Looking for examples......

[jules9203]

I'm giving a stable management session next week where we are looking at vetting - stage 2 & 5. I was wondering if anyone had any examples of things they have discovered about a horse (after a stage 5 vetting) that wasn't picked up and they thought it should have been? For instance a person I know got the horse home to find it had really bad teeth issues and is going to cost a lot of money and a couple of yrs to sort. This hadn't shown in the way the horse worked or it's contact. The vets had aged the horse but not mentioned the issues.
I am not trying to point the blame in any direction but want to make the group aware of what might not be picked up in the vetting. If I do use any of the examples I will not use any names. Thank you in advance x

 

[VRIN]

Mine had shivers and it wasn't picked up on a 5 stage vetting. Farrier spotted it straight away (2 days after purchase) and once he pointed out the signs it was very obvious and I had seen the signs during viewing but hadn't associated with shivers.

 

[asmp]

Mine had a wound under his jaw. He had a winter coat so was quite fluffy but it should have been picked up. (Later had xrays by a different vet - looked as though when horse had put head down to eat, he’d stabbed something under his jaw). It had pus coming out of it and I had to inject him with antibiotics. He still has a scar under his jaw 14 years on.

He also had a broken tooth. Insurance refused to pay out at first as said he probably had it when I bought him. A letter from my vet persuaded them to pay half.

 

[ycbm]

There were two that were responsible for me giving up vetting.

I bought a horse that was base narrow. The forefeet were closer together than the top of the legs. She strained the inside branch of a suspensory ligament and I later read that base narrow conformation predisposes horses to that injury.

A second was passed with a shoe off in spite of falling a flexion, the vet said it was a bruise on the rough ground. The horse had a diagnosis of navicular within months and was paid out as loss of use in the days when insurance was easier.

I bought a horse that had a 5 stage vet by the previous buyer, a dealer. It was a proper vetting, nothing dodgy about it. I bought the horse at 4 and at 10 x rays showed that he was a classic wobbler and had been born with deformed vertebrae at C3/4. He was very ataxic at that point and PTS.

I wonder how much neck arthritis gets missed. I've never seen vets test a neck for flexion on a 5 stage and a young horse I know that was vetted got LoU on neck arthritis after investigation for behaviour that started soon after purchase, so it was likely present at the vetting.

ETA I do think vetting is a lot more rigorous these days than my first two examples.
.

 

[Caol Ila]

Pregancy. Haha. Except it was a 2 stage, and the mare didn't look pregnant (she foaled three and a half months after said vetting), so I don't know how the vet would have caught it without a pregnancy test. That said, when I tried to add the foal to the insurance, the insurance company got very shirty because I hadn't insured her as a broodmare. You think?!!! And I couldn't change that at the last minute, even though no one discovered the pregnancy until a week before foaling. And vets had seen her in the interim three months for strangles tests, vaccinations, etc. Insurance company grilled me on the vet check, and why the vet hadn't picked up the pregnancy, and they made me send them the vetting paperwork. And they wouldn't insure the foal until he was thirty days old or the mare for any pregnancy-related complications. They gave me a hard time about the vetting not flagging her being foal, and I was like, mate, you can talk to the vet if you want.

 

[cauda equina]

But looking for pregnancy isn't part of a vetting - or is it?
I bought a mare who turned out to be unexpectedly in foal after a 5 stage
Maybe when buying a mare (which I never will again) it would be sensible to ask for a preg test as an add-on to the vetting

I also had one who was diagnosed with career-ending navicular syndrome 5 months after a 5 stage
Whether the signs were already there and were missed, or there was nothing to find at the time, is anyone's guess

 

[w1bbler]

5 stage vetting, 4 months later kissing spine & 'navicular'
I realise the symptoms were there from day 1, once I realised what was wrong, she was bilaterally lame, so harder to spot on a horse you've only just met

 

[Trouper]

Sorry - bit off topic - but reading others' experiences, I am beginning to think that it would be better to x-ray spines and all 4 legs for a vetting rather than some of the traditional tests such as flexion. It seems as if so many more serious issues can be passed off as a "bruised foot" or "overdue a farrier visit" (which was the case with my mare).

 

[Spottyappy]

Fairly Recently, a friend had one passed which had a tooth missing, and right At the front, plus a tooth that crossed over. Also, it was lame with what turned out to be a long standing injury.
This resulted in the vets insurance making a payout for the difference in the value of the horse, which was basically 2/3 of its value.

 

[Ossy2]

I had the opposite problem, I was told the horse I was having vetted was blind in one eye and partially sighted in the other and not to buy. Luckily I was buying from a friend who agreed to have the horse investigated at a equine hospital where she turned out to be fine, so with those additional reports I bought and insurance was happy to insure including the eyes.

 

[Caol Ila]

But looking for pregnancy isn't part of a vetting - or is it?
I bought a mare who turned out to be unexpectedly in foal after a 5 stage
Maybe when buying a mare (which I never will again) it would be sensible to ask for a preg test as an add-on to the vetting

I also had one who was diagnosed with career-ending navicular syndrome 5 months after a 5 stage
Whether the signs were already there and were missed, or there was nothing to find at the time, is anyone's guess

No, it isn't, but my point is that the insurance company acted as though it should have been!

 

[Toby_Zaphod]

A pro rider I know was selling a horse to the US, it had been viewed on video. This horse was many thousands of pounds, a show jumper. A vet came to vet it & he scanned the feet & on checking them he said the horse has failed as it has a hole in each of his suspensories. That knackered the sale. Later the rider took the scans to a top vet in Sheffield. He looked at the scans & stated there was nothing wrong with the suspensories Other vets also agreed there was nothing wrond with the horse. The incompetence of the vet cost the rider many thousands of pounds & I mean mega money.

