owners called them in to heel or popped them on a lead as we passed, fantastic, all except one numpty who allowed her terrier to chase us (we'd slowed to a walk when I saw that they weren't going to put theirs on a lead) and snap at Ricoh's back legs, got a dirty glare when he span round and lunged back. :rolleyes:

On the plus side we came home via the playing fields and saw a school run mum with a husky in the boot of the car, exchanged a husky-owner grin and wave. :p
 
Monkers said:
She HAD HOLD of all three dogs and yelled to warn me that she didn't know what the dogs would be like with horses.
She then LET GO of all three dogs.
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Utter, utter moron. If you know the name of the business I'd actually go for a letter to the local newspaper on that one, stupidity like that deserves a bit of retribution.
 
baublecob said:
Utter, utter moron. If you know the name of the business I'd actually go for a letter to the local newspaper on that one, stupidity like that deserves a bit of retribution.
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Do you know what, I might just do that if it happens again. Hopefully she will see sense now that she knows for sure her dogs are NOT good with horses!
 
Hi

I think I might have skipped half this thread, but I find some dog owners very ignorant and feel your anger. I own a large female rottweiler, (the third I've ever had and the most challenging I've ever come across... not for the faint hearted). I try and walk her at times of the day when there are few people about, she is (I think) quite nervous around other dogs, but reacts in an agressive way when she is on the lead, however when off the lead she runs in the opposite direction. These reactions are only to certain dogs, and I have yet to establish a pattern, apart from the fact she doesn't like small yappy terrier type dogs, is agressive on the lead towards them, but I havn't yet trusted her off the lead (only with larger dogs ie spaniels and above). She is quite well trained off the lead, and returns, sits and stays to command, and if I see a terrier in the distance I tend to put her on the lead, when they are in shouting distance I shout that she doesn't get on with little dogs and give them as wide a berth as physically possible... However 9/10 times the little dog is not under any control, runs straight up to my dog thats on a lead, she growls/barks/shows teeth and I get dirty looks... :mad:

I know she is a rottweiler, one of these so called "dangerous" breeds, but I put her on a lead, shout a warning and walk as far as I can as possible away from said dog, but seriously?!

PS - The rest of the family have terriers.... I love them too! My dog doesn't!
 
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