Livery late payers

Wagtail

Wagtail

Horse servant
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What do other yard owners do with people who persistently pay late and only after lots of chasing? It really gets me down having to chase people for money. Livery is payable on the 1st of each month in advance. All my liveries are full or part so we are talking significant money, especially if they have two horses! I am going overdrawn because of it.

So what I currently do is bill them at on the 1st of each month, send a reminder on the 7th or 8th, but this has been ignored. I will ask in person today, but I think if I have to chase up again I will give notice. What do others do? I have only had one late payer in the past and an email saying that if the money is not paid by x date in the month then it would result in immediate notice to leave has solved the problem. I guess I'm going to have to do it again. :(
 
I wonder if you could persuade them to set up a standing order? Not sure if that's very helpful - you could even knock a bit off the price as encouragement. At least you would then be more likely to get the money in your account on time. Other than that, I'm not sure, chasing money is always awkward and horrible.
 
If its due the 1st I would bill on 25th so they have advance warning that the money is due(I'm sure they already know !) then if its not with you by the 2nd I would call or speak to them. Is it easier for them to bank transfer /standing orders as I've found in the past depending where I was driving to I had to go to the cash point then drive back on myself. Not a major but just a bit of a pain sometimes if I was busy, but if I could have Bac's the money would have been so much easier.

You could also introduce fees for late payments, maybe that would get them to make payments on time.
 
If it is a fixed amount per month, then what about a direct debit? Of course extra not usual costs would still have to be billed separately, but maybe this would ensure you got the basic monthly amount? I would think this would suit Full and Part, maybe not DIY.

My reasoning is that people who cannot cover a direct debit then have bank charges added. Which would encourage them to have their livery costs ready.
 
Standing order is the way to go. I currently pay cash every 4 weeks (it is the way they want it) and it is a PITA to remember (I don't get a bill as it is the same every month). I have set up a reminder in Outlook now!

ETS - late payers are taking the Mick. You could offer an incentive for standing order payments (i.e. price it is now) and put all your non standing orders on a livery with a £25 a month surcharge.
 
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If it's due on the 1st then don't bill on the first. Bill 3-5 working days in advance, this is what my yard does.
If your livery contract doesn't already cover this aspect it should, and therefore I would amend it maybe to include a 5% surcharge for every 7 days the bill remains unpaid, or suchlike.

Repeat offenders, give notice if a face-to-face reminder does not have an impact.
 
Make them sign a new contract stating livery will be paid on x date of the month otherwise admin charges of an additional £x will apply and be added automatically to the bill each month. I would name an actual sum because it tends to hit home more clearly. After all, you do a lot of work in checking and chasing up late payments. Provide them with a standing order form to fill in and hand back to you. Get as many of them to pay by standing order as possible. Get their bank details on your contract and state that you will reclaim any unpaid sums either by retaining a right of lien over their property on your premises or by pursuing them in a Small Claim.

I also think theres merit in having a monthly payment which is the same each month - people are more likely to pay a consistent amount than an amount which might vary widely. Obviously, this isn't always possible but I would try to organise your business more in this way if you can.
 
Most yards I have been to you pay a month in advance for standard services and in arrears for extra. Pay within 10 days or 10% added to your next bill. One yard I had to give a months deposit plus a month in advance and a deposit for keys - that was nearly £1000 in total I had to find up front. I got my whole deposit back when I left.

I would insist that anyone who is a regular poor payer pays using standing order or direct debit or they can find somewhere else. On occasion I've been a bit late paying mainly through being disorganised but not habitually so.
 
I would introduce late fees to cover your overdraft fees and some because it is really unfair and yes if they don't pay on a regular basis then it would be notice time.

