Let's be blunt .....

[bonny]

Was going to reply on the national fatality thread but it's getting so bogged down with statistics that I thought I'd start another....
It is unimportant what the figures are, they are low, deaths happen, it's sad but it's part of owning horses no matter what they do.
We breed horses, thousands of them every year for our own use.
They all die, at our hands, anyone ever seen a horse die of old age ?
There are alot of hypocrites on here, wringing their hands over every racing death and then suggesting pts for other people's leisure horses....
What matters is how horses are treated during their lives and racehorses have the best of everything.
The Grand National is according to Tony Mccoy watched by 600 million people worldwide, it has a long history and we should be proud of it not constantly looking for ways to attack it.
It's been made as safe as possible, why not just watch it and enjoy it for what it is .....
Guess I'll be hammered for writing this .....

 

[teapot]

Well you won't be hammered by me! Good post

 

[MillbrookSong]

Me neither - well said!

 

[Dobiegirl]

Bonny you wont get hammered by me, its not my favourite race I much prefer the Cheltenham Gold Cup where the best horse nearly always wins. To me the GN is a spectacle but very much a lottery, it was tailor made for the likes of Red Rum who would never have been remembered but for the GN. But it is very much part of the NH calender and I for one would not like it to end. Like you I hate the hand wringing that accompanies any racing thread and its from people who know little to nothing about the sport or how racehorses are trained.

 

[pines of rome]

When I was younger I used to work in a national hunt yard so I know how the horses are cared for!
They do get the best of everything, but they are still kept in stables for most of the time unless they are being worked or racing and this is not a happy life for a horse!
I have witnessed them weaving,cribbing, boxwalking etc, we had one that had to be tied up all the time as her boxwalking was so bad she would work her self into a lather! So all this talk of them living like Kings is rubbish as far as the horses quality of life goes!

 

[teapot]

Tbf PoR that could be said for some riding stables...

 

[dressedkez]

Bonny you wont get hammered by me, its not my favourite race I much prefer the Cheltenham Gold Cup where the best horse nearly always wins. To me the GN is a spectacle but very much a lottery, it was tailor made for the likes of Red Rum who would never have been remembered but for the GN. But it is very much part of the NH calender and I for one would not like it to end. Like you I hate the hand wringing that accompanies any racing thread and its from people who know little to nothing about the sport or how racehorses are trained.

Cerainly will not be hammered by me either - but the 'safety factors' that are bing put in place for the GN - make it harder, less of a lottery, and certainly not the GN we have enjoyed of years past. I watched a bit on the local SW news tonight, where local trainers Pipe, Hobbs, Nicholls and other less known yards would have had multiple runners (or at least one or two) can't have very many this year because of the exacting conditions to get into the race - there was a time when I could have entered my pointer (who I know could have got 4 miles) but now that is a mega pipe dream - not going to happen - but he would have been possibly tough enough to have got around mostly unscathed, because he would have been well and truly trained for the job......having siad that pleased as punch to see a 100-1 horse winning the Foxhunters yesterday - as it should be!

 

[justabob]

Wont be hammered by me either. Simply can not compare Cheltenham Gold Cup to the GN. The Gold Cup is a precision race. The GN is a lottery...........very good post.

 

[amage]

When I was younger I used to work in a national hunt yard so I know how the horses are cared for!
They do get the best of everything, but they are still kept in stables for most of the time unless they are being worked or racing and this is not a happy life for a horse!
I have witnessed them weaving,cribbing, boxwalking etc, we had one that had to be tied up all the time as her boxwalking was so bad she would work her self into a lather! So all this talk of them living like Kings is rubbish as far as the horses quality of life goes!

You worked in ONE yard....there are thousands. Don't judge by that yard's poor standards. Same could be said about sj/event/dressage/dealers/riding schools/polo/endurance etc bad management is not a racing thing

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

Out of 120+ horses we have 2 box walkers, 8cribbers, 3 that weave only at feed times and one wind sucker. What I have an abundance of is pics of horses bucking, kicking, rolling, digging in the bloomin puddle ...!!!! and generally having a good time! We like relaxed donkeys. Not every yard is the same.

 

[dressedkez]

You worked in ONE yard....there are thousands. Don't judge by that yard's poor standards. Same could be said about sj/event/dressage/dealers/riding schools/polo/endurance etc bad management is not a racing thing

Well said. I Have a son who worked for several during his racing career- and that included TOP yards (or well publicised yards) and mostly the horses were treated as individuals and were turned out on a daily basis - had individual routines etc. Horses only genuinely win if they are happy, and I know that from training my own - they enjoy variety, hunting. being turned out, and doing stuff that is not always at the same time of day, with the same rider......having said that, there is the odd horse or two that likes a very regimented existance - and also thrives on 23 hours in the same box, training is all about horses for courses - and I do not think that you can knock Nicki Henderson (Sprinter Sacre), D Pipe (Dynaste) or Rebecca Curtis (AtFishersCross) for their individual styles at getting their horses at peak performance today.
PS - when I changed my horses routine one day - it had colic, and necessiated a visit from the vet........

