Keeping horses in a (very!) large herd... good or bad?

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CharlotteRS

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Hi

Not sure I've put this post in right part of forum, but here goes!

I'm trying to find grass livery for my welsh section D - but it's proving quite hard. The only place I've found has a mixed herd of around 25 horses in a very large field. This makes me nervous. I'm worried about fights etc and that she will get hurt. I also think getting her in during the winter will be really hard - battling through 20 other horses!

Does anyone have any experience of keeping horses in a herd this large?

Any advice gladly received
thanks
 
I would be unsure with it, but I would ask about winter 25 horses through one gateway sounds mudfest, maybe most don't go out.. The only thing is the introduction, I would want a way of doing it calmly.
The field would have to be very large with several shelter areas, and more than one water trough.
How do they put out hay.
Is she tarty, assuming there are geldings.
How do you feed extra?
There is a section on here for local areas, ask on there about grass livery in your area, also ask in feed store abut this place.
 
We run 32 horses together, mixed sex. We have nothing taller than 15.2hh, no back shoes, no feeding allowed in the fields.

Owners joining the herd have to understand that in winter they are essentially joining a cooperative. It would be impossible and unsafe to get a single horse in first thing in the morning, for example. They all come in together. We prefer young horses to join the herd and don't introduce anything going into the winter or during the winter. Accidents can, and do occasionally, happen. Mounting behaviour is common.

^ those are the negatives

The positives are 50 acres of rolling hillside, incredibly well-balanced horses. Every single horse in our herd can be caught and led away separately, can be ridden out or travelled alone. This includes horses whose owners believed they would never be able to do so. They look forward to their human time and many come to call across 50 acres. They all have a soft eye, strong body and excellent social skills! Bad behaviour is very rare - most accident are related to galloping around like idiots rather than attacks.

The best bit for me is that my horses are so settled and happy. They have their best friends, they have their own lives. I LIKE that for the 23 hours every day that I'm not asking them to work they have other and better things to do. Would I keep a high value competition horse like this? Probably not ... however, I do compete all of mine (BE and dressage), and hunt, etc ... and they usually do very well! However that is secondary for me. The youngsters learn perfect manners. I have stables, but trying to keep them on on a stormy winter's night results in a grumpy horse in the morning that doesn't understand why it was kept locked up while the others got to race in the rain ...

So it can work, but don't expect it to be anything like keeping a "normal" DIY in the winter, as you do need to rethink feeding, access, etc - on our yard owner not feeding their horses enough was always the biggest problem and we had to ask many people to leave. However we worked a safe haying solution now and I suppose you get idiots on every yard!
 
My 2 are in a herd of 19 and are very happy. I think it depends on the set up regarding if it works or not. They need to have enough food and enough space.
Ours are on a very large paddock in the winter ( November to 1st May) and have 5 round bale 'holders' which are kept filled up all the time. In the summer they are on big fields and are moved from field to field as needed.
With regards to bringing horses in and out, we don't have any issues. No feeding / treats are allowed to be fed in the field. I made sure I was fairly assertive when going in and out and if any other horses start following or coming up to me that are not mine, then I make sure they know to move out of my way.
Any new ones have the usual few days when the rest of the herd make it clear who is who, but I have yet to see any serious injury, the new ones have a few bite marks from the first few days, but they soon settle in, and when you see how happy they all are and how interesting it is watching the herd dynamics I would never go back to 'traditional' stabling again.
One of my boys was not a cheap horse by any means and for the first few days I did worry a bit, short term it is probably more 'risk' than keeping traditionally (the integration period) , but long term I believe there is less risk of injuries when you add up some of the issues you have to content with when they are kept mostly in the box. (ulcers, muscle issues, temperament issues etc etc) The only thing I think that would be very tricky to manage would be either a laminitic /too fat horse, or something with sweet itch - we do have a couple with sweet itch who need to way a 'body condom' all summer and do tend to feel for them when the flys are bad and it is very hot. Luckily I do not have this problem with either of mine.
 
I've had my horses in a herd set up for many years, although to a much lesser extent than 25 horses, approx 10. As long as they have plenty of room, and there is plenty of hay out in the field when there is no grass, they will be fine.

The only catch is if your horse needs additional feed during winter/summer, then you have to bring it in, rather than just chuck it over the fence. A lot of the problems I see on here about horses that fret about their friends leaving them, you have to bring the dominant horse out of the field first, horse wont stay out in its field on its own, are totally alien to me.

However you do need to bear in mind that some horses cannot adapt/settle to a large herd. I have seen two of them. One had been gelded late and still though he had his wotsits, even though I dont think he'd ever covered anything, and the other was just an out and out bully. However, these two are very rare examples.
 
