Looks like lami to my inexperienced eyes...

Sol

Sol

Well-Known Member
Joined
30 May 2009
Messages
4,133
Location
Shropshire, England.
Visit site
:(

Continuing from http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?p=9855125&posted=1#post9855125

Just been out again to give the pony more hay. Felt for pulse, unfortunately got nothing to compare to here, but does seem very very (I do mean ever so slightly) stronger in front.
Felt hooves.... front feet warm, back feet perfectly cool to the touch.
He seems perfectly content moving about his stable, eating his hay, doesn't look in pain at all.
He's moving to a new yard tomorrow, straight onto rubber mats & a nice deep shavings bed. I'm going to call the vet first thing.
In the mean time... feel free to bombard me with information. I know so little about laminitis Im embarrassed by it. Feel like everything's going wrong right now!
 
If it IS lami you might have caught it early if the pulse is very mild - is he showing the typical stance? (when you said earlier he was resting his front feet, is he leant back on them slightly?) A slightly increased temp is also another sign of it.
Our girl has Cushings and kept getting lami because of it - she was and still is treated like a strict lami pony - restricted muzzled grazing, double netted soaked 'old' hay (not freshly cut), low sugar feed, regular exercise, regular trimmings on feet; even if she never has lami again, she will always be managed like this.
If he is going onto a shavings bed, that's the best for it, just make it quite deep for him.
Generally, when Kelly came down with lami, the vet would come out, say box rest, give her bute and tape pads onto her feet to support her.
Lami can be caused by mechanical trauma (eg, trotting a lot on hard ground), lush pasture, stress, Cushings, toxins and insulin resistance and has three 'stages'; founder, rotation (of the pedal bone; can lead to sinking if not treated correctly) and sinking (of the pedal bone - CAN be cured with aggressive, long lasting and time consuming treatment, but survival rate not as successful) - our girl had rotation mildly in both front feet, but our wonderful farrier has managed to reverse the effects.
No need to feel embarrassed by not knowing about it...its experience that teaches us after all.
I hope you've caught it early and things improve for you!! :)
K x
 
Last edited:
I am by no means an expert but do have a lam prone ned. I think you are doing the right thing taking him of grass but please remember it may not be lami at all? FWIW my boy has warm feet all the time... as I am not an expert I can only compare him to my others, who's feet feel cooler. This does not make him lame, fortunately for me he has a very large crest & this has been the best indicator for him. when it starts to fill, ie get more solid & less flacid I restrict grazing to a small patch around 1 field shelter( mine are out 24/7 so no stable to pop him in) I am as I very lucky that this has proved the most effective management for him over the 6 years that we have had him!
Sometimes even the vets cannot be conclusive, but I echo others when they say there have been alot of lami cases this year. I think if in doubt keep him of the grass, soak hay & feed a lami approved feed.
Hopefully the vet can throw some light on it, sounds like if it is lami its mild? Hope you get to the bottom of it XXX
 
KellysHeroes said:
If it IS lami you might have caught it early if the pulse is very mild - is he showing the typical stance? (when you said earlier he was resting his front feet, is he leant back on them slightly?) A slightly increased temp is also another sign of it.
Our girl has Cushings and kept getting lami because of it - she was and still is treated like a strict lami pony - restricted muzzled grazing, double netted soaked 'old' hay (not freshly cut), low sugar feed, regular exercise, regular trimmings on feet; even if she never has lami again, she will always be managed like this.
If he is going onto a shavings bed, that's the best for it, just make it quite deep for him.
Generally, when Kelly came down with lami, the vet would come out, say box rest, give her bute and tape pads onto her feet to support her.
Lami can be caused by mechanical trauma (eg, trotting a lot on hard ground), lush pasture, stress, Cushings, toxins and insulin resistance and has three 'stages'; founder, rotation (of the pedal bone; can lead to sinking if not treated correctly) and sinking (of the pedal bone - CAN be cured with aggressive, long lasting and time consuming treatment, but survival rate not as successful) - our girl had rotation mildly in both front feet, but our wonderful farrier has managed to reverse the effects.
No need to feel embarrassed by not knowing about it...its experience that teaches us after all.
I hope you've caught it early and things improve for you!! :)
K x
Click to expand...

No, he didn't appear to be leaning back at all, 3 feet were placed normally (as if stood sleeping), with 1 foot stuck out infront of him. Haven't seen him lying down either. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that the vet can come out tomorrow. Glad to hear that your mare is doing well after lami :)
Thank you :)
 
liveryblues said:
I am by no means an expert but do have a lam prone ned. I think you are doing the right thing taking him of grass but please remember it may not be lami at all? FWIW my boy has warm feet all the time... as I am not an expert I can only compare him to my others, who's feet feel cooler. This does not make him lame, fortunately for me he has a very large crest & this has been the best indicator for him. when it starts to fill, ie get more solid & less flacid I restrict grazing to a small patch around 1 field shelter( mine are out 24/7 so no stable to pop him in) I am as I very lucky that this has proved the most effective management for him over the 6 years that we have had him!
Sometimes even the vets cannot be conclusive, but I echo others when they say there have been alot of lami cases this year. I think if in doubt keep him of the grass, soak hay & feed a lami approved feed.
Hopefully the vet can throw some light on it, sounds like if it is lami its mild? Hope you get to the bottom of it XXX
Click to expand...

Thanks, I'm still hoping that it isn't, but i'm going to remain on the cautious side until I know otherwise!! Unfortunately I don't know how quickly it progresses or anything so am feeling very nervous about it still, busy reading up as much as I can :/
 
I think you have done everything you can do at the moment, if he is no worse in the morning then I doubt it would escalate to severe lami. from what I remember of a mare who was lami prone on our yard (put out on frozen grass & found pottering within 2 hours) she was very lame in quite a short space of time, ie even more lame & rocking back on her heels by the evening. I guess like humans they all react slightly differently.
Is it possible he has bruised his foot and maybe slightly tender thus resting it?
 
liveryblues said:
I think you have done everything you can do at the moment, if he is no worse in the morning then I doubt it would escalate to severe lami. from what I remember of a mare who was lami prone on our yard (put out on frozen grass & found pottering within 2 hours) she was very lame in quite a short space of time, ie even more lame & rocking back on her heels by the evening. I guess like humans they all react slightly differently.
Is it possible he has bruised his foot and maybe slightly tender thus resting it?
Click to expand...

Its alternate feet, not just one. Rests the left... then a while later will be resting the right. (maybe he just isn't co-ordinated enough to do both at once :rolleyes:) so I don't think he's just bruised them :/
So worried, dont think I will sleep much tonight.
 
only time I've known a horse to be pointing a front hoof like you describe was 1 that was diagnosed with navicular.
Really hope it's nothing serious and all goes well with the vet tomorrow. keep my fingers crossed for you :) x
 
Well fingers crossed for you & him, if he seems perfectly comfortable in the stable ie moving around without any trouble then I would hope you dont have to much to be worried about.
No good trying to re assure you, as I know most of us would be having a restless night faced with the same... do let us know how it goes xxx
 
Sol said:
Its alternate feet, not just one. Rests the left... then a while later will be resting the right. (maybe he just isn't co-ordinated enough to do both at once :rolleyes:) so I don't think he's just bruised them :/
So worried, dont think I will sleep much tonight.
Click to expand...

Alternating feet was always a sign for us. All horses are different in how quick they come down with it - but it deff won't go from the level you're describing to severe (rotation/sinking) overnight - it does sound like you have caught it early, but you're doing everything right and everything you can do!
Try not to worry too much (I know its hard) I doubt much will change by morning, especially as he seems comfortable now and by then, the vet will be out to him :)
K x
 
Last edited:
Sol said:
Its alternate feet, not just one. Rests the left... then a while later will be resting the right. (maybe he just isn't co-ordinated enough to do both at once :rolleyes:) so I don't think he's just bruised them :/
So worried, dont think I will sleep much tonight.
Click to expand...


By the time they get to the typical stance bit, it's serious. Also when they are shifting weight from one foot to another in a rocking motion, its serious.

Remember that the foot issue is only a symptom of laminitus, its normally a reaction to too much sugar in his system.

I see you have him on soaked hay, which is excellent, never restrict forage ad lib is best. Drop all hard feeds, even if it says laminitus approved, its poison and will impead recovery and prolong the illness.

He will need a balancer for vits and mins though.

Make sure that there is plenty of water available.

Ideally you need to purge his system, if its comfortable to walk him do it.

Hope all goes well tomorrow.
 
Pale Rider said:
By the time they get to the typical stance bit, it's serious. Also when they are shifting weight from one foot to another in a rocking motion, its serious.

Remember that the foot issue is only a symptom of laminitus, its normally a reaction to too much sugar in his system.

I see you have him on soaked hay, which is excellent, never restrict forage ad lib is best. Drop all hard feeds, even if it says laminitus approved, its poison and will impead recovery and prolong the illness.

He will need a balancer for vits and mins though.

Make sure that there is plenty of water available.

Ideally you need to purge his system, if its comfortable to walk him do it.

Hope all goes well tomorrow.
Click to expand...

He's not in that stance all of the time, in fact he's mostly been stood around perfectly normally, and the shift in weight from resting 1 foot to the other is... I don't know, the least it could have been is 30mins? ie. he'd be stood resting left foot, then go & graze, then go 'sleep' again resting the right foot.

He normally has a cup of top spec comprehensive balancer - that ok? or does it have to be a powdered balancer rather than a pellet one? He has ad lib hay & plenty of water.

Thanks
 
Sol said:
He's not in that stance all of the time, in fact he's mostly been stood around perfectly normally, and the shift in weight from resting 1 foot to the other is... I don't know, the least it could have been is 30mins? ie. he'd be stood resting left foot, then go & graze, then go 'sleep' again resting the right foot.

He normally has a cup of top spec comprehensive balancer - that ok? or does it have to be a powdered balancer rather than a pellet one? He has ad lib hay & plenty of water.

Thanks
Click to expand...

Its a rocking motion you need to worry about, yours sounds ok.

Balancer sounds ok. Its just ensuring he has no sugar or cereals.

Regards.
 
Treat as for laminitis - it won't do any harm but might save his life. Log on to yahoo groups 'themetabolichorse' and start equipping yourself with the knowledge :)

It often presents as a vague footiness, where the gait is less free than usual on hard surfaces. If you turn a tight circle on concrete, the horse will show obvious difficulty and reluctance to step bravely with the forelegs and usually swivels on the hinds. Don't wait til Monday to get the vet!
 
Last edited:
Vet is coming at approx lunch time. I just want to sit down & cry at the min! Feel useless & like everything is going wrong :( If it isn't lami I will feel very stupid (and a waste of emergency vets time) but then, what else can I do? He seems alert & happy again this morning but still, to me, looks uncomfortable on his front feet...
I'm going to dash to the new yard now and put a good bed down for him, then will return for the vet :/ Can't really do much else :(
 
Sol said:
Its alternate feet, not just one. Rests the left... then a while later will be resting the right. (maybe he just isn't co-ordinated enough to do both at once :rolleyes:) so I don't think he's just bruised them :/
So worried, dont think I will sleep much tonight.
Click to expand...
'Trutching' (I think that's the word), shifting weight from one foot to another or sort of very slow pacing on the spot, is a sign of laminitis I believe.
Getting him in on soaked (min one hour) and rinsed hay with no hard feed will not do any harm and may be the best move until the vet has seen him.
Good luck for tomorrow and hope the Vet has the answer to his problem. Don't beat yourself up, you are taking action which is the main thing. Ruling out laminitis is a good decision imo.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I hope everything goes well for you and he hasn't got laminitis, but if he has you haven't intentionally caused this for him so its not your fault. It can be a very tricky diesease to treat and manage. My pony is lami prone and I did not realise that fertiliser can cause lami (this was many years ago now) even on restricted grazing. But since then he is kept on an unfertilised restricted paddock and is fed safe and sound and we havent had a problem since. My mare has recently been diagnosed with cushings from a laminitis attack. Hers was sudden and happened overnight when she was stabled 24/7 and wasn't on a high sugar diet so sometimes there is nothing you can do but just be vigilant for your horses typical signs rather then the dieseases typical signs as in my mare you can never feel the digital pulse even when she was at her worst due to her leg confo and my pony doesn't get hot feet!

I wish you all the luck xx
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top