 

[silu]

Not going to get slatted by me either. I wonder on which planet some posters live. The local riding stables have ponies and horses cross tied in pens with no window to look out of. They can JUST about lie down but that's it. They NEVER go out so their life is either going round and round in an indoor school or their pens. This is a BHS approved school.The hypocricy infuriates me.
From what I've read on some of the posts re the GN it's almost as tho there will be some people disappointed if GN is fatality free!

 

[Crugeran Celt]

I agree with you too. Just wanted to say that I had a 35 year old arab that just laid down and died in the field but had been relatively healthy until that point, vet said she had just died of old age, so it can happen. Wish people would make more fuss of all these ill bred animals being produced year after year and not being looked after properly instead of shouting over a TB that has been nurtured since conception and had the best of everything and may be unfortunate to lose its life doing the thing it loves.

 

[Caledonia]

Good post, OP!

 

[Honeylight]

Well said!
However the people who complain year in year out about the Grand National are those who on the whole have little experience of animals. I had a student active in Animal Aid & he was totally clueless about horses, of course the members could tell him any rubbish & he believed them.
I wish the RSPCA would put as much energy into stopping live transportations, traveller tethering & over-breeding of poor stock. However the former are just not glamorous enough, they don't get on the TV in their silly peaked caps & uniforms. The Grand National is a nice soft target & maybe a "jolly" for some of them to have a day out.
Sad though it is, a horse losing it's life in racing, will have had a good one, with expert care & a swift painless death. Not starving with no water on waste-land or travelling afraid & in pain to some unregulated slaughter house on the continent.
Think on people.

 

[Maesfen]

Totally agree OP and Honeylight too.

Long live the Grand National.

 

[ridefast]

Well said! I worked on ONE racing yard too, the horses all got daily turnout, went on the walker twice a day, were exercised twice a day, would hack out, school, jump, gallop. Their diets were all tailor made specific to the individual and broken down into several meals so they were trickle feeding constantly either on hard feed or hay. They were fit, healthy, relaxed and happy.
I've also been to a yard to view a pony for sale, the horses were kept in metal "stables" with no sunlight, concrete floor and ****** hay, they were all youngsters and never had any turnout. The owner told us how people kept calling the RSPCA but they didn't think she was doing anything wrong !!!
I also sent my little pony to a riding school for 4 years on loan. He went off a fit happy little pony who was hacking every day and regularly going out and about doing little show jumping etc, came back grumpy withdrawn and biting everyone. A year later he's just about back to his happy self.
Point is, everything needs to be kept in perspective. No I don't like seeing horses die BUT the horses that die in racing are doing exactly what they've been bred to do, trained to do, and the death is as quick as it can possibly be. I also know several people keeping their horses alive in pain and suffering because they can't give up on them.

 

[Miss L Toe]

Point is, everything needs to be kept in perspective. No I don't like seeing horses die BUT the horses that die in racing are doing exactly what they've been bred to do, trained to do, and the death is as quick as it can possibly be. I also know several people keeping their horses alive in pain and suffering because they can't give up on them.

Agreed, I have worked in several NH yards, the horses get three months off every year, turned out in well fenced and watered fields or paddocks. Yes there are exceptions, one horse [Spearmint Again] came back from owners facility with no condition plus lice.
Nearly all yards I worked in had them out twice a day, and fed three concentrate meals with chaff, plus hay twice a day.
I won't be watching the national, as I think there are ten too many horses in the race, and it is more about politics than racing.

 

[Parachute]

Well put OP, completely agree.

 

[ClobellsandBaubles]

I was having this convo with OH in the car just now. I find it odd that most of the people I know who rant about the GN also think that keeping horses outside in field where they could get cold or wet is cruel and god forbid they don't have coats on! Most non-animally people I know are astounded when I say that not every horse has to live in a stable all it's life they just don't understand it.

 

[JackAT]

When I was younger I used to work in a national hunt yard so I know how the horses are cared for!
They do get the best of everything, but they are still kept in stables for most of the time unless they are being worked or racing and this is not a happy life for a horse!
I have witnessed them weaving,cribbing, boxwalking etc, we had one that had to be tied up all the time as her boxwalking was so bad she would work her self into a lather! So all this talk of them living like Kings is rubbish as far as the horses quality of life goes!

Take teaforthree (who won me a nice little E/W stake ), on the documentary last night. Rolling in the mud, carting around the arena being turned out. IMO, that's the way race yards should be run, and it's just been proven as a tried and tested formula.

I also agree with the OP

 

[pines of rome]

I agree, if more were like that, the horses would be so less stressed out!