We pay monthly in advance too and I know a couple of people who have set up a standing order with the farmer. I keep meaning to do it as it would be so much easier than taking the money out, having it in an envelope and either forgetting to hand it over or not being able to track the farmer down any time I'm up! I hate carrying that amount of money round too but I want to hand it over in person rather than just leave it somewhere! I do often end up being a little late because of that but only by a few days and the farmer has never chased me up although sometimes I'm early paying it as I get paid on the last Friday of the month.
 
I sympathise. As others have said, a standing order is the best and easiest way. And I always find that the nicest and most helpful livery is the one who always pays late!

However, with consistent late payers I get grumpy. I cannot understand the mentality. If you get goods in a shop you don't expect to walk out and pay later. Why should livery charges be any different? It's dishonest, pure and simple.

A YO friend of mine got so fed up he 'confiscated' all the horse's tack. Unorthodox - but the girl paid up next day.

I'm always happy to help where there is genuine hardship, and those liveries have always paid me back in full. But continual late payment is manipulative and often deliberate. If you can't afford to pay for your horse - don't have one!
 
I have to say I agree with the billing date. Make it up to a week before payment is due. I would also serve them notice if they refuse to pay when told consistantly. Sometimes people can forget, Ive done it then went into my money book and went ***** my livery money and had to drive back to give it.

You cant make everyone pay by standing order but you can make it a clause that you will now levi a surcharge for those not paying within a working week of the payment due date.
 
Rose Folly said:
I sympathise. As others have said, a standing order is the best and easiest way. And I always find that the nicest and most helpful livery is the one who always pays late!

However, with consistent late payers I get grumpy. I cannot understand the mentality. If you get goods in a shop you don't expect to walk out and pay later. Why should livery charges be any different? It's dishonest, pure and simple.

A YO friend of mine got so fed up he 'confiscated' all the horse's tack. Unorthodox - but the girl paid up next day.

I'm always happy to help where there is genuine hardship, and those liveries have always paid me back in full. But continual late payment is manipulative and often deliberate. If you can't afford to pay for your horse - don't have one!
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Echo this!! It annoys me to death when people pay late but luckily most of ours are now on direct debit so only a small number pay cash and they are ALWAYS late! How would they like it if they went to the bank on pay day only to find their wages haven't gone in as expected and all their bills hadn't been paid because of it???!! For some very strange reason, clients think it's OK to withhold their livery for a few days or longer. It's something that has puzzled me for years. Get them on SO or DD AND BE DONE WITH IT! Otherwise as previously suggested start adding a surcharge for late payment. My vet does this ��
 
When paying a Credit Card you are billed in advanced , given a date when the bill is to be paid and if this is not done then a charge is endured normally £12. Most CC companies give you a week after that date and then phone you up and keep doing so (at all times of the day and evening including Sundays) until you pay up. Even then you will still have been billed the extra £12.

I have always billed by liveries 10days before the bill is due. They are then given 2 days (Hence 12days) after the first to pay the bill. They are then charged an extra £10 for every 2 days they are late. I have only ever had 2 liveries that I have had to do this to and of them I gave one notice.
Most of my liveries pay by DD.

You are running a business not a charity and if the service you are giving is Full or Part livery it is you that is out in all weathers not them.
 
The current yard I'm on and the previous both insisted on standing orders and I can't see why anyone would object. Previous yard was DIY and current is assisted and part. Any extras are billed and I pay cash.
 
I pay weekly by standing order, any extras are paid on top in cash, usually I'm chasing my YO to tell me what I owe! I openly admit I'm terrible at remembering to pay cash, I have the memory capacity of a fish so I was delighted when they said I could pay by SO.
 
I'd really suggest a moving to standing orders for main livery cost & just billing extras. Easier for you & for the liveries.

You have to be tough and quickly for the non payers. They will take the p if you don't!
 
It's part of our contract that we set up a standing order to cover the livery, any extras are billed on top and are to be transferred to the YMs business account, no cash involved. Works for me.
 
