Lameness experts please!

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poiuytrewq

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Ziggy is a 16.1 12yr old trotter X type. Can be a prat at times as you know but never ever sick or sorry. Always willing and eager to go forward.

I *think this started last week, mid/end of approx. Its a bit hard to say as out riding partner is only walking at the moment as a result its pretty much all we are doing too.

Hacked out, say Wednesday and he felt fine. Thursday am he didn't feel great, trotted him up the road and decided he was ok, friend behind agreed he looked fine. Got home and he had his back done. Trotted up for the chiro who mentioned his slightly stiff/ odd off hind. We know he has always looked slightly odd here since I've had him, and in his previous home. Its never caused issues and you wouldn't normally really notice it, so we thought nothing of it really.
Other than that he was pretty good, had a few minor adjustments, she was happy with him and how he felt.
Friday, I led him off Alfie and had to keep telling him to catch up- Usually and this is the reason I ride Alf and lead him, its the other way round and I'm holding him back.
He's out over night. Saturday morning i literally dragged him in, Sunday the same. At this point I tacked him up thinking a little hack alone would soon pep him up and get his spark back. We made it out of one gate into the other. He felt rubbish, but not specifically lame anywhere. Wanted to walk on the verge, felt stumbly (he's usually like a mountain goat, literally over any terrain.)
Got off, put him in and treated it as if her were laminitic just to be safe. big bed, bute, soaked hay. He seemed pretty miserable.
Tuesday he was way more himself and a vet here for someone else had a check, no pulses or heat or signs of lami. By this time he had filled legs in front and a fat off hind. I hoped from standing in (I know near hind should have been up too)
Looked sound and was walking out so i turned out overnight. Came in fine, took him for a wander he seemed fine, quick trot up, willing, went straight into trot when asked (in hand not ridden) So led him round a little road loop. fine.
Planned a very quiet plod round the village this morning to see how he felt but couldn't pick up hind feet to pick out. He's super polite. I do the fronts and the hinds are already up in turn. Initially i picked up the off hind reluctantly, couldn't get near at all, I persisted a bit and he snatched it up really high and fast and back down again.
Then wouldn't pick up either. Put a head collar on and he didn't really want to turn (was looking out the back window) then did the same high jerk up movement near hind before walking out of the stable.
That was so weird and the whole thing so not him and gone on for too long now so I have called his vet, she is away, whilst she is covered I don't know the practice and would prefer someone I know for this, Its not just a quite flu jab. I have a few options but have asked my neighbour so hopefully she is around.

Does this shout anything to anyone? I'm a bit stumped. Initially I'd have put money on front by feel but clearly not. I'm not sure if he's lame enough to block effectively, but is far from right.
 
Also vet.

The Appy got ataxic once and turned out her white blood count was off. Can't remember specifics but I'd had the vet out first thing, she told me it was probably nothing to worry about and then I got a call at work to say the vet was heading back to the yard and could either I meet her there or the staff help.

Never got to the bottom of what it was but it took her ages to bounce back and she's a pretty resilient type.

Having had random vets out for OOO call outs I think you just have to go with whoever you get annoyingly.
 
Ohh I’d not thought that. I’ll be honest having sadly seen my share of both viral and otherwise neurological cases I’d not put this one in that boat, however as I say it’s confused me so never say never.
IF it was neuro I’d even more want a decent vet on it though, having had a lovely but slightly clueless young vet out a few weeks ago it confirmed that experience is everything to me.
I’ve left a message for my neighbour (who is a horse vet not just the lady down the road)
If she doesn’t get back to me I will call another practice and see if someone can get to me tomorrow.
 
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poiuytrewq said:
Ohh I’d not thought that. I’ll be honest having sadly seen my share of both viral and otherwise neurological cases I’d not put this one in that boat, however as I say it’s confused me so never say never.
IF it was neuro I’d even more want a decent vet on it though, having had a lovely but slightly clueless young vet out a few weeks ago it confirmed that experience is everything to me.
I’ve left a message for my neighbour (who is a horse vet not just the lady down the road)
If she doesn’t get back to me I will call another practice and see if someone can get to me tomorrow.
Click to expand...
You can do your own tests to see whilst you wait for the vet appointment. https://www.bing.com/videos/rivervi...B519521E688640&mmscn=mtsc&aps=303&FORM=VRDGAR

Mark De Paolo is an expert in this field. Video clearly shows difference between affected and non affected neuro horses.
That said they can be ataxic for a number of reasons.

Photos of vet and assistant carrying out sway test on Lari, this was 11 days after the first sway test when he was dreadful. This was after his pull back accident when his chronic S.I injury became an acute one. He doesn't show signs of ataxia barely at all now.

At the time his foot placement was awful, he'd leave one hind directly behind the other, he was also happy to stand extremely base wide for a minute at a time when you placed his foot outside his normal placement and was equally as happy to rest one on top of the other for a couple of seconds. Not normal at all.
 