Mines out in a herd of geldings, theres 17 of them out on 30 acres. They are on sandy soil, so minimal mud. I've never had an issue getting him in on his own nor does anyone else. Its not like stabled horses who crowd round the gateway waiting to come in. They are usually found stuffing their faces round the hay! :)

They seem to form little groups within the big herd. Mine is a young cob and has buddied up with 4 other young cobs. Hes really settled and happy
 
Mine was out in a herd of 14 or so. There were never any fights. After the initial crazy period of them all getting to know each other they all knew their place and stayed in it. If they didn't, they got a bite on the butt.

I loved having them in such a huge field all together. Watching them all gallop around and play together was beautiful.
 
thanks loads for all your advice. I've been told they're out in 30 acres, so have at least 1 acre each. there are two gates and I'm told they never have probs in the winter - although she may be stabled at night then so in a different, smaller field.
no food allowed in field and he says they never have any trouble.
I'm v tempted, but its just so different to how I've kept horses in the past!
 
I used to keep mine in quite a large mixed herd. The big one was part of the herd full time, while the two little ones spent the summer in their own electric fenced paddock. As others have said, all the horses were very content and healthy and it is a lovely sight to see them having a good gallop together. Unfortunately one did injure herself having a mad moment, but that could have happened in a field of one as she slipped at a gallop and tore her side on a rock. It was very easy to catch any of them, and any who had hard feed would be brought in for it. Hay was spread in piles as the ground was sandy so there was barely any mud.
 
My 11 are out together. 5 are entire, one gelding is elderly, and one only 38". They're as chilled as it's possible for a horse to be. Children go into the field and stick a headcollar on whichever one they want without any drama.
They're barefoot, but we do still get the occasional patch of fur missing from a bite or kick, but not often. They all socialise well, but tend to have favourite buddies within the herd.

A couple of rules help:
No treats in the field.
Hay given all at once, and enough piles to go around + a few.
Anything which needs feed in winter is caught and fed outside the field whilst we put the hay out for the others.
 
pennyturner said:
A couple of rules help:
No treats in the field.
Hay given all at once, and enough piles to go around + a few.
Anything which needs feed in winter is caught and fed outside the field whilst we put the hay out for the others.
Click to expand...

These rules should be adhered to whether a large group or just two IMO! I'd love for mine to be in a larger herd, unfortunately the yard that does this restricts to geldings only.
 
I don't think it is necessarily the size of the herd that is the issue as long as there is enough space and food.

My experience of places that had large herds were large livery yards that had a high turnover so there were always new horses coming and existing herd members going and this caused problems. The latter especially if the horse that left was very high up in the hierarchy leaving a gap and the herd had to readjust. They never really settled.
 
MissTyc said:
We run 32 horses together, mixed sex. We have nothing taller than 15.2hh, no back shoes, no feeding allowed in the fields.

Owners joining the herd have to understand that in winter they are essentially joining a cooperative. It would be impossible and unsafe to get a single horse in first thing in the morning, for example. They all come in together. We prefer young horses to join the herd and don't introduce anything going into the winter or during the winter. Accidents can, and do occasionally, happen. Mounting behaviour is common.

^ those are the negatives

The positives are 50 acres of rolling hillside, incredibly well-balanced horses. Every single horse in our herd can be caught and led away separately, can be ridden out or travelled alone. This includes horses whose owners believed they would never be able to do so. They look forward to their human time and many come to call across 50 acres. They all have a soft eye, strong body and excellent social skills! Bad behaviour is very rare - most accident are related to galloping around like idiots rather than attacks.

The best bit for me is that my horses are so settled and happy. They have their best friends, they have their own lives. I LIKE that for the 23 hours every day that I'm not asking them to work they have other and better things to do. Would I keep a high value competition horse like this? Probably not ... however, I do compete all of mine (BE and dressage), and hunt, etc ... and they usually do very well! However that is secondary for me. The youngsters learn perfect manners. I have stables, but trying to keep them on on a stormy winter's night results in a grumpy horse in the morning that doesn't understand why it was kept locked up while the others got to race in the rain ...

So it can work, but don't expect it to be anything like keeping a "normal" DIY in the winter, as you do need to rethink feeding, access, etc - on our yard owner not feeding their horses enough was always the biggest problem and we had to ask many people to leave. However we worked a safe haying solution now and I suppose you get idiots on every yard!
Click to expand...