 

[JJS]

Pregancy. Haha. Except it was a 2 stage, and the mare didn't look pregnant (she foaled three and a half months after said vetting), so I don't know how the vet would have caught it without a pregnancy test. That said, when I tried to add the foal to the insurance, the insurance company got very shirty because I hadn't insured her as a broodmare. You think?!!! And I couldn't change that at the last minute, even though no one discovered the pregnancy until a week before foaling. And vets had seen her in the interim three months for strangles tests, vaccinations, etc. Insurance company grilled me on the vet check, and why the vet hadn't picked up the pregnancy, and they made me send them the vetting paperwork. And they wouldn't insure the foal until he was thirty days old or the mare for any pregnancy-related complications. They gave me a hard time about the vetting not flagging her being foal, and I was like, mate, you can talk to the vet if you want.

That’s so unlucky! I also phoned my insurers when I found out Mary was pregnant, expecting her not to be covered. The lady on the phone acted like it was no big deal! She said her policy still covered her for everything except routine pregnancy-related costs and not to worry. It was such a relief! ??

 

[Caol Ila]

That’s so unlucky! I also phoned my insurers when I found out Mary was pregnant, expecting her not to be covered. The lady on the phone acted like it was no big deal! She said her policy still covered her for everything except routine pregnancy-related costs and not to worry. It was such a relief! ??

Who are you with? Maybe I’ll change next year, just out of principle. I was pretty annoyed that they gave me a hard time about the vetting and not insuring her as a broodmare from purchase. You’d think they’d never come across a BOGOF before.

 

[jules9203]

Thank you everyone this has been really helpful xx

 

[catembi]

I too have had a shiverer pass a 5 stage and also 2 x PSSMs. PSSM isn’t part of any vetting, but is an example of what can go horribly wrong despite thinking that you’re ‘safe’ with a vetting. ?

 

[HorsesRule2009]

The thing with vetting is its only what the vet finds on the day.
Further up someone has said about navicular and kissing spines, did you have the bloods run that were taken at the vetting?
X-rays can be added on but don't come as standard, the same with teeth.

 

[SussexbytheXmasTree]

Wobblers and I raised some queries with the vet at the vetting pertaining to things I’d noticed about his posture and way of going. It was my first adult purchase about 20yrs ago and I didn’t know about wobblers then but unfortunately do now.

My younger horse (bought at 9 now 12) also passed a 5-stage but he’s very unevenly muscled which I found out when I had a saddle fitted and I believe it’s linked to a hind-end issue. Because I’ve had so many issues with horses over the years and not much luck with veterinary treatments I’m just on a long term programme of management and rehab to my own design with osteopathic treatments and similar. He’s very happy in the work that I do so I’m hoping I’m getting somewhere.

I don’t think 5-stage vettings are fit for purpose and need an overhaul. I trust my physio/osteo to pick up more issues than any vet.

 

[asmp]

I'm giving a stable management session next week where we are looking at vetting - stage 2 & 5. I was wondering if anyone had any examples of things they have discovered about a horse (after a stage 5 vetting) that wasn't picked up and they thought it should have been? For instance a person I know got the horse home to find it had really bad teeth issues and is going to cost a lot of money and a couple of yrs to sort. This hadn't shown in the way the horse worked or it's contact. The vets had aged the horse but not mentioned the issues.
I am not trying to point the blame in any direction but want to make the group aware of what might not be picked up in the vetting. If I do use any of the examples I will not use any names. Thank you in advance x

Many years ago I was selling a pony and the vet doing the vetting commented to me that he’d probably never pass a horse for his client as she would sue him as soon as something went wrong! (Not long after she didn’t buy him the pony got laminitis. I then gave him to another lady who had liked him as I was unable to rehab at that particular yard. He recovered well but then was PTS because of liver problems ?)

 

[little_critter]

Many years ago I was selling a pony and the vet doing the vetting commented to me that he’d probably never pass a horse for his client as she would sue him as soon as something went wrong! (Not long after she didn’t buy him the pony got laminitis. I then gave him to another lady who had liked him as I was unable to rehab at that particular yard. He recovered well but then was PTS because of liver problems ?)

Slightly off topic, I was having a horse vetted. The sellers husband asked who the vet was, and when I told him complained that that vet never passed anything (a bit off speaking like that to a potential buyer I thought).
Ironically the horse failed very early on due to it being blind in one eye which came as a surprise to all. Seller had it checked out with their own vet who agreed it was blind.
Worked out well for me because a week later I found my heart horse.

 

[SEL]

I too have had a shiverer pass a 5 stage and also 2 x PSSMs. PSSM isn’t part of any vetting, but is an example of what can go horribly wrong despite thinking that you’re ‘safe’ with a vetting. ?

I never had the Appy vetted (freebie) but 2 different vet practices have told me they'd never have considered PSSM. They also wouldn't have thought to mention night blindness despite her colouring meaning it's 100% certainty

 

[Red-1]

I had one vetted, passed with flying colours, even front feet X rays.

I picked it up next day, had an uneventful drive home, then 4 1/2 hours later it dropped dead with a heart attack.

Insurance paid out (to my surprise) and also said it was more common than you would think.

 

[JJS]

Who are you with? Maybe I’ll change next year, just out of principle. I was pretty annoyed that they gave me a hard time about the vetting and not insuring her as a broodmare from purchase. You’d think they’d never come across a BOGOF before.

She’s insured with KBIS. I remember being very surprised that she was still covered. I fully expected her not to be!

 

[spacefaer]

Teeth are not part of a 5 stage.

Had a vet comment on the "potential sarcoids" which turned out to be either end of an old cut, where the scar tissue had bunched up.
Completely missed the stonking sidebone on both front feet.