 

[lindsayanne]

Well said Bonny, at last someone talking sense!! I have been watching the GN since "Rummy" won his first in 1973. I remember watching it with my late father hoping one day I would have my own Rummy, well I have now and have had him for 15 glorious years. I work in a livery yard of 20 plus horses, some owners think that racing in general is cruel and also use of the whip, the same owners who tie their horse up for hours on end to go and chat and then crack it with a whip when it starts to scrape the floor!! There are worse things happening to horses all over the world and in our own country, remember Amersham?
At the end of the day it is a very sad by-product of what can be a very exciting sport. We all love our own horses and should support any sport that uses these beautiful creatures and treat them with the love and respect that they deserve whilst we have them. Perhaps more people should visit the Open Day at Lambourn next year and just see how these horses are looked after, the best feeds, warm rugs, plenty of exercise and lots of TLC and a great day out. Also try supporting those who take part in this great sport by supporting charities such as Greatwood and The Injured Jockeys Fund.

 

[Echo Bravo]

Well I keep telling my lot how lucky they are, they disagree as ususal, out during the day and in at night to the minute mind you not me them, have been now the nights are getting brighter, but no they are sticking to the old time, so just waiting for the grass to grow. If my lot saw how spoilt racehorses were they would demand the same treatment. (can't afford swimming or saunas) and unfortunately I'm the only groom and no they can't have 1 between 2 of them, they will have to wait till the hubby retires and then they will not have much joy of a 1 to 1. So yes the modern racehorse basically has it all, which my horses would love to aspire too and I should imagin most other horses as would as well.

 

[dressedkez]

Well I keep telling my lot how lucky they are, they disagree as ususal, out during the day and in at night to the minute mind you not me them, have been now the nights are getting brighter, but no they are sticking to the old time, so just waiting for the grass to grow. If my lot saw how spoilt racehorses were they would demand the same treatment. (can't afford swimming or saunas) and unfortunately I'm the only groom and no they can't have 1 between 2 of them, they will have to wait till the hubby retires and then they will not have much joy of a 1 to 1. So yes the modern racehorse basically has it all, which my horses would love to aspire too and I should imagin most other horses as would as well.

Lovely sunny day today, and out riding one could nor believe how many hairy cobs were turned out in fields still strait jacketed into their nose to tail NZ rugs.......We chucked out our TB's with their only just beginning to grow our hunter clips, but they loved it - just like Liverpool lasses on a sunbed!

Good GN - no equine fatalaties - and a cracking winner......wow the sun was shining just about everywhere today!

 

[Tiffany]

I choose not to watch it or bet on it simply because I'm not a racing fan.

 

[Echo Bravo]

Mine have no rugs on this winter what so ever for the first time and 2 have lost weight the 2 youngsters have gained weight, so have learnt a lesson, my older ones need a lightweight rug on turnout and stable the young ones maybe turnout in bad weather, but mine aren't clipped or worked and the fact I'm feeding them well.

 

[dressedkez]

Mine have no rugs on this winter what so ever for the first time and 2 have lost weight the 2 youngsters have gained weight, so have learnt a lesson, my older ones need a lightweight rug on turnout and stable the young ones maybe turnout in bad weather, but mine aren't clipped or worked and the fact I'm feeding them well.

Mine have been rugged up all winter - and have come in tonight to have rugs popped back on - the point I was making, is that it was a lovely sunny day, so a day to strip off the rugs for a few hours! And it was a shame that others were not doing similar. It has been a hellish winter for horses, and the last sunny day (about a month ago) when I turned them out without rugs, I was embarrased as they looked terrible (despite very good hay and feed) but a few dry weeks has bucked them up tremendously, and today, I was happy to feel that the RSPCA was not going to pay a call!
Whilst out riding today - we must have passed about 50 horses turned out in fields (some in rugs / some not) but how many did we see being ridden out - just one! I find it quite amazing that all these horses / ponies are being kept, but not ridden - is it just my bit of Devon - or do people see this in their own areas too??

 

[Echo Bravo]

Mine haven't been worked as only have 2 that at the moment are rideable as the other 2 haven't been backed, and as the weather has been so bad I'm sure not many other owners that don't have an in/outdoor areana so can understand why they rug their horses, maybe they aren't stabled and with this bitterly east wind, would make any horse drop weight, and yes it's been nice today with a bit of sun, but the temperature drops at night and even some hairy horses when you feel under their coats are very thin.

 

[Scarlett]

When I was younger I used to work in a national hunt yard so I know how the horses are cared for!
They do get the best of everything, but they are still kept in stables for most of the time unless they are being worked or racing and this is not a happy life for a horse!
I have witnessed them weaving,cribbing, boxwalking etc, we had one that had to be tied up all the time as her boxwalking was so bad she would work her self into a lather! So all this talk of them living like Kings is rubbish as far as the horses quality of life goes!

A sweeping generalisation - I know a chaser who was raced, and won, from the field. Her trainer in Lambourn had t/o and says it's an important part of his horses routine, she was happiest in the field so that's where she lived! She's retired from racing now, still lives on the yard, hacks out and takes the young jocks up the gallops in between rolling in the mud and keeping the younger horses in line in the field.

There are many livery yards and competition yards where horses don't get out, and what about the dressage/sj yards who consider their horses to precious to turn out?

Please don't tar every racing yard with the same brush as your own bad experience.