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Birker2020 said:
You can do your own tests to see whilst you wait for the vet appointment. https://www.bing.com/videos/rivervi...B519521E688640&mmscn=mtsc&aps=303&FORM=VRDGAR

Mark De Paolo is an expert in this field. Video clearly shows difference between affected and non affected neuro horses.
That said they can be ataxic for a number of reasons.

Photos of vet and assistant carrying out sway test on Lari, this was 11 days after the first sway test when he was dreadful. This was after his pull back accident when his chronic S.I injury became an acute one. He doesn't show signs of ataxia barely at all now.

At the time his foot placement was awful, he'd leave one hind directly behind the other, he was also happy to stand extremely base wide for a minute at a time when you placed his foot outside his normal placement and was equally as happy to rest one on top of the other for a couple of seconds. Not normal at all.
Click to expand...
Actually that’s a good shout. I’ve done these tests many times on him, the last being only a week or so ago so I know very well what’s normal for him.
I’ll do it when I get back there and see f there is any difference.
 
poiuytrewq said:
Actually that’s a good shout. I’ve done these tests many times on him, the last being only a week or so ago so I know very well what’s normal for him.
I’ll do it when I get back there and see f there is any difference.
Click to expand...
Be careful - I'd advise riding hat and soft surface just to be on the safe side. They can be unpredictable when ataxic.

If your not sure of the right responses then try an unaffected horse and you will soon see any visible differences between that and your own horse.

Good luck and try not to get too worried. I've seen Bailey drunk as a skunk on a sway tail test, only to be SJ 6 months later a different horse!
 
poiuytrewq said:
Ohh I’d not thought that. I’ll be honest having sadly seen my share of both viral and otherwise neurological cases I’d not put this one in that boat, however as I say it’s confused me so never say never.
IF it was neuro I’d even more want a decent vet on it though, having had a lovely but slightly clueless young vet out a few weeks ago it confirmed that experience is everything to me.
I’ve left a message for my neighbour (who is a horse vet not just the lady down the road)
If she doesn’t get back to me I will call another practice and see if someone can get to me tomorrow.
Click to expand...

My horse went a bit odd last week, very subtlety ataxic and off colour, he then had a mild colic, I think because he was finding it a bit stressful. He went straight onto steroids and bute- steroids will take down any swelling around the nerves in case it’s resulting from trauma, and the bute is just a good general non-steroidal anti inflammatory.
I understand if you think he's a laminitis risk this may not be your action plan, but I wouldn’t leave a case like this to chance.
 
TheMule said:
My horse went a bit odd last week, very subtlety ataxic and off colour, he then had a mild colic, I think because he was finding it a bit stressful. He went straight onto steroids and bute- steroids will take down any swelling around the nerves in case it’s resulting from trauma, and the bute is just a good general non-steroidal anti inflammatory.
I understand if you think he's a laminitis risk this may not be your action plan, but I wouldn’t leave a case like this to chance.
Click to expand...
I don't think laminitis at all now, it was just my initial- lets treat as if he is laminitic as it was a strange unlame lameness, having a few ponies I know that laminitis often presents in odd ways!

I've just got back home and as i pulled up instead of swinging easily round to ask for food he kind of pivoted. So I'm now confident whatever it is will be at least visible enough to show whoever comes out.

I registered with and called a totally new vet surgery. They have all the kit and I'm told just the two very good vets, one i know anyway from years back when he worked elsewhere. Hopefully they will be able to get to me today.
 
The parents among us will totally understand this....


The little sod just trotted up almost perfectly sound.
Has had full flexions, lunged etc., he gladly and helpfully held all his legs up for the flexions which considering I couldn’t even pick his feet out earlier was 😳
He then merrily bounced along barely being asked. I swear he winked at me at one point.
She said if she was being really picky he is slightly short right hind and a little puffy in both stifles but that was very even and she didn't think was causing any issues. So although i could have done without an emergency call out right now a clean bill of health is always good.
She seemed really nice, very thorough- she really did try and see something 🤣

So this is great, however as above I have experience with neuro stuff and know full well the first vet visit/s often end with me thinking I'm mad and being told there is no issue so I'll just get him back into routine and see how we go.
 
I will be being super vigilant.
I feel like it’s almost just a bit too good to be true but fml I actually need a break with horses going wrong!
Zigs the one constant, he’s an arse but he’s a lovely sound arse!
 
'Tis the season of tummy upsets and foot abscesses. Mainly due to change of diet because the grass has gone over. Not picking up a hind leg is exactly what Old Dobbin did last week - then an abscess burst from the frog in the other hind. Poor boy couldn't weigh bear on the abscessed foot. Hope your lad is coming sound.
 
