Kissing Spine

[lorna1]

My vet has diagnosed a problem with my new horse in his hind quarters. I had him five stage vetted before I bought him at the end of March this year and nothing was picked up. I know from a previous owner he has had behavioural problems and was diagnosed as genetic azoturia although he never actually tied up.

Does anyone know the symptoms of Kissing Spine?

He's pretty grumpy probably due to pain (but now on bute and not being ridden for the time being), doesn't like having his saddle put on or his girth done up, struggles to go into canter without rushing, then goes very hollow and fast, will not lunge on the left rein, spent about 20 mins on his hind legs on a recent hack for no obvious reason.

Can anyone give me an idea as to vets costs for finding out whether he has kissing spine?

Any other ideas on what his hind quarter condition may be?

Thank you.

 

[Merlotmonster]

Yes, I had a horse with kissing spines..My mares symptoms were very mild however. She started going ever so slightly lame on the lunge or on smaller circles. Every time the vet came out she would be sound. She then started to refuse to go in the lorry - she had always loaded perfectly till then. The final straw came when my sister took her to a local hunter trial (she had been eventing at BE novice level) and she refused to come down some tiny steps. The vets suggested we took her to Rossdales in Newmarket for a scan. They diagnosed the kissing spine. The surgery was about £5k so if your not insured I would be a bit worried! She was off work for 6 months and then you couldnt even see the scar. The vets there were amazing.
I would suggest getting your horse scanned initially. It will show up any 'hot spots' on your horses back.

 

[BethH]

Mine was done last year - successfully - go to Willersley Equine Clinic and ask Svend Kold to look at x-rays. Actual op and livery/nursing care for 10 day stay was approx £2500 but diagnosis involving schintigraphy, xrays, ultrasound and nerve blocks cost £1800 at my local vets to get to the bottom of problem, insurers should pay for the investigation but possibly not the op, however I persuaded mine to assist and they were very helpful. IMO Svend is the best person in the country if not Europe for this problem, he is also approachable and realistic. Ryan was stiff and short in his hindlimb action, big issues re going downhills plus symptoms you describe and many others. You may find diagnosis initially difficult as they tend to be bi-laterally lame.

This is not the end of the world and can be made into a good learning experience if you have the time, patience and love for your horse. It is very time consuming and exhausting too so you would need to prepare yourself for a bit of a rollercoaster! There are plenty of people on here who have been through it and will help you. Mine had 6wks box rest walking in hand daily, following by 6 wks ground work and I was back on board after 14 wks albeit very low level, different vets go for different rehab programmes.

Best of luck - by the way I posted a long list of symptoms etc last june/july if you want to look at the archive.

 

[lorna1]

Thank you for your comments Merlotmonster and BethH

 

[dozzie]

It could be sacroiliac injury. This can cause bucking, some reaction when tightening the girth, loading issues, reluctance to track up, tension and spookiness, reluctance to bend on one or both reins,much the same as kissing spine. Upward transitions from trot to canter also lack engagement and horse may change leg frequently behind.

Thats possibly what the Vet meant when he said it might be something else. It could be muscular or any joint in the leg which is why hes probably suggesting scans. At the moment SI can only be found by bonescanning.

If it is SI then there are a few people on here who have had the same problem who can help. As with kissing spine and hock spavin etc. Hopefully whatever it is it can be treated.

 

[seabiscuit]

Kissing spine often produces pain symptons/muscular symptons in the hindquarters because they hold/brace their backs to prevent it hurting and thus dont want to flex their hocks underneath properly causing hindquarter/saccrolilac pain.

Insurance should cover all costs of investigations but I would not waste any more time with your vet and get him refferred to your nearest good vet hospital asap for full body scans and Xrays of the backs and hocks to reach a conclusion as to what is happening with your horse. He sounds as though he is in a lot of pain I would not be surprised if all behaviour issues disapear once the cause of the pain has been rectified.

If it is KS its a very routine op to correct but the correct aftercare and exercise program post op is critically and fundamentally extremely important and not all vet hospitals actually know what the best post op care programs are.

 

[debradley]

Hi there, if you look back a bit through this site you'll find references to Honey's trip to Willesley and kissing spine. In one of those I have listed a whole lot of symptoms but they do vary for different people. My horse has just had her kissing spine surgery 4 weeks ago, so if you want to pm me for more info please feel free.

 

[debradley]

By the way, I notice that you mentioned you had a 5* vetting. Have you had the bloods run to check that there was nothing masking the symptoms when you bought him. I've been following your problems and know that you've had a few from the start, so it seems strange that something wasn't picked up as previous owners knew he had behavioural!! problems. It should have flagged something up to the vet to double check. You may have some recourse that way, after all that's what you pay vettings for.

I haven't had my final bill yet but I'm expecting the whole lot from start to finish to cost around £4000. That's all my vets trips out before and after and all her treatment at Willesley. The insurance is covering it.

 

[AmyMay]

[ QUOTE ]
I had him five stage vetted before I bought him at the end of March this year and nothing was picked up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well that's not entirely accurate, because in a previous post you have said that the horse was 3/10 lame on four or more strides on his hind left - so there was an indication prior to purchase that there was a problem.

Hopefully you have full insurance in place to enable the exploratory work to commence - and then treatment if required.

As others have said there has been a lot of discussion on here about kissing spine - and the outcome in many cases seems to have been positive.

Good luck.

 

[chris35]

my boy is due to go to sven for his op so it was good to read your comments. my physio and vet have recommended that after initial 6 month rehab that i turn him out for a year. he has got overiding on withers and kissing behind saddle so maybe much bigger op than norma? he is only 5 so im hopeful for a full recovery.