Lameness woes, help! *Hoof pics for geeks*

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stencilface

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Newsflash, Norman is lame again after being sound all winter. I thought it was grass related so he's been taken off it, was off for a week before the vet came out to make sure it was a different lameness. Anyway hoof testers picked up sore all the way round his near fore, sore in the heels area on his off fore. Only looking at pics from last month and this did I think they'd changed a lot. The heel seems to have collapsed? Why? His workload dropped off for a month due to a new baby, and then the grass footiness.

I'm not into lengthy investigations these days (bank account empty from all the other gets fees lol) Vet has suggested seeing if putting shoes on and supporting the heel more would help. I loathe to put them on as I've invested so much into barefoot, but will if it helps. I don't mind doing some xrays, as they're straightforward, but not interested in mri etc.

Last month near fore

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Today near fore
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Do you have any post rockley pics and there was a pre rockley pic I remember being surprised where his heels were when bare that it would be nice to see against. I think for whatever reason he is obviously inclined for them to underun the minute he is doing less. As such I am wondering whether some judicious trimming at any point he ends up doing less might help to keep heels engaged and stop the scooting under? Is it worth asking nic?

The alternative is that they are splatting a bit because of the grass?
 
lower work levels just as the new grass comes through would be a trigger for a lot of horses.

That near for has a pretty asymmetric sole view, SF. Asymmetry from on top isn't a worry, but the sole view would normally be expected to be a lot more symmetric. He also looks to have, from the slope in the hair line in the front on view, a lateral imbalance. Do you have a trimmer, I can't remember?
 
I know, it seemed to hit altogether, I'm so annoyed as spent all winter doing in hand work keeping him fit, have a few weeks off and I'm back to where I was! I'm actually amazed that it's changed that much in a month. Lateral imbalance is a Yes, but hadnt noticed that in the hairline, I still have much to learn.

Vet did suggest that it might be possible to get the trimmer to trim his toes back to achieve the same result as in shoes. People keep saying it's the hard ground, bit given he's been bf since 2013 and was out of work when the ground was hard I don't quite see it, although it's possible.

I do have a trimmer (although only been twice) trying to get hold of them.
 
I just need to come in here to make sure I'm not crazy for wanting to avoid shoes (as they won't fix the problem)

He does look sound (i always have to squint at him!) on one rein on the lunge on the arena, maybe doing some more of that (as he's comfortable doing it) would help his feet?
 
I think you've got fast growth due to the grass, lack of wear due to reduced work, and it's given you a lateral imbalance that for me needs trimming out before it causes issues unless you can get rid of it with more work.

The lameness I suspect is a touch of lgl, from the same cause. I would be removing him from the grass for a few days to see what happens.

Hope that helps!
 
Mine did not go to Rockley, and I am not a trimmer, but I have got two horses to school and light hack barefoot and sound. I did them myself, but my farrier and two qualified trimmers thought I had done a good job.

I think this self trimming idea is only good when they are wearing their feet balanced and regularly on a variety of surfaces, including a lot of road work.

The flare on the off fore looks out of control. I don't mind the foot re-modelling, but there should not be a surfeit of spare wall hanging off to one side IMO. I believe spare wall acts like a lever. Even in last month's photos you can see there the stress on the wall from the overhanging wall is causing a stress crack in the wall, and this looks considerably worse on this month's photo.

I do think your horse needs a trimmer, and to re-start road walking. I find that barefoot actually took me more time and trouble than shod, and if you are struggling at the moment for time with a new baby (very understandable) then it may be better to re-shoe.

Personally I would prefer not to shoe, and have more walking/ trimmer, but then I am not here with a new baby!

It may well be that the grass is not helping matters, but barefoot you do get to see any stress in the foot a lot quicker. If the trimmer does not have him more comfortable with the removal of the leverage from the excess overhanging wall, and the removal from grass does also not help, then I would have the vet re-visit.

It would indeed be interesting to see post Rockley, to see how they were then.

I am sorry he is not sound, I followed your posts with interest when he went, I considered sending mine there, but decided to do it at home first. I was rather envious ;);)
 
What is lgl?

He's on the grass tonight, but will be off tomorrow then have a new hopefully Norman approved muzzle arriving which will help.

The trimmer last came at the beginning of March and took off a tiny amount, so not aeons ago, but clearly I need to do something don't I!

I also want to exercise him to help with the grass intake, so it's a pain that he's not sound enough

Red - just goes to show, may have gone to rockley, but I'm still wandering in the dark most of the time
 
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stencilface said:
What is lgl?


The trimmer last came at the beginning of March and took off a tiny amount, so not aeons ago, but clearly I need to do something don't I!

I also want to exercise him to help with the grass intake, so it's a pain that he's not sound enough

Red - just goes to show, may have gone to rockley, but I'm still wandering in the dark most of the time
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In March there will not have been enough grass growth to speed the hoof along, but they will be growing like Billy-oh now. It would not work for everyone, but I got a rasp (started with a "Rider's Rasp for comfort and progressed to normal rasp) and took a bit off twice a week. I think especially if the horse has a niggle in a joint they don't want varying angles and lengths.

I took proper photos on or around the first of the month, as it is MUCH easier to be objective when looking at a computer screen than when in a stable. I loved watching them change. I also posted to a facebook group, and mostly it was "hoof envy" but someone did point out when they became unbalanced one month, with the coronet slightly off. I had missed that, so it was appreciated.

If he is out of work and on grass and you don't fancy tackling them yourself, I would think you may wish to have them trimmed more often than once a month if he has sensitive joints. TBH, with the wall as it is, I would have a trimmer first anyway before running a file round more regularly, and taking photos.