That sounds like a lovely and very natural set up. So very difficult to find in the UK
 
Mine used to be in a gelding herd at a livery yard where he was 1 of 10-12. Summer was fine as big fields and no crowding at gate and always good as even when horses brought in for riding there would always be company left out. Winter was horrid though - smaller field, grass all gone within a month or so and first third of field was deep mud - overcrowding at gate at bring in time was not pleasant if horses very cold and hungry - and compounded when yours is bottom of the pecking order - which mine was. I have had a friend's partner had to come and help me once armed with a crop when I was trying to get mine out past two others that kept flying at mine as wanted in ahead of him - it was lethal. Mine's also had a cut on his face from being caught up against the fencing by another and I got fed up at weekends of having to get in the 2-3 other horses left out late in order to retrieve mine. I've also been stood on and thrown up against the gate by trying to get in someone else's horse when someone else was stuck in a similar position to mine and couldn't get hers out past it. There were better behaved horses in the pecking order who would give ground gracefully and one or two lead horses which would move others away from the gate as you approached. It depends on so many factors but I personally wouldn't go back to those conditions again. I'm now at a different yard with 3-4 in a paddock and my pony is much more confident at the gate and bringing in time is no problem, summer or winter.
 
My first experience of horse ownership was keeping horse in a large mixed herd. it was hideous! Although there was plenty of space, in winter the gateway become knee deep in mud, horses gathered round the hay and argued, getting a horse out in these circumstances was dangerous and there was never a settled herd as horses came and went regularly. i managed to persuade the YO to let me keep my 2 horses in a smaller field with 2 others otherwise I would have looked for a different set up. I'm sure with good management, this can work well but my sister in law keeps her horse in a large mixed herd group and it had three injuries before it found it's place in the herd.
 
I think as long as your horse is an ok doer it's will be fine it must be very difficult to deal with one that gets thin in winter .
The biggest thing that would worry me is having a horse unused to stabling so that box resting would be difficult if needed .
It would not suit me personally though it would not fit in with how I like to spend my time .
 
I think summer is probably fine. My pony was in a herd of 30 on the first yard I was at summer was fine winter was tricky with the hay and mud. I then moved to a yard where there was 12-15 in the herd and that was better though it was a mixed herd and there was some issues with geldings mounting mares and one particular mare got mounted a lot and chased and lost a lot of weight and condition, I don't think she got a lot of rest as quite a lot of the gelding liked her.

Winter can be more challenging unless you have so much grass that you don't need to hay the fields. When you put in the hay even if you put lots of piles out you either get them all galloping over and you can't put the piles out quick enough {unless you have lots of people to help} to prevent fighting or they are all waiting and then start squabbling and it is even harder to put the hay out. The area where you put the hay out can also get very muddy very quickly as well and you are going to need a lot of storage near the fields to store enough hay for 30 horses over winter.

Also if the horses are all ridden horses and coming out the fields on regular basis the gateways can get very muddy.

My pony is now in a herd of 13 but they are all in at night and the fields are very big and geldings only in his field. I think it can also depends on the temperaments of the horses as well luckily the geldings in his herd are friendly and they seem to be very fond of each other. My pony is used to big herd turnout and one big advantage of big herd turnout is that is less likely that a horse will get left on it is own and also they have more space to run and play as you need bigger fields.
 
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Id love mine in a big herd given the paddock is big enough. I always like it when we overnight hunting and they get to go in a herd but they do seem to keep to their groups after the initial run around.
 
I have little experience of very large herds but have kept my horses, temporarily, in a mixed group of about 12. A little bit of trouble getting them in and out of field but my main issue was with worm control/poo picking ie it was rarely done. With new horses coming and going, virtually no poo-picking and hit and miss worming, not something I was happy with.
 
Mine used to be in a mixed herd of up to 15. All got on well. No feeding allowed in the field, very few issues in the gateway in winter. Horses were out on 25 acres of well drained pasture with lots of natural shelter though.
I think as long as it's well managed then everything is fine.
Then I had some issues with a riggy gelding mounting and chasing my pony mare, my gelding used to intervene and ended up getting injured twice, so we moved to a smaller group as YO wouldn't do anything about the gelding....
They're now at a yard with 7 or 8 others on ten acres with no issues at all.
 
Never had any problems with the herd of riding school horses and ponies - I too had 32 on a max of 15 acres, usually in 5 acres at a time. Gate way did get a little muddy but had been stupidly placed at a low point!

Always exciting to have a new playmate but in general everyone was so content they didn't mind. Haying up in winter we ran an electric fence along one side, there was a small gate at the edge of the paddock, we used this to bring in the hay - it was then spaced out along the full length of the fence.

Every one could get in to the hay and my helpers were safe from the possibility of being kicked. Also meant that no naughty ponies mugged the wheelbarrow on its way through.

Easy to catch - no one fed out in the paddock so no expectation of food.
 
I think it depends if its a livery yard that doesn't have a high turnover of people/horses. I know of one livery yard that is always having incidents in the field (they keep them in large herds) but its because people are moving in and out quite a lot so there's always a new horse on the go. If the herd is kept the same most of the time it should be fine? I used to ride a friends horse who was kept on this yard and the main issue I had was that because it was a big herd they were in a huge field so it took forever to trudge over to catch the horse on a cold winters day, and then I'd always worry about one of the other horses going for the gate as I was leaving.
 
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