I used to be on a DIY livery yard where you used to pay by cheque, I hated it as I would always be late handing it in. On the next yard we were so long getting a bill for grass livery, for some reason it was do with setting up a bank account, we got 3 months livery free, Direct debit is so easy, if its late you know straight away some things wrong, ask for a refundable deposit of one months livery, and one month in advance with extras billed in areas.
You need to get this sorted out before you are paying bank charges and their bad debt ends up being yours.
 
Definitely bill in advance by a few days; expecting to be paid the same day is a bit unrealistic. I run a very tight budget at times as my (self employed) work is quite seasonal and sometimes it takes me a few days to juggle finances around to pay livery due to my own clients taking a few weeks to pay me.

My livery varies depending on how many weeks in the month and when she has been on Part rather than Full then the monthly payments vary if I have had to ask for cover on the odd weekend away etc so Direct Debit/Standing Order of a set amount doesn't suit all.

Give people some warning and it should then be in on time. Sometimes I am also really busy and don't get a chance to log onto internet banking to transfer for a few days but I am a good payer so as long as I have warning I will make sure it is in by the date needed. There has been the odd time I have been a day or two late but that is because my YO has been late preparing invoices and hence not given me enough days to rearrange my finances/chase my clients to pay me!

Perhaps you could send out a text reminder a few days before it is due also to bump it in people's memories.
 
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I should have said earlier. I pay a standard amount for assisted DIY by Standing order each month, any extras (such as a days full livery) are paid in cash direct to YO. We have a white board in the feed room where you put what dates you need full livery on, The YO does the horse on those days (it also serves as a reminder for her) and the list stays up untill you pay the YO
 
Thanks everyone for all the good suggestions. Although the livery is a fixed amount, sometimes there are extras and sometimes there is money knocked off if one of the horses is away for a length of time so it varies. However, in view of the repeated late payments, I think I should insist on a standing order each month.

This client was issued with a contract but has never signed it and returned it. However, I think a contract is enforceable even without a signature. The contract says the livery is due on the 1st of each month and that it must be paid within 7 days. It really annoys me having to chase up money as it is a very unpleasant thing to have to do and not conducive to good feeling!
 
There's a big difference between a livery forgetting the date & therefore paying late & a livery being evasive & delaying payment deliberately. I'd give the persistant late payer a written warning regarding this & tell them the next time they will be asked to leave. Chasing money is never a pleasant thing to do & you shouldn't have to. Your liveries have chosen to own a horse & be at your yard so they know what needs paying & when. Don't be fobbed off.
 
Just bill them for extras on top.

I'm surprised you reduce their set livery if their horse goes away. Never heard of a yard owner doing that as you have bills to pay whether the horse is the or not.
 
I too would go to DD and bill the extras separately .
This may be resisted by current cilents but I would write a carefully worded letter explaining because of the late payment cost an extra charge per month will be levied by those who don't use DD.
Difficult and awkward if you have known people for years donr envy you this .
 
wagtail, my yard is similar, when I took my horse away over christmas my YO calculated what I'd be saving on my bill and that now sits there as money to be used towards extra services, so the next few times I have full livery for a day (happens when I go away with work or just want a night off) I dont have to pay cash for it!.
 
We send out our invoices on the 24th of every month and almost all of my clients pay via bank email transfers. Payments are almost always in my bank by the 31st of each month. I do have a couple of liveries who are struggling at the moment and I don't mind them paying me bits and bobs as they can afford it because they discussed this with me; they didn't just not pay. I have a good working relationship with all of my liveries and I have to say if anything out of the ordinary crops up they always come to me to speak it over. I'm pretty flexible and can work around their erratic (and sometimes non-existant payments).
 
I'd treat it like renting a flat/house, where you have to set up a direct debit or standing order when you sign up, and if it isn't paid on the agreed date, there's a charge per day - one flat I had, the charge was £50 a day! I have never been late for any payments as just set up regular ones with my online banking.

Like others have said, any extras could be billed seperately.
 
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