Oh, and you have done better than me, mine came completely sound from the minor suspensory injury, but became a wobbler and I lost him 2 months ago. :(
 
I have a riders rasp so should have been using that, I thought i was on top of his feet this year but shows me how quickly things can change. If I can't get the lovely trimmer soon might have to ask the farrier who's out next sat. Totally new farrier as ours has injured himself, but I think a new farrier is a good thing as he has no pre conceived ideas. I always found our normal farrier hard to talk to.

Sorry to hear about your boy Red :(
 
LGL low grade laminitis, my guess as to why he's lame if he's testing sore to hoof testers.
 
ycbm said:
LGL low grade laminitis, my guess as to why he's lame if he's testing sore to hoof testers.
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Yes I thought this, is there any other proof for it? He'll possibly have a pulse tomorrow after being on the grass overnight so that's I'm guessing an indicator given that the vet didn't pick up any abscesses. The chance of any rotation happening with lgl is low I hope?
 
Pretty miniscule chance of rotation at this stage,, when it's only sole corium giving pain. Proof is taking him of the grass and having him come sound. Fingers crossed.
 
ycbm said:
Pretty miniscule chance of rotation at this stage,, when it's only sole corium giving pain. Proof is taking him of the grass and having him come sound. Fingers crossed.
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Well he's not sound,although is sounder after being off the grass for a week. Will have to be off today as bright sunshine here after days of rain, the grass is going to go crazy, the lami app still has me in the green zone.
 
stencilface said:
Well he's not sound,although is sounder after being off the grass for a week. Will have to be off today as bright sunshine here after days of rain, the grass is going to go crazy, the lami app still has me in the green zone.
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I sorry I didn't realise he'd already been off it for a week. I would be worried about what has happened with the lateral imbalance then. It's enough to have strained something if he's has a hooley round the field.

You don't need this with a baby to look after, do you? :(
 
Not really, but don't worry I had my cry about it a few weeks ago now, I'm rational again now! (Well, as I ever was at least!)

Here is a video in walk, he's sound in wall in s straight line so might do some more of that until I can get a trimmer

https://youtu.be/khOcgS4eS_A

Trot, he's on and off here, as enthusiastic as ever!

https://youtu.be/t19OxlL00eI
 
I'm not one of the knowledgeable hoof geeks on here, but I'd strongly recommend keeping him as quiet as possible until that lateral hoof imbalance is corrected. My ex farrier allowed such an imbalance to develop on one of the late maxicob's hind feet (hidden from a superficial look as I was growing out the feathers), and he went on to get ringbone in it. Couldn't prove cause and effect, but the stress of the lateral imbalance could well have started the arthritic changes.

I know how hard this must be with a new baby as well. Horses are supposed to be fine roughed off, aren't they. Blimmin things.
 
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Ha I know, can't even be field sound can he?
:D

I think I might keep walking him on the road, where he seems comfortable in walk, and maybe some in hand work in the arena to help with whatever is making that flare. I had the physio out 2 weeks ago and hes wonky everywhere, it's what I spent the winter working on!

I did have a few swipes with the rasp to smooth of the crack too....
 
thanks for the extra pic SF, it just shows how they were at 'best'.

I suspect it has a been a bit of a combination of factors with grass and less movement and it does seem that his feet might well be predisposed to doing that at the drop of a hat. I would get hold of your trimmer and discuss what best to do now and then ideas to try and stop it in future, or at least gently encourage them not to do that!

ruddy horse!
 
I actually can't believe how much deviation there now is on that front hoof, I was so focused on his near hind flare I didn't pay attention to this enough clearly.

And yes, ruddy horse! One of these days I'll ride a sound horse, with any luck
 
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Had a look at the videos. Does he normally move as he does in the trot video ? Although clearly lame he looks short and shuffly on bother fronts to me and as though he's avoiding landing with his heels. He looks like he's showing a lot of knee action, some do just move like that but if he doesn't I'd b thinking he possibly may be sore in both fronts. Obviously laminitis can show in that way as can bruising. We have had a long period without rain where I am and rock solid ground so maybe there is some bruising / concussion contributing.
I hope u find an answer, it's hard going when there is an ongoing problem and it's hard to put your finger on the problem
 
They look v long to me can you up his road work I would definitely prefer that to trimming a horse with his history personally. Realise that could be hard/impossible with new baby so trim if you have to but I really think self trimming seems like the answer with him if he came home from Rockley sound.
 
Thanks I'm going to try and up his work yes as much as I can, baby in a sling out with me in the week probably.

He's never moved that well, certainly has always been economical (if I'm avoiding the word lazy!) He has other issues behind which affect his movement in front, he actually started on alphabute last week on the physio recommendation to try to make him a bit more comfortable to work through his stiff action.

Basically feel like I'm fire fighting all the time as soon as I sort one issue another pops up, that's horses though I guess.
 
Get the welshie driving, you sit in the carriage and tie him to the back, sorted :).

And no he is particularly irritating as a horse, however you are not the only one with an irritating one, and it does make the rest of us feel quite lucky. I do the firefighting on myself instead the horse is fairly good (well broken now but old so permitted!)
 
I think I'm just not as good as getting things early and run into these problems.

I do find people with badly shod sound horses very annoying though!

The pony driving would be a liability, we definitely wouldn't stay in walk
 
I'll get him trimmed asap, and walk work on the arena more perhaps, just feel now that a break has broken him more than rested him quite clearly!
 
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