Kissing spines. General question...

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amandap

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I'm reading a few threads and peoples experiences of their horses with this condition. I've no experience of it but I'm sitting here wondering how common is it and what causes it? Surely it's not genetic?

I'm just asking to get us all thinking if there is something we can do to reduce the incidence of this obviously excruciating condition? Could starting horses ridden life at young ages be a factor? How many horses may be suffering in silence, undiagnosed?
Or, am I away with the fairies here thinking there may be something we can all do to help prevent kissing spines?
 
With my horse it was done to either conformation and/or trauma.

He is very short coupled and a big mover and as a 3yr old jumped a 7ft hedge and fell on landing, although at the time showed no unsoudness.

He wasn't broken until 4yrs and was ridden on quietly and sympathetically.

Here is a pic of him looking fat post (unsucessful) surgery.

flynn-1.jpg
 
I think a rider can contribute - a very heavy rider may be enough to let the processes touch, a poor rider may make it uncomfortable for the horse to work correctly through his back so he may carry himself in a way to cause damage.

Stop breeding very short backs with big movement

Let horses mature fully before putting heavy work loads upon them.....

My young mare (6yrs old) was seen by Mary Bromiley last weekend and I was advised to continue to only work her lightly for the next 6 months at least as her hock and knee joints are still open. I was shocked - at 6 I thought she was mature enough to go on and do pretty much anything....
 
If riders can be a factor sometimes, I expect conditioniing horses to strengthen their muscles etc. to support their backs would help.

Interesting about short backed, big movers. I always assumed long backed horses were more prone to spinal problems? Also that shorter backs were more robust. Is it the movement that's the factor here do you think? Wonder how long backed big movers fare?
 
amandap said:
Interesting about short backed, big movers. I always assumed long backed horses were more prone to spinal problems? Also that shorter backs were more robust. Is it the movement that's the factor here do you think? Wonder how long backed big movers fare?
Click to expand...

I always thought that too, but as my vet pointed out they still have the same number of vetebrae in a smaller space. There is literally only a few mm inbetween each spinal process.

Whilst a short back with no impingement is a 'stronger' back, a long one can be very weak in terms of muscles and ligaments

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.2042-3306.2010.00113.x/abstract
 
Interesting Laura1812. Thanks for that, I need to think on it.
The link shows a study on WB foals, I wonder what the difference in a more adult horse may be, if there is one? Just pondering out load here btw.

Yes I have seen some of GH's stuff but I haven't 'studied' it, need to revisit and study.
 
http://www.abvp.com/student_case_report_files/2007/Medical management of dorsal.pdf

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.2746/042516402776181259/abstract

http://igitur-archive.library.uu.nl/student-theses/2010-0902-200342/UUindex.html (i have no idea what tecatherapy is - off to find out!)

Hmmmm.....

Tecatherapy is a physiotherapeutic technique that has been recently introduced in horses. It has been applied successfully in humans for the treatment of tendonitis.1 T.E.C. stands for Transferencia Electrica Capacitiva. Tecatherapy is a high frequency electromagnetic radiofrequency therapy that provokes a deep local temperature increase in the body. Its workings can be explained as follows:
Matter is made up of atoms. An atom is defined as the smallest particle of an element that can be identified as being from that element. An atom consists of a positively charged nucleus (consisting of protons and neutrons), with negatively charged electrons orbiting around it. If an electron is moved from the atom to another atom it becomes a positive ion. If an electron is added to the atom it becomes a negative ion.2
Most matter is electrically neutral and the atoms contain as many protons as electrons and have no net charge. Most of the electrically neutral matter has the property that an applied electric field can cause polarization. This can happen in two ways. If the atoms are symmetrical they can be unbalanced or polarized by the applied electric field which can compete with the atomic fields. Alternatively, there are molecules which are not electrically symmetrical. In that case, they can be ‘lined up’ by the applied electric field.3
The electric field affects only asymmetrically charged molecules of which water is by far the most common. An electric current is the flow of electric charge. In some materials the charge is carried by electrons, in others the charge is carried by ions.4
Like all electric circuits a power supply is necessary to drive the electrons around the conductors.2
The tecatherapy device works on the power of electricity. Tecatherapy is a bipolar system and works with a positive and negative charged electrode. The applicator electrode sends electric impulses to the dispersive electrode. The dispersive electrode is attached to the skin about 10 centimeters away from the painful zone that is to be treated. It is important that the whole surface of the dispersive electrode makes good contact with the body. Gel is used to improve this contact between the skin of the horse and the dispersive electrode. Shaving has to be considered to provide good contact between the dispersive electrode and the skin.
 
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Thanks Laura1812, very kind of you to search out those links and info. I may be reading and digesting for some time. lol
 
amandap said:
I'm reading a few threads and peoples experiences of their horses with this condition. I've no experience of it but I'm sitting here wondering how common is it and what causes it? Surely it's not genetic?

I'm just asking to get us all thinking if there is something we can do to reduce the incidence of this obviously excruciating condition? Could starting horses ridden life at young ages be a factor? How many horses may be suffering in silence, undiagnosed?
Or, am I away with the fairies here thinking there may be something we can all do to help prevent kissing spines?
Click to expand...

Work them long and low, don't use gadgets very often, don't work them too hard when young i think are the major factors.
 
My mare is 9 weeks post KS operation for the removal of 4 pieces of bone ( 7 impinging) she is a short backed, big moving warmblood and her condition is congenital. ( see photos of her xrays in vet section. Images, page 8)
 
Hi

I'm a newby to forums but thought I'd give you a chiropractor's perspective...

Due to the spinous processes being so close in the case of kissing spine, the integrity of the joint capsule and the mechanics in the way that it works are altered. Each individual joint should have a range of motion and freedom of movement. In the case of kissing spine this is severely reduced and leads to inflammation (pain) of the involved joint capsule. The muscles around the inflammed joints then tighten and go into spasm which also then creates a second pain cycle...this is why he doesn't like anything on his back!

We were told by a vet at college that kissing spines are hugely over diagnosed, so please make sure you get as many opinions as possible before going anywhere near the knife!

Due to the lack of motion in the kissing joints, its really important to keep the other joints around the affected area as healthy as possible (i.e moving well rather than getting tight due to compensation) to support the kissing areas. The muscles need to be strong and supple - chiropractic, osteopathy, physio and acupunture are all good for this. Working him long and low opens up and stretches the joints so this is relaxing for him. Also have you had his saddle checked recently?

Hope this helps, good luck....:)
 
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