Highmileagecob said:
'Tis the season of tummy upsets and foot abscesses. Mainly due to change of diet because the grass has gone over. Not picking up a hind leg is exactly what Old Dobbin did last week - then an abscess burst from the frog in the other hind. Poor boy couldn't weigh bear on the abscessed foot. Hope your lad is coming sound.
Click to expand...
I am late to this thread but was also thinking abscess as I read through the posts. We've had them come and go a few times before bursting through. If he goes off again, unless there is something else obvious, I would get the farrier to have a look at him.
Having said that, we had an elderly cob seen by vet and farrier several times over 6 weeks, with foot x-rays and then had her pts aged 31 because of ataxia. Possibly Cushings related although she had no other symptoms.
 
That’s really good news- but at the same time so frustrating!!! Hopefully it was a virus and it’s passed. Did the vet take any bloods?
Anyway, onwards and upwards and keeping everything crossed.🤞
 
He's never had an abscess, not that that means anything! No pulses or heat anywhere- that's now not just my opinion but two vets on, but yes another horse I had who suddenly wouldn't let me pick his feet out burst a huge abscess out of his coronet band- and he was totally sound!

He walked in fine this morning, again refused to pick his hinds up. Did something weird on the turn behind when i went in to tack him up. Decided to just get and and see how he felt and we did a loop round the villages in walk but trotted a few strides here and there to assess/catch up after pulling over for cars and he felt absolutely normal.
When we left the yard I'd said to my friend I didn't think we'd be going really.
He is being quiet for him at this time of year but after the past few winters I'm really not complaining about that and that's not a recent change, he's just not gone into his usual winter mode this year.

No didn't take bloods. I almost asked but he seemed so perfect and normal.
 
Despite my lot having more blubber than ideal I'm haying the fields because they've all given me signs of gut issues - fence chewing, mud eating, girthy

It looks like there's enough grass but something is out of whack because I've had big improvement all round with extra hay

My littlest cob looks "off" right hind when her gut plays up.
 
🤷‍♀️. He has ad-lib hay and stacks of grass still.
They won’t eat hay in the field yet, I try every so often but just have to scrape it up again untouched the next day.
 
poiuytrewq said:
Ziggy is a 16.1 12yr old trotter X type. Can be a prat at times as you know but never ever sick or sorry. Always willing and eager to go forward.

I *think this started last week, mid/end of approx. Its a bit hard to say as out riding partner is only walking at the moment as a result its pretty much all we are doing too.

Hacked out, say Wednesday and he felt fine. Thursday am he didn't feel great, trotted him up the road and decided he was ok, friend behind agreed he looked fine. Got home and he had his back done. Trotted up for the chiro who mentioned his slightly stiff/ odd off hind. We know he has always looked slightly odd here since I've had him, and in his previous home. Its never caused issues and you wouldn't normally really notice it, so we thought nothing of it really.
Other than that he was pretty good, had a few minor adjustments, she was happy with him and how he felt.
Friday, I led him off Alfie and had to keep telling him to catch up- Usually and this is the reason I ride Alf and lead him, its the other way round and I'm holding him back.
He's out over night. Saturday morning i literally dragged him in, Sunday the same. At this point I tacked him up thinking a little hack alone would soon pep him up and get his spark back. We made it out of one gate into the other. He felt rubbish, but not specifically lame anywhere. Wanted to walk on the verge, felt stumbly (he's usually like a mountain goat, literally over any terrain.)
Got off, put him in and treated it as if her were laminitic just to be safe. big bed, bute, soaked hay. He seemed pretty miserable.
Tuesday he was way more himself and a vet here for someone else had a check, no pulses or heat or signs of lami. By this time he had filled legs in front and a fat off hind. I hoped from standing in (I know near hind should have been up too)
Looked sound and was walking out so i turned out overnight. Came in fine, took him for a wander he seemed fine, quick trot up, willing, went straight into trot when asked (in hand not ridden) So led him round a little road loop. fine.
Planned a very quiet plod round the village this morning to see how he felt but couldn't pick up hind feet to pick out. He's super polite. I do the fronts and the hinds are already up in turn. Initially i picked up the off hind reluctantly, couldn't get near at all, I persisted a bit and he snatched it up really high and fast and back down again.
Then wouldn't pick up either. Put a head collar on and he didn't really want to turn (was looking out the back window) then did the same high jerk up movement near hind before walking out of the stable.
That was so weird and the whole thing so not him and gone on for too long now so I have called his vet, she is away, whilst she is covered I don't know the practice and would prefer someone I know for this, Its not just a quite flu jab. I have a few options but have asked my neighbour so hopefully she is around.

Does this shout anything to anyone? I'm a bit stumped. Initially I'd have put money on front by feel but clearly not. I'm not sure if he's lame enough to block effectively, but is far from right.
Click to expand...
Could be a grumbling abscess. Can cause to be funny about picking other foot up. Can get some really funny reactions with grumbling abscesses.
 
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