Kissing Spines...again...Insurance? Sorry, long....

HeresHoping

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Hi there,

Some of you may recall my thread about my occasional bucking bronco: http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?p=11065936#post11065936

Well, I have an answer, round a pretty circuitous route. I instigated a lunging routine, as suggested, largely out of necessity when it was declared that my saddle fitted two months previously really didn't fit any more. Was trying out various saddles to be told rather bluntly and rudely on the first one that he was lame and there was no way the saddler would fit a saddle to a lame horse. Had him checked, he wasn't lame so wondered if the saddle we tried didn't actually do him any favours. Went to another saddler (due to lack of availability of the first) and ordered a T8 high withered GP. It was going to be five weeks before it was ready, so we got lunging in earnest. We cured the right rein napping and we even got to the stage where I thought sod it, and climbed on bareback. He was a sweetheart. I will admit there were a few tail swishing moments on the lunge but I put this down to naughtiness more than anything else.

Fast forward to the day he was due the farrier and the vet came to provide him with his jabs. We have had to give him sedalin for shoeing - he was getting better but was always very agitated about having his hinds done. Now we know why.:( Anyway, we had a scary few days because he had an adverse reaction to the sedalin, having never suffered before. It didn't seem to take very well and he was still leaping about. Shoeing was abandoned behind. Then the sedalin hit him like a wrecker ball and he stood in his stable for 4 hours like a giraffe at a watering hole. Called the vet, who said wait for it to wear off and try some fresh air if he's standing a bit more upright....only he couldn't walk, his back end was all over the place. Next morning he was a little more alert but couldn't walk more than a couple of steps at a time. On vet's advice he was put in the winter corral with hay and water. (Another) Vet came later that day and he was in so much pain we thought we'd have to shoot him there and then.:( Managed to get him back to the stable by literally lifting his hind legs for him. Xrayed his back and pelvis in case of fractures.

So, no fractures but he does have KS at two points. One at the base of the withers, the other just behind the saddle. Vet has sent his xrays to Newmarket for assessment. Most likely, though, they will recommend the op. Having read up on things (through a veil of tears), I think Richard Coomer's ligament snip sounds the most promising. He wasn't behaving aggressively under saddle, we'd just have these odd bucking bronco moments in the canter on the right rein.

Of course, we have to get him moving again before the op is even considered. It is suspected that he has pulled the ligaments in his sacroiliac joints and these are improving rapidly - walking almost fine now and even managed to stand on his back feet yesterday whilst being led around the school :eek:

My question...if you have survived thus far... is: is my insurance likely to pay for the op? I cannot find an exclusion on my policy but I need to 'phone up to ask and I am dreading it. If they don't, I think it may have to be the end because I haven't got £4k lying around to pay for it, nor the means for procuring a loan as we have had a few horrendous years with redundancy, house in negative equity and rebuilding businesses, etc. I am insured to £5k.

In hindsight, that's probably a piece of string question but any knowledge would be gratefully received and provide me with the courage to pick up the 'phone. Thank you.
 
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Ok firstly don't panic - mine has 8 impinging processes and I literally had a meltdown then pulled myself together and thought worrying and crying wont help and certainly doesn't change anything. So I focused on getting her right. Mine had steroid injections and helps for a while so I have decided that mine will have the cotts equine operation she is booked in for the end of November. Svend Would have done the traditional surgery removing bone but I didn't want the general anaesthetic or the 3 month box rest as horse wouldn't cope and after speaking with Richard I believe his op will help- mine had never once bucked or reared ever - she was just tight over her back .

Speak to your insurance and am sure they should pay - my insurance runs out dec 6th and I am still waiting for confirmation they will pay but even if they don't I will pay for it - cotts charge about £1k
 
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Thanks, Kezimac. Good luck with your mare's operation. Please keep us posted.

Umm...I didn't have a 5* vetting. I bought him for £500 almost out of a field with two weeks of riding before hand. He had a trot up, heart rate and flexion tests by a passing vet. The girl off whom I bought him hadn't ridden him for 6 months as she found she was pregnant just after she had bought 5 months previously with a 5*. My vet said the 5* would probably not have picked up the KS.

Am hoping this doesn't impact on outcomes. Am relying on my litigation lawyer husband (when he has finished fighting the Government and gets off the wretched 'phone) to ram an argument home.
 
My 5 stage vetting most certainly wouldn't have picked up her kissing spine either but insurance tried to squirm out if paying saying Pre existing condition as vet said been there a few yrs from X-ray and I had to use the vetting to say I had done everything within my power not to buy a horse with a back problem!!! But honestly I think as long as u with a good insurer u should be ok - my friends horse had surgery few yr ago and her insurance kbis never quibbled - so just think it was mine trying it on! If u mention financial ombudsman they usually fold!
It's such a pain as u want to focus in getting horse better not stressing about insurance and the money etc!!!
 
Best thing to do is ring the insurance and talk to them. Get written permission from them before you proceed with anything. Get a written quotation/estimate from the vet to make sure you are not going to be clobbered with extra £££ on your bill that your insurance wont cover.

Does the insurance cover for hospital stays, or do you have to fund this yourself? If you have to fund this yourself, check the price. Last time I had a horse in they were charging me £50 per day to keep the horse there.
 
This is not really answering your question about insurance but addressing the problem of KS. The CE op I am sure is effective but there are alternatives which do not involve surgery. Physio, changes in riding, muscle therapy, osteo can get to the root of the problem. For me the KS op is a bit like lyposuction: it sorts the problem out but doesn't address the cause which is muscles holding the spine in an unnatural and very painful position. The causes of the muscle tightness are myriad but if you are up for it there are people out there having great results with KS.
 
Insurance should pay as long as its within the 12 months of when this problem first started.

You need to call and discuss it with them.

My mare had the op and insurance didn't pay.
But it was about 8 years ago. I was left with a £3000 bill :-(
But she made a totally recovery.
 
We have one with 6 kissing vertebrae, a dipped sacrum which causes her stifles to stick, every 3-6 months to Donna blinman for her bk to be done, needed to be ridden differently (or properly shall we say) and is long reined & is now doing amazing! There are alternatives to surgery if ur willing to work at it.. As goody goody says osteo is excellent, she also had acupuncture at first..
 
Thank you very much, everyone. I really appreciate it.

Yesterday I had a call from the vet with the Cambridge report on the xrays. The spine specialist suggests that we don't follow the surgery route for the time being as the spines are only kissing at two points! :D Where's the little bouncy man smiley when you need him?

So, we are to instigate a course of physio, osteo and long lining/ lunging with a number of exercises - he's pretty enthused by the carrot stretches! Am to wait a couple of weeks for his sacroiliac injury to heal before we start this. However, he showed he could stick his back feet above his head on his walk this morning, so I think he is improving.:rolleyes:

Am still not sure what to do about the insurance as I now have a £400 vet bill but obviously we have a year to deal with the KS.
 
My tb is off to Breadstone next tues for the standing op on two kissing vertebrae, claim form is with vets for completion - I am with the insurance group that has worst rep :( and policy runs out in 2 weeks. Hope to god they will pay especially as op price has been 'tweaked' downwards to fit cover amount! (Just goes to show how much vets make on operations if ins is covering!) I have no spare money to pay if they don't